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Old 03-20-2015, 11:48 AM   #161
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I always told DS that school was his job. If your son was in medical school (1st 2 years with 32 hrs in class per week and double that time studying) and the next 2 years at the hospital all day then studying) would you expect him to also work?


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Before they can get into medical school they have to get a regular college degree... my nephew who has just finished medical school WAS working when he was getting his first degree... he also had time to be on the university's bike racing team when he was in medical school... I do not know what else he did.... but he is even better than my DS... very unusual young man that we are all proud of...

So, yes, I would expect that when DS is not going to school that he work... maybe my expectations are high.... but, when I got my undergrad degree I took 17 credit hours going M-W-F and worked on T-Th-S most all the time.... I did not cut back until my senior year when I took out some loans....
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Old 03-20-2015, 02:40 PM   #162
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... my nephew who has just finished medical school WAS working when he was getting his first degree... he also had time to be on the university's bike racing team when he was in medical school... I do not know what else he did.... but he is even better than my DS... very unusual young man that we are all proud of...
...
Is your nephew really "even better" than your son? I bet not (based on the info that you've given).
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Old 03-20-2015, 04:23 PM   #163
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I have plans of moving to a larger house in the next 5 years or so, but I'm starting to think it might not be a bad idea to just stay where I am. At least in my current house, it's not big enough to have anyone else move in.
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Even if you are in an RV, when people are desperate, they will move in with you. Need something smaller, like a van down by the river, or by the bay.
I just now recall reading a blog of two women sharing a van, living in it. Once when they were at a Walmart, another woman asked them for money. They pointed to the van, and said that it was their home.

The beggar was incredulous "You both live in that?", and left them alone.
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Old 03-20-2015, 04:56 PM   #164
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Is your nephew really "even better" than your son? I bet not (based on the info that you've given).
Actually yes... he was a state champion as a high school wrestler... he was a track star... he averaged over 200 yards rushing on his football team and he also was one of the top students (even though it was a very small school)... scored high on his medical test... sisters said in the top 10%... also, sister and husband were very poor... so he had it much harder than my son...

I have a niece from a different sister who scored 1590 on the SAT.... twice... (she wanted a perfect score)....

We will see how DS scores.... I think he will be pretty high, but there is competition with some of the nephews and nieces... DS really does not know much about the one who was lazy and lives in Australia... has never met him, so can only talk about how not to turn out like him...

Do not get me wrong... I am really proud of DS.... he is a top student and will do just fine... I just wished he was a bit more interested in some other activities....
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Old 03-20-2015, 05:53 PM   #165
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Do not get me wrong... I am really proud of DS.... he is a top student and will do just fine... I just wished he was a bit more interested in some other activities....
Count your blessings. Most parents would envy you. DS must be a fine young man.
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Old 03-20-2015, 06:02 PM   #166
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Don't get me wrong.... I am thrilled at what he is accomplishing.... but I also think he is missing out on some parts of life that you need to experience to learn.... he (and DW) just do not understand that some kids do not have cars they can drive (starting at 16 no less).... that they have to do chores around the house... that they have to learn some life skills that you do not learn in school....


If they do not go to visit grandma this summer, I will push for him getting a job... but DW's grandma is having some health issues so I think they will be going....
Texas Proud, he sounds like a good one. I understand your desire to want him to get other messages of life. College is not too late. Colleges have lots of part time jobs that are available within a students academic schedule, even tutoring.
Most of ours had "summer jobs". The academic year was just too pack with school work and sports.
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Old 03-20-2015, 06:47 PM   #167
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Count your blessings. Most parents would envy you. DS must be a fine young man.
+1. He sounds like a young man any parent would be proud of and not the least bit disappointed in.
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Old 03-20-2015, 09:54 PM   #168
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Count your blessings. Most parents would envy you. DS must be a fine young man.
I do.... and he is...

