Cedar Fence Construction Tips

[TromboneAl]

I'm going to put up a cedar fence like this:

I could save myself time if I put the posts 16 feet apart. Would that be pushing it? The only potential problem I see is the wind pushing it over in a storm (??)

 

[calmloki]

Our eight foot cedar panels sag - 16? both sag and wow

 

[REWahoo]

I don't think you'd be happy with anything over 8ft. It would be very flimsy and have serious problems with sag.

 

[Music Lover]

I've built several fences. Don't go over 8 feet or you can guarantee it will sag. In fact, with a 16' spacing it will probably sag even before you're done building it.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Now that's funny, T-Al.

 

[MRG]

Al,
I agree don't go 16'; save time by renting a gas post hole digger, air nail gun or whatever tools you're missing to speed the job up.

 

[heeyy_joe]

A few well placed rocks and you're good to go.

 

[Music Lover]

Choose your battles. I hate digging holes...buy the posts, mark their locations, and then hire someone to dig the holes and set them. After that's done, it's quick and easy.

 

[pb4uski]

It is easier and cheaper to do it right rather than do it over.

There is a fine line between frugal and cheap and you are crossing it.

Hire someone to drill the post holes.

 

[Telly]

um... I can't imagine 16' !

I use 7' post spacing to minimize rail sag over time, and for wind survivability.

4x4 posts should be rated for ground contact (.40 preservative).

For a 6' high fence, I set posts 30" deep. For an 8' high fence, at least 36" deep.

Some developer around here put up 8' tall fences using landscape timbers for posts (!), and they were set maybe 18" deep, maximum. They looked nice for first-time home buyers. And then blew down in the first high-wind storm after a few days of rain that saturated the ground.

 

[pb4uski]

For a deck and pool shed that we had at our old house what we did is we dug a hole, put a flat stone at the bottom of the hole and then had the "post" be a section of Sch-40 PVC pipe from the bottom of the hole to ground level and a 4x4 PT post inside of the PVC pipe that extended above the ground to the desired height. The PVC acted as a sleeve.

While we did it so any ground frost would grab and heave the sleeve rather than the post, I wonder if it would also cause the PT post to last longer and mitigate rot since it would be contacting the PVC sleeve rather than soil. It seemed to work quite well in avoiding the posts moving up and down from frost but we were not there long enough for me to know if it also kept the post from rotting.

 

[ArkTinkerer]

We have a high water table in the area. Wooden posts tend to rot and break at ground level.

I've seen wood fences with metal posts. They make a clamp strip designed for this now so you can use the metal posts used on the chain link fences. I'm planning on doing this as we rebuild our fences around the house and on any future rental houses.

 

[TromboneAl]

Thanks. Will go 8' & 3' deep. The whole fence will only be about 20' long.

 

[LoneAspen]

I had an over 400 foot cedar dog-ear fence built in the mid 90's, including three man gates, and a big double-door gate to drive a car through. I was going to do it all by myself.

But then I wised up.

I marked where I wanted it to go, and hired somebody to come drill the holes. Ended up going 7 feet apart instead of 8, just to guarantee we wouldn't have problems with 8 foot boards not being quite long enough. I heard enough horror stories from other people who had built fences with posts 8 feet apart, and because of imperfections in measuring, some ended up being a little over 8 feet apart, and they had to buy longer lumber (and more expensive) to run some of the boards.

Then I wised up even more, and had a fence company come out and build it. Cost about $7000, but well worth it - they did a quality job.

The only part I tackled myself was spraying it with sealant, which was a requirement in the high altitude of Colorado. I enlisted a couple friends as volunteers, and we spent the better part of two weekends applying about 2 or 3 coats to both sides.

If I'd been a litter wiser, I would have hired that out, too. Talk about a nasty disgusting job. That sealant was a mess, and we couldn't help but get it on us as we were working. Ruined a set of clothes, and just a messy job. I'd never do it again. A few years later when I had to reapply, I hired that out.

But the fence came out great - I wouldn't hesitate to build another cedar dog-eared fence around a property. But I wouldn't attempt to do any of the work myself anymore, except to lay out where I wanted it to go.

