I just can't do it

[redduck]

there's a difference between being fi able to re and ready to fire

+1

hey, just because you can, doesn't mean you should, and it doesn't mean you have to.

+1

 

[O2Bfree]

Maybe start shifting how you feel about RE to how your wife feels about you still working. Did you two have plans that you're putting on hold? Time's a'ticking away and you'll never get it back!

 

[firewhen]

So much good advice here--thanks everyone!
I think I am one bad thing any from leaving. Silly I guess, I should be able to leave on my own, and not need an external factor to motivate me to go.
On a certain level, I like what I do, I am good at it and well-respected. But like all Megacorps, do more with less and there is a certain amount of tension, late nights and pressure. Those 3 things are what bother me the most, and I say to myself I am too old and rich for this. It does help that I know I am not dependent on the job, that definitely takes the edge off. Like what some of you have said, at some point I will have had enough and that will be it. Still most would have walked years ago, at least those on this board. We will see...

 

[ocean view]

I like what I do, I am good at it and well-respected. But like all Megacorps, do more with less and there is a certain amount of tension, late nights and pressure....

This was me. I knew I would miss the work itself, so I contacted my favorite nonprofit and now volunteer once a week. I’m over qualified for most of the projects they give me, but that means no stress, it’s easy and they so appreciate my contributions. The best parts are 1-no meetings, 2-no take home work & 3- the flexibility. If I have any conflicts they have no issue with taking time off.

Would your skill set translate to a volunteer gig?

btw, they started me at 2 hours a week, at my request I’m now up to 6 hours, so you can make it as large or as small a commitment as you would like.

 

[Winemaker]

No need to apologize for your 'decisionless decision' to keep working. If you enjoy it, and it isn't preventing you from pursuing other activities that you'd enjoy more (cf. post #9 by RAE), you might as well keep at it.

FWIW, I retired over five years ago and don't miss work one bit. But we are all different, and I don't believe that anyone hesitating about retirement needs therapy.

+1

I'm almost at 4 years and totally agree.

An as an aside, a member of our winemakers club passed unexpectedly this weekend at 59.

 

[stedmakr]

There are a bunch of good replies above. I'd suggest continued introspection and address what you are going to do in retirement. What is your plan? Does your plan lead to more happiness than you are experiencing now? Does your plan lead to a meaningful/purposeful retirement? I think you would want to know or at least have a sense for the answers to these questions.

Much to consider.

 

[O2Bfree]

An as an aside, a member of our winemakers club passed unexpectedly this weekend at 59.

We've had a few friends in their mid 60s pass rather unexpectedly as well, just a couple years into retirement. At least they had a couple years, I guess.

 

[urn2bfree]

These are 3 key questions to answer - (abstracted from the book The Number)*

1) If you won the lottery or any other huge sum of money such that money was never a concern, what would you want to do with the rest of your life?

2) Same condition as #1- but now add this to your thinking- a doctor tells you that you have an incurable, untreatable, but painless disease from which you will die some time suddenly between 5-10 years from now. Now what do you want to do with that time?

3) Same money as #1, same disease as #2 with the slight change that you are dying in a week. Looking at your situation, what are you most sorry you are missing out on?

*mini book review- lots of extraneous garbage and repetition wrapped around the above, insightful 3 questions. I have found that many of these types of books seem like a lot of padding and repetition. This is no exception.

 

[Nomad4hire]

Joined this group about a dozen years ago. In that time our portfolio has more than doubled and obviously there is now that much less time to support ourselves in retirement. You can look at my past posts, but in a nutshell:

mid 50's 1 earner family no pension or retirement benefits/health insurance
but we have lived frugally and have a 1% SWR (maybe 1.5% if I push it) even paying for health insurance and taxes

So why am I still doing this? I am starting to think it is a sickness.
Work is not that bad and knowing that I COULD leave at any time helps take the edge off.

I had come up with a date in 2020 for stupid reasons but I guess that is something.

I suppose it cannot be that bad or I would stop but even writing this I am kind of scared. But also disappointed at myself for being such a baby. Even got my wife on board and she now asks why I am still working.

Were there others who were stuck and how did they get past it?

+1. Same place exactly!

 

[HI Bill]

Sometimes, the fear is of change, sometimes, the fear is of the unknown. We are creatures of habit. Maybe you need to have something to retire 'to'? My mom worked until the principal literally kicked her out of the classroom (she had gone to part-time years earlier, and when her teaching partner died mid-school year, she started teaching full time without authorization), as she had few friends, and no regular hobbies. At 1%, you're 'golden' from a safe perspective, but I wonder if you'll be able to spend more money after living a lifetime of frugality? I know I could switch from beer to champagne and a Toyota to a Ferrari with no problem...!