I know he will be very successful in life...
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Old 03-21-2015, 08:04 PM   #169
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So what are some examples of these rules that adult kids don't like? I can't see that a curfew makes any sense. Limiting guests, over night or otherwise? I can see that as reasonable, but easily worked-around. "Making" them do chores? When DD is home on college breaks, we hardly see her; she tends to stay in her room, or be gone with friends. I just can't think of logical and reasonable rules that would make living here unpleasant. If the rules seem arbitrary, it would just cause friction, and I don't think that stressing the relationship is a good way to motivate the move out. So although I don't currently have this problem, it would be interesting to hear some ideas for house rules.
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Old 03-21-2015, 08:16 PM   #170
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Personally I think it depends on a lot of variables. Preparing them for being on their own can mean different things depending on your goal. For example, if you don't mind them living at home, just ensuring some very basics may do. Such as: must have a job, pay for or at least consider them paying for "rent", food, healthcare premiums, etc.
If the kid is a clean, responsible, and one with no late night frat parties, few rules may be needed. The most important thing would be to make sure when they transition back home they don't assume role of child and parent as caregiver.
And I am no expert either and fell into the "parent trap" this weekend. 22 year old college student came home to visit and hadn't done her taxes. "Making her do her taxes" consisted me just finally saying, "Just leave and I will take care of it". She had no interest in learning..... 3rd year in a row!


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Old 03-21-2015, 08:34 PM   #171
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Home from college on break hardly makes sense with house rules. We do exactly the same with DS as you do. Not much need or enforcement.

Simple things like after dinner cleanup, cleaning his own bathroom are pretty easy requests. Letting us know if he's going to be out very late is appreciated. He never brings people home since his friends are now elsewhere, so that is not an issue. Vacuuming his room and helping with laundry is much easier to request from someone living on his own for a few years.

He mowed our lawn summers and has been paid for it. Helping with meal prep isn't a house rule, but framing it with preparation for independent living was a win-win. Unfortunately he wanted to learn how to cook steak and ribs the most ($$$$).

FYI, when in high school and college, my sister and I frequently stayed out very late with friends (2-3 AM on Saturdays was not uncommon) but our parents knew we behaved better than they did. They were alcoholics and were asleep before we got home. My sister and I knew how to sneak in and out undetected. We did the dishes, helped with yard work and were both first in our class so we made sure they had nothing to complain about and did whatever we pleased.


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Old 03-21-2015, 08:39 PM   #172
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Personally I think it depends on a lot of variables. Preparing them for being on their own can mean different things depending on your goal. For example, if you don't mind them living at home, just ensuring some very basics may do. Such as: must have a job, pay for or at least consider them paying for "rent", food, healthcare premiums, etc.
If the kid is a clean, responsible, and one with no late night frat parties, few rules may be needed. The most important thing would be to make sure when they transition back home they don't assume role of child and parent as caregiver.
And I am no expert either and fell into the "parent trap" this weekend. 22 year old college student came home to visit and hadn't done her taxes. "Making her do her taxes" consisted me just finally saying, "Just leave and I will take care of it". She had no interest in learning..... 3rd year in a row!


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I helped DS with his taxes. Told him to do it, then I would check for mistakes. He made one dumb mistake, so printed another form then he redid it. No enabling or doing for him. He did it all. Both of us were relieved when it was done.


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Old 03-21-2015, 08:44 PM   #173
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I helped DS with his taxes. Told him to do it, then I would check for mistakes. He made one dumb mistake, so printed another form then he redid it. No enabling or doing for him. He did it all. Both of us were relieved when it was done.


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I made the mistake of starting with the pen in my hand and she exploited it. Lesson learned!


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Old 03-21-2015, 08:47 PM   #174
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Thankfully, that's where I'm at with my kids...both excelled in school, so I let them do whatever they wanted, within reason. I did occasionally remind them that they got this freedom because they were responsibly taking care of business.

I think have a job or be looking for one is a good rule, and that would help being moved out and staying home more similar.

I did my older daughter's taxes...so simple and easy, but now that she's on her own, she's had to learn it on her own.
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Old 03-21-2015, 10:44 PM   #175
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Sengsational - the rules that were imposed are me were:

- reasonable bed time and curfews... no going clubbing on a weeknight.
- Letting parents know where I was going and who with.
- Chores - not just keeping my own room clean - but participating in the rest of the household chores like meal prep & cleanup, vacuuming, lawn mowing.
- no overnight guests and definitely no overnights at a boyfriend's house.
- this was back in the old days - so tv viewing, stereo use, etc were limited to the shared household tv/stereo - and consideration had to be used. So for me to listen to my records (yep - this was back in the vinyl days) I had limited times when it wouldn't impact my parents. For some reason they didn't like my choice of music. LOL.

Nothing outrageous - but it was enough I wanted to move out.
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Old 03-22-2015, 10:47 AM   #176
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So what are some examples of these rules that adult kids don't like?
After his first semester of college, our oldest son decided not to go back. At first, he was going to stay at home (he had a part-time job and was going to find a full-time job) for a time. We were going to charge him something to cover the cost of him being there. Anyway, he didn't want to follow the rules and quickly moved out. The main ones:

1. He needed to let us know when he would be home. He didn't have a curfew, but if he went out I wanted to know if he would be home at midnight or 4 AM. He could change this during the evening but needed to contact one of us in some way that he knew we knew about it (ie call us if we didn't respond to a text which we wouldn't always see). He couldn't understand why we wanted to know when he would be home. I worried though if he was out in the middle of the night and I had no idea when to expect him home.

2. He couldn't be away from the house for more than two nights without talking to us first. The reason for this was that he did have chores to do around the house (as did all of us) and he tended to go and stay with friends for 3 or 4 days without doing his chores before leaving and so someone else would have to do them. By knowing in advance he was going somewhere I could insist he do them before leaving.

3. He couldn't have a friend over for more than one night without talking to us first. (There weren't girlfriends, just a friend staying over). Same reason as above. When he had a friend over, he wouldn't do his chores while they were there and didn't like us to ask him to do work while they were there. So, he would try to have a friend there a lot so we wouldn't ask him to do work.

Basically, the issue from our standpoint was that he wanted to treat our house more like a hotel where he could come and go as he liked and we had to do all the work. We wanted him to treat our house like he was a member of the household. So, he chose to move out.
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Old 03-22-2015, 11:10 AM   #177
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Our sons were not partiers so we never had to deal with rules on that kind of thing. Never had to talk about a curfew. They were just expected to clean up after themselves and to let us know if they would not be home for dinner. The younger son had unpredictable work hours including some very late nights (sometimes early morning) so I needed to know if he'd be home late so we wouldn't worry. He also plays the drums and he needed to be aware of when his drumming would be a problem. I actually enjoyed his drumming so my only request was that he not play the drums while I was cooking or eating.

The only requirement was that their household contribution must be paid on time or early. It was all set up on automatic bank transfers, so it was never a problem.

We are really enjoying our empty nest-ness since they are both out on their own for a while. We still see them often but it's so nice that they go home!
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Old 03-22-2015, 08:48 PM   #178
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I like the logic behind the idea that "this is a house where we all pitch-in... not a hotel." Thinking of good chores that would require not disappearing for days at a time might be a challenge. Maybe each of us would sign -up 1/3 of the dinners, including grocery shopping. Then missed days would mean cooking several days in a row to catch-up...that is logical, fair, and would probably make moving out seem like a great idea.
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:29 PM   #179
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My kids are still in thier teens ... my plan is do what dad did to me. Charge RENT.

Simply explain everyone chips in to make the house finances work. I paid one month then found an apt for the same amount. I expect they will do the same ... if not, fine, there's no free lunch.
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Old 03-24-2015, 01:46 PM   #180
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This situation now looks much better than the original description made it look. Her first inclination is to deal with her financial issues rather than run to a parent. That is good, even if it cost a little more this time around.

It sounds like if you talk thru these things with her and set clear, reasonable expectations, you are likely to have success in moving her towards real independence.

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Ok all. Sorry I didn't update sooner. Still working. Had the talk. I learned more than she did. Apparently she was concerned about the repair bill because she recently got a ticket in a construction zone and did not want to tell me- even though I handle these things in my job. She paid over 400 for the ticket which I could have resolved for cheaper. On top of that she went to doc for tests and assumed she had to pay- even though I cover her insurance and I have an HSA. She literally asked the doc/ lab for a bill when she left- which I have never done or knew could happen. So the bill was 521. She was upset when I asked for car repairs on top.

Here is the lesson. She had no idea what was happening with our health insurance. I had no idea her health issues. She also clearly needs an emergency fund. We discussed this too. Finally the issue of a long term plan is still lingering. Sorry for the length.


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