Last Hour of Flight Restrictions

[W2R]

I strongly doubt that anyone could be getting off on any of these images, even if J-Lo is in the scanner.

Ha

I dunno, sounds like a peeping Tom's idea of a good time, maybe? Besides, some of them may have higher resolution than the images we have seen.

 

[Koolau]

This whole mess reminds me of the proposal to ban plastic bags 'cause people don't like seeing them blow across the road. How about just arresting people who litter?

I could go on, but we've all got our pet peeves about the heavy handed way gummint reacts to each new crisis. Of course, we have only our (collective) selves to blame when we say "The gummint has to DO something". Trust me. They always will!

End of rant.

 

[bright eyed]

I believe they have some pretty effective security in Israel, given their political/domestic issues and have found one of their main tools is scanning folks behavior - ie the sweaty, nervous looking chaps/chappettes are usually pulled over - vs profiling for a specific race, ethnicity, whatever whatever...ever watch those episodes of "locked up abroad"...those folks usually look pretty jittery...

Seems this would be more effective but harder to train the breadth of TSA folks we'd need to in the USA vs the fewer # of airports in Israel.

Anyhow, in another note, I recall the impossibility of predicting my need to use the toilet when I was pregnant and flying - I almost flew out of my seat, despite going at the very last opportunity before being asked to sit, from one of my short flights between southern cali and northern cali. So they should give the prego ladies a special sign, or pass out the adult diapers cuz that could get ugly and hope they don't tackle any pregnant women rushing for the potty...

 

[audreyh1]

Hang on a second here. We have been through multiple rounds of increased security procedures, all of which seem to be pretty much for naught.

I don't see it this way at all. What I see is that enough prevention has occurred to the point where terror attempts are limited to this recent pathetic scenario. The terrorists will just keep trying - that is a given. But to just say - never mind, quit trying to prevent them. That I just don't understand!

Seems to me that a lot has been working to the point where we had one shoe bomb attempt and one underwear bomb attempt in the US.

Audrey

 

[Alan]

I don't mind the extra screening, but I do wish they would be more specific in targetting suspicious individuals rather than just on looking for bad things.

We are a long way from how Britain was in the 1970's as you couldn't go to many places including a nightclub without serious searches and pat downs, and in those days it wasn't suicide bombers that were the problem, just plain ordinary IRA bombers. They had exploded bombs and killed folks in all sorts of places including a pub, Tower of London, Macdonald's and shopping malls (even public trash cans in many places were removed for a while). I feel very fortunate that we are not experiencing mainland bombing to any great extent.

 

[audreyh1]

I don't mind the extra screening, but I do wish they would be more specific in targetting suspicious individuals rather than just on looking for bad things.

Definitely - that is where the first line of defense needs to be!

Audrey

 

[TromboneAl]

This guy got through. How many tried but were caught? 3 or 3,000? Knowing that would tell us a lot about how effective the system is.

The first part of this video shows what kind of explosion a shoe bomb can make. The other explosions seem much larger.

YouTube - FBI Shoe Bomb Video

 

[Leonidas]

Sounds like something the ACLU would be interested in, so I hope the bloggers squeal as loudly as possible and get picked up by the mainstream media. Embarassment squared.

Your hopes were fulfilled.

The Transportation Security Administration on Thursday dropped its subpoenas it had issued to two Internet writers in its effort to find the leaker of an airline security directive.

The subpoenas were criticized by a leading journalism organization.

The TSA said the investigation is "nearing a successful conclusion and the subpoenas are no longer in effect."

My Way News - TSA ends journalist subpoenas over leaked memo

 

[73ss454]

I had a flight late last night from LaGuardia in NY to MCO in Orlando. The flight was almost 3 hours late with de-ice and all, that seems normal. Otherwise I didn't see any changes in security but I did keep setting the metal detector off and had to have a pat down. DW and I are suffering jet lag today as we didn't get in till after 4AM.

 

[Bestwifeever]

Our flight from Chicago to Florida on 12/31 had no extra security involved--I forgot to pull my little bag of liquids from my carryon and the scanner didn't ask to see it. No one patted down our bods. Maybe our return flight next week will be different, but I doubt it.

 

[WanderALot]

I just flew on a flight from the Midwest back to CA and we did have to go through the body scan, but no long delays besides that. Flying out early on New Years Day probably had something to do with that though!

Regarding the guy's visa being rejected in Britain; his visa was rejected not because of some suspected terrorist link, but because he said he was going to be at a university that doesn't exist!

I'm not a TSA fan, but I honestly don't think you can do a whole lot to prevent a persistent terrorist from a security standpoint. The fact that terrorists know that if they attempt to hijack a plane, at least a few passengers will resist probably acts as more of a deterrent than anything. I remember flying pre-9/11 where conventional wisdom was just to submit and obey hijackers. Not any more.

 

[Alan]

Regarding the guy's visa being rejected in Britain; his visa was rejected not because of some suspected terrorist link, but because he said he was going to be at a university that doesn't exist!

Yes but surely it would be useful for the USA and Britain to share info on folks that fraudulently attempt to enter the country - add that fact to other facts and you build a profile that should require more scrutiny.

 

[harley]

I had a flight late last night from LaGuardia in NY to MCO in Orlando. The flight was almost 3 hours late with de-ice and all, that seems normal. Otherwise I didn't see any changes in security but I did keep setting the metal detector off and had to have a pat down. DW and I are suffering jet lag today as we didn't get in till after 4AM.

Our flight from Chicago to Florida on 12/31 had no extra security involved--I forgot to pull my little bag of liquids from my carryon and the scanner didn't ask to see it. No one patted down our bods. Maybe our return flight next week will be different, but I doubt it.

The extra security is for international flights only. The last hour restrictions are so the terrorists won't know when they are approaching populated areas (as terrorists don't know about watches). And since we don't have terrorists in this country flying domestic flights there's no reason to implement any effective new measures in country.

 

[Zero]

I wonder, is it required that the window shades be pulled down for the last hour so you can't look out and spot large cities?

Also, wouldn't a plane descending kind of indicate close proximity to a city?

And couldn't a person just watch when the attendants make the final seat belt check?

The measures TSA is implementing are farcical, it boggles my mind that we do not have more intelligent people in place to make decisions.

It is, has, and always will be a financial game. When airlines no longer have sufficient paying passengers, airports not longer have sufficient planes operating out of them, and huge losses occur, effective means of security will happen.

If my and my wife's decision is any indication, there may be lots less folks flying in the next few years. We just canceled both our vacations to Europe this year.

 

[Trek]

If my and my wife's decision is any indication, there may be lots less folks flying in the next few years. We just canceled both our vacations to Europe