 

[tb001]

I think you need to think very hard about what’s important to you and why you’re not pulling the plug. The questions posted by urn2nfree may be a good place to start, but I also think talking to a therapist could be helpful. Writing a 25k check to health insurance as a reason for not leaving isn’t a rational reason given your financial situation. Given that, I think it’s helpful to better understand the *real* reasons you’re still there. If you’re really getting something of value out of staying, whether that value is monetary or mental, then it may totally make sense to stay. But your post makes me question whether you’re possibly staying out of habit/inertia or fear. If the latter is the case, I would want to, at the very least, be mindful of that in my decision making process. It’s easy to lose years of your life that way.

 

[medved]

To the OP: If it makes you feel any better (and even if it does not), you are certainly not alone. I am in very much the same position as you. I have enough money to retire and live well but for whatever reason I cannot seem to do it.

Maybe that is a fear of the substantial life change. Maybe it is uncertainty about exactly what I would do with my time. I have some ideas about that, but work has been so all-consuming that I have not really pursued my interests much. Maybe I wonder about the impact retirement will have on my marriage. Maybe a (larger than I would like) part of my sense of self-worth is tied up in my work, professional stature, etc. Maybe it is a fear that, in an absolute worst case scenario, I might not have enough money -- though every one of the predictor tools shows 99%+ chance of success. Maybe it is a fear of taking a step and then regretting it. (I have a bad habit of regret). I really don't know.

My job pays very well, so the impulse to do it for "just another year or two" is pretty strong. On the other hand, the job is stressful and demanding, and I have been working very hard for nearly 30 years. And my dad died young, so I am keenly aware of that risk.

My way to deal with all this has been to pick an arbitrary date and say I will retire on that date. That date is 12/31/2020. Having this date makes work somewhat easier for me.

 

[kgtest]

+1 with the part time work option....

or even take a nap every now and than.... (boss did not complain since I got everything done).... was finally let go and then did some temp work and did some of it part time...

Your legal first name isn't Mike is it? I'll never forget that guy, we are on a conference call with 32 people, it was a multi-hour conference phone call...

All of a sudden...snort...

A few chuckles from some of the 32 that weren't muted...

Then snort snort, zzzzz.

Someone chimes in 'Could you please mute the line?"

zzzz, snort snore snore snort zzzzzz.

People called him, texted him, apparently there was no way to mute the line on him and nobody could get his attention to wake him.


I wanted to give the "Project Manager" a medal of honor for conducting what ended up being another entire hour of the meeting....while ' Mike from Texas" continued to snore.

There were some military top brass on that call too.

If you find you are unintentionally sleeping on the job, perhaps it is time lol.


To the OP, my ole man was a workaholic. I watched him recover from a gnarly motorcycle accident where he high-sided the bike in a corner after hitting some sand. He almost died that day, but recovered enough to "walk the floors" again one more time.

If I could have made the decision for my father, I would have told him to stay home and retire after the accident, after all he was definitely two comma club at that point.

He went back, and was passed on an "Early retirement" package when he was 64. He finally wised up and milked the rest of his time. He ended with having both knee's replaced on their dime. Since ya know, he was not old enough to retire yet.

When that final dr note came back that he was all clear to return to work...he went in for a day, took the rest of the week off, and never went back.


He had a tough time the first few months and actually considered going back to work. He would always chat about the drama and BS as if he were still working there lol.

Fast forward, dad has finally just hit the one year mark of his retirement. He turns 66 this year in October. I asked him if he wanted to go back to work with the guys and his response...


"Hell no, I don't need to work another day in my life. "


I'm thinking you will feel the same once your time comes.



He does occasionally chat with a fellow engineer, but sometimes I think its to rub in his retirement lol. I wish he would've done it sooner. At least he's alive!

 

[24601NoMore]

To the OP: If it makes you feel any better (and even if it does not), you are certainly not alone. I am in very much the same position as you. I have enough money to retire and live well but for whatever reason I cannot seem to do it.

Maybe that is a fear of the substantial life change. Maybe it is uncertainty about exactly what I would do with my time. I have some ideas about that, but work has been so all-consuming that I have not really pursued my interests much. Maybe I wonder about the impact retirement will have on my marriage. Maybe a (larger than I would like) part of my sense of self-worth is tied up in my work, professional stature, etc. Maybe it is a fear that, in an absolute worst case scenario, I might not have enough money -- though every one of the predictor tools shows 99%+ chance of success. Maybe it is a fear of taking a step and then regretting it. (I have a bad habit of regret). I really don't know.

My job pays very well, so the impulse to do it for "just another year or two" is pretty strong. On the other hand, the job is stressful and demanding, and I have been working very hard for nearly 30 years.

Ditto - same here to both the OP and Medved. I could have written either post as I'm in the EXACT same situation. Mid 50s. FI. No pension. HC a huge concern even though I plan to COBRA for the full 18 months (better coverage and less deductible than ACA) that gets us to 56 and 62 respectively, assuming we both RE this Summer as we are thinking of doing..

I've worked on my plan to RE for years and the logical, scientific part of me knows with certainty that I CAN retire anytime I want (currently 54 1/2, DW 60 1/2). Yet, like OP and Medved, I can't quite seem to envision doing so - for many of the same reasons.

I've agonized over this as my j*b is extremely stressful (long story - won't bore you guys with the details but suffice it to say I should have left long ago). Yet, even though I've built up an income stream (dividends from funds, individual stocks and CDs) that will cover 3/4 or so of our yearly expenses at this point, I just can't seem to pull the trigger. That's not very logical since DW is ~5-6 years away from SS and I only need to cover 1/4 of our yearly expenses + HC for 5-6 years. That's mathematically "easy", especially if I manage AGI to get HC subsidies.

For me, I think there are a few issues..

- The money - we've always had professional level income..and the thought of going down to < 4X FPL to manage AGI for ACA is going to take some real getting used to. Fortunately, we have after-tax savings to pull from to live as we want, but then I'm pulling from a bucket that is not replenishing with new income coming in and that's somewhat terrifying. I'm also concerned that the Bull is long in the tooth and I could easily RE into a nasty Bear that decimates the value of my portfolio (on paper, I realize) right when I need to see those big #s on the spreadsheet to be psychologically comfortable with RE and our financial security.

- The money, part 2..we've always LBYM but the financial freedom that 2 professional incomes has provided will be REALLY hard to shift away from. It's very comforting to see savings and net worth increase every month, vs stay the same - or even go down..

- Fear of the unknown re: ACA & SS - even though my plan could survive changes to both, I haven't yet really determined what it would look like in terms of additional hits to the Portfolio. Need to work through that I suppose.

- Not sure what after RE looks like. I've thought about studying to be a fee-only CFP as I see huge demand that will only increase with baby boomers continuing to retire and am pretty confident I'd be good at it with a professional and Sales background, but the fear of changing careers mid 50s is somewhat holding me back on that also as I'm not sure there's "time" to complete everything and get established before I want to be TOTALLY done..

All this aside, I know 2 different people who died unexpectedly in their 50s this year. DW also had a near fatal heart attack 4 years ago (fine now). So that does add some much needed perspective and I think about this all alot..

Net net - it really does boil down to an emotional vs financial issue..at least for me and I suspect OP also.

Best of luck..I'm still trying to get up the nerve for both of us to RE this summer but suspect I'll still be at the j*b come end of year with all the same BS and stresses that come along with it.

 

[medved]

Retire Soon: Interesting post. I see from OP and your post there are a bunch of people struggling with the same set of conflicting thoughts that I am, more or less.

An added issue for me (which should be a non-issue, but still) is that, in my workplace -- where I have been for a long time -- almost nobody retires early. If I told people I was retiring at age 55, it would be a little bit like telling people that I am moving to Saturn or marrying a Ford Truck. It is just not done. Of course, that does not really matter; I should do what I want to do. But as we all know, cultural norms can be powerful.

 

[jcretire77]

I am thankful that I was able to retire early. My wife and I retired on the same day from the same company. We were not quite where we wanted to be financially, but the company was giving 16 weeks of severance each and our home and cars were paid off. Luckily the market has helped quell my worries. I know that can turn around.

Being retired I am able to help my mother with her increasing medical issues. Not so easy to do if I was still working.

 

[Francis]

Can't offer you any useful advice as I'm in the same boat as you. I'm financially secure yet stay in a job I despise. Tried and tried to figure out why I stay with no answers. I was close to leaving once and even submitted my resignation letter. But one thing lead to another and I ended up staying at work. That was 15 months ago. I still haven't broken free of the chains of work and it bothers me why I can't do it. I have even thought of seeking professional help as the years are passing me by. I will be 59 later this year and have about 80X expenses + pension of 26K/yr at 65 + great SS (which I plan to defer to 70). Sad isn't it. Just wanted you to know there are others who struggle with this decision too.

Francis

 

[24601NoMore]

Can't offer you any useful advice as I'm in the same boat as you. I'm financially secure yet stay in a job I despise. Tried and tried to figure out why I stay with no answers. I was close to leaving once and even submitted my resignation letter. But one thing lead to another and I ended up staying at work. That was 15 months ago. I still haven't broken free of the chains of work and it bothers me why I can't do it. I have even thought of seeking professional help as the years are passing me by. I will be 59 later this year and have about 80X expenses + pension of 26K/yr at 65 + great SS (which I plan to defer to 70). Sad isn't it. Just wanted you to know there are others who struggle with this decision too.

Francis

You have EIGHTY times expenses AND a pension? Good God - Retire IMMEDIATELY! Do not pass go. Do not collect $200 (not that you need it). All kidding aside - you could probably convert a good chunk of that to CDs and live the rest of your life off the interest without ever touching the principal. So, unless you are planning on leaving a bunch of that to your kids, your favorite charity, etc, or want to buy a BUNCH (and I mean a BUNCH) of nice shiny new toys and travel in retirement, I'd say you are way beyond good to go.

I lost 2 friends in their 50s this year to terminal diseases. DW had a near fatal heart attack several years ago. Life is precious and can end without notice. Go enjoy it while you still can.

And here I thought I was good at roughly half of that in expenses. (Guess I should heed my own advice, but I'm fearful of a nasty bear market decimating my portfolio right as I'm about to retire..)

Guess for many of us this decision is as much if not moreso psychology and emotion than it is raw numbers.

 

[Francis]

You have EIGHTY times expenses AND a pension? Good God - Retire IMMEDIATELY! Do not pass go. Do not collect $200 (not that you need it). All kidding aside - you could probably convert a good chunk of that to CDs and live the rest of your life off the interest without ever touching the principal. So, unless you are planning on leaving a bunch of that to your kids, your favorite charity, etc, or want to buy a BUNCH (and I mean a BUNCH) of nice shiny new toys and travel in retirement, I'd say you are way beyond good to go.

I lost 2 friends in their 50s this year to terminal diseases. DW had a near fatal heart attack several years ago. Life is precious and can end without notice. Go enjoy it while you still can.

And here I thought I was good at roughly half of that in expenses. (Guess I should heed my own advice, but I'm fearful of a nasty bear market decimating my portfolio right as I'm about to retire..)

Guess for many of us this decision is as much if not moreso psychology and emotion than it is raw numbers.

Yes about 80X but yearly expenses are not outrageous - maybe 45-48K. I keep an asset allocation of about 27% stocks and the rest in fixed income and some investment property. Of the fixed income 33% is in CD's. I would invest in CD's when I saw good deals like Penfed's 3% for 5 years, Sharonview's 4% 64 month Cd, etc).
If you are wary of a bear market did you consider lowering your stock allocation? If you already have enough why risk it? I agree that retiring is not just about having enough money to do so. You have to be mentally and emotionally ready too.

 

[CountryGal]

At megacorp the downsizing continued every month, with a few more from our department being laid off. I did a quick review of readiness to retire at 57, but could not pull the trigger, even though the pressure was tremendous. Finally gave up and put it in God's hands. Within 2 months I was given notice and 2 months later I was retired. As I waited I had panic attacks on how I would handle retirement. I also had a test result come back that required a biopsy. The first 3 months of retirement I lived with a cancer diagnosis and waited for surgery to remove it. Retirement was truly a blessing.

The months ahead in retirement were healing and recovery from surgery. About 6 months in I found out I had a Chronic Fatigue like illness that results from stress. It has been over 2 years and I am still working to get back to "normal"

Long story short.. I love retirement and have a better appreciation for LIFE. The diagnosis sharply shifted my thoughts on what was important in my life. I don't think about the technology or job I LOVED for 35 years. I don't keep up on the changes in the profession at all. My life would probably bore many, but I enjoy the slower pace and simple pleasures.

 

[spncity]

Thank zy

 

[Milton]

Long story short: I love retirement and have a better appreciation for LIFE. The diagnosis sharply shifted my thoughts on what was important in my life. I don't think about the technology or job I LOVED for 35 years. I don't keep up on the changes in the profession at all. My life would probably bore many, but I enjoy the slower pace and simple pleasures.

Good for you!

You might enjoy reading this book:

 

[Milton]

Can't offer you any useful advice as I'm in the same boat as you. I'm financially secure yet stay in a job I despise. Tried and tried to figure out why I stay with no answers. I was close to leaving once and even submitted my resignation letter. But one thing lead to another and I ended up staying at work. That was 15 months ago. I still haven't broken free of the chains of work and it bothers me why I can't do it. I have even thought of seeking professional help as the years are passing me by. I will be 59 later this year and have about 80X expenses + pension of 26K/yr at 65 + great SS (which I plan to defer to 70). Sad isn't it. Just wanted you to know there are others who struggle with this decision too.

Francis

Earlier in this thread, I suggest that the OP didn't really need therapy. In your case, I have a different opinion, as you've stated that you despise your job: a hugely important factor.

As you are FI, want to retire (you've been a member on this board for several years, and more to the point actually tendered your resignation at the end of 2016!), but are having difficulty "breaking free of the chains of work", I fully agree with your plan to seek professional assistance. Perhaps all you need is objective, fully informed input from a knowledgeable person to give you 'permission' to retire ... that would be worth paying for.