 

[MBAustin]

Slightly off-topic but since we seem to have some experienced fencers here: how do you work with adjoining (fence-sharing) neighbors when said fence needs to be replaced? 90% of our fence is shared with 2 neighbors (we are on a corner lot).

 

[ERD50]

Now that's funny, T-Al.

He should tweet it!

Thanks. Will go 8' & 3' deep. The whole fence will only be about 20' long.

Huh?

A 20' fence and you are asking about 16' spacing? Wouldn't a middle post put you at 10' spacing? And one additional post, (4 versus 3) gets you to 7.333' spacing. Why scrimp for one post?

What happened to the 'I want to spend more money T-Al'? Used vacuum cleaners, skimpy fences? Open the wallet!

-ERD50

 

[pb4uski]

Good point TP. At 20' one would need 3 posts with a 16' spacing so just make it 10' spacing and declare victory. 3 posts either way.

In the OP Al indicated that putting the posts 16' apart would save time. Is T-Al losing it? Lena better check his bike helmet for cracks.

Just pulling your chain Al.

 

[M Paquette]

Slightly off-topic but since we seem to have some experienced fencers here: how do you work with adjoining (fence-sharing) neighbors when said fence needs to be replaced? 90% of our fence is shared with 2 neighbors (we are on a corner lot).

If the neighbors are all agreeable, you just split the costs and put the fence on the property line. If one of the neighbors is, well, less than agreeable, you put the fence entirely on your side of the property line and pay for it all yourself, selecting a fence design that you can repair/replace boards from your side without trespassing.

"Fence law" is an entire legal specialty.

When in doubt, consult a lawyer specializing in this stuff. Really.

 

[pb4uski]

If the neighbors are all agreeable, you just split the costs and put the fence on the property line. If one of the neighbors is, well, less than agreeable, you put the fence entirely on your side of the property line and pay for it all yourself, selecting a fence design that you can repair/replace boards from your side without trespassing.

"Fence law" is an entire legal specialty.

When in doubt, consult a lawyer specializing in this stuff. Really.

+1 and if your neighbor is a jerk, paint the side of the boards facing their side an obnoxious color before installing. Bright pink? Bright orange?

 

[bld999]

2' deep is usually fine as a hole depth. That 3rd foot can be easily worth double the time to dig as the first two. I usu. hillbilly it and pour dry concrete mix directly into the posthole with the post in already. Then it is easy to plumb and line the post. Then add plenty of water on top of the mix and wet the adjacent soil completely. This all assumes a neat and sound hole, so it wouldn't work in loose or sandy soils.

 

[Music Lover]

Thanks. Will go 8' & 3' deep. The whole fence will only be about 20' long.

Posts normally come in 2' increments...6', 8', 10', 12'. If you're building a 6' fence, you may as well dig a 4' hole instead of cutting a foot off each post. At 4' you can virtually guarantee that it will stay straight for years to come.

Also, set them in gravel...posts set in gravel will never rot. Posts set in concrete will eventually rot as concrete wicks moisture.

 

[MBAustin]

If the neighbors are all agreeable, you just split the costs and put the fence on the property line. If one of the neighbors is, well, less than agreeable, you put the fence entirely on your side of the property line and pay for it all yourself, selecting a fence design that you can repair/replace boards from your side without trespassing.

"Fence law" is an entire legal specialty.

When in doubt, consult a lawyer specializing in this stuff. Really.

Thanks for the tip. They are reasonable about everything else, so hopefully the trend will continue.

+1 and if your neighbor is a jerk, paint the side of the boards facing their side an obnoxious color before installing. Bright pink? Bright orange?

The neighbor behind us has a 5 year old daughter who would probably be thrilled with a bright pink fence in her backyard, so I'll be sure to mention it when she is around. Not.

 

[TromboneAl]

It's going well.

Two other questions: How many screws would you recommend for attaching the 2x4s to the 4x4s? And how many for the cedar planks?

Here it is so far. Yes, it's a tall fence.

I'm building it to hide the studio that the new neighbor is going to build in his yard. They bought the house, then realized it was too small, and we have to pay for their mistake.