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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-22-2004, 02:00 PM   #41
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Re: Ayn Rand

Interesting fact for all the neocons and "objectivists" out there.

In this land plagued by overbearing government and the stifling of corporate initiative, 60% of the corporations pay no tax at all.

Another thing. If the government is crushing your "entre
prenurial" spirit, and taxing away your"hard earned" money, who the hell has been in control of congress and the white house?
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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-22-2004, 04:10 PM   #42
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Re: Ayn Rand

Gee, I really started something with this topic
Seriously, glad to see people posting. I may write
a mini-essay on "Who is John Galt?" Stay tuned...........

John Galt
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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-22-2004, 04:32 PM   #43
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Re: Ayn Rand


When you consider that this wonderful freedom to work longer hours is being extolled on an internet board dedicated to getting not partially but completely out of the workforce, you have to wonder if all that work has maybe damaged the American thinking apparatus.


Another way to consider the results of Prescott's analysis is it is the nature of the human species to control the level of "effort" (work) in relations to the reward and needs satisfaction gained. Maslow noted the same behavior in his hierarchary of needs conclusion.
The folks in the EU see little point in doing more effort (work) since there is not sufficent return (govt takes too high percentage on the margin via taxes) to offset what they give up by not working. Or alternatively, the govt returns too little back to the individual to justify a change of behavior by putting in more work.
The happiness article posted earlier pretty much was along the same lines. Happiness is increased almost on a 1:1 basis by increases in wealth to a point where you have enough resources to fully meet your primary needs. After that "satisfaction level", is achieved the additional ratio of return from more income to more happiness falls pretty quickly. Also keep in mind the "satisfaction level" is unique to each person. Perhaps we have so many choices in the US for adding to our perceived minimal need, we are more motivated to seek a higher level economic reward.
Another hypothesis is US workers put in more effort precisely because the govt is NOT there to hand out services and products.
For me, the aha, was the significant linkage undercovered in the analysis of the relationship between net return and effort by human capital and its direct impact on motivation.

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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-22-2004, 04:46 PM   #44
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Re: Ayn Rand

This is for Mikey. When I was in my prime, nobody
worked longer hours than I did. But, I never
resented it or thought "Oh poor me!". I could see the
results from my effort. Now, I have redirected my
focus mostly to non-income producing activity (loafing).
Where I was lucky is that I enjoyed most of my working
life and I am enjoying most of my non-working life.

John Galt
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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-25-2004, 06:57 AM   #45
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Re: Ayn Rand


Well, Why don't you tell us what you'd like to get rid of EXACTLY in government. Remember all of the above items were actually done by Corporations in our past.

They will do evil things if they can!

The GOP has talked about 'Government is the Problem' since Ronald Reagan, but has never outlined exactly what they want to get rid of. In fact I have seen more Government in the last 4 years than in my Lifetime.

Ah, you assume I'm a Republican

Here's a good start on where I think the government should go...

Hope you have a good week 8)

Enjoy your own life without comparing it with that of another. ~ Marquis de Condorcet
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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-25-2004, 03:34 PM   #46
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Re: Ayn Rand

Here's a good start on where I think the government should go... *
Well, I just spent two minutes at that site. Here's the first thing I read (their Social Security platform):

"Politicians in Washington are stealing your future. Every year, they take 12.4% of your income to prop up their failed Social Security system - a system that is heading toward bankruptcy. If you are an American earning the median income of $31,695 per year, and were given the option of investing that same amount of money in a stock mutual fund, you would retire a millionaire - without winning the lottery or a TV game show. That million dollars would provide you with a retirement income of over $100,000 per year...".

Right! I'm going to place my trust in a political party that believes everyone earning $32,000 per year, who can invest $3930 per year:
1) should invest 100% in stocks (they shouldn't)
2) is guaranteed to retire a millionaire (No way! Not in today's dollars - not even close!)
3) can live happily ever after on an SWR of more than 10% (outrageous!)

I can't recall ever seeing a higher level of demagoguery. I didn't read any further - that's all I needed to see.
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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-25-2004, 03:48 PM   #47
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Re: Ayn Rand

I can't recall ever seeing a higher level of demagoguery. I didn't read any further - that's all I needed to see.

You're a better man than me, I went to the site and saw Libertarian and that did it for me. I would have an easier time believing in Santa Claus.

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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-27-2004, 05:09 PM   #48
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Re: Ayn Rand

Some interesting discussions here. Some folks feel that the government disrupts their life while others feel that government has enhanced theirs...

Compared to what I've experienced, life in the USA is (relatively) good when compared to most other countries. Not to say that the US political/business system is the only one that works. (personally, I think Canada, and Canadians, are a great country and people)

I understand that folks are just letting their hair down and having a friendly grumble, but how many of us participate in the US political process (voting)? At the end of the day, we'll get the type of government we deserve.

I love to travel and experience other cultures, but I never let my US passport leave my hot little hand .


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Re: Ayn Rand
Old 10-27-2004, 06:04 PM   #49
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Re: Ayn Rand

Okay, I decided not to write my "essay" on this topic.
I'm too tired from fishing all day. Besides, Ayn wrote a lot of stuff, and she did it better than I could, so no
need to rehash. You either agree with her or you don't.
I will say this. 'Atlas Shrugged' is not an easy read.
If not for the underlying political/philosophical message
I would not have waded through it 10+ times. BTW,
in case anyone thinks this is overdoing it, I have met people who have read it many more times than I.

John Galt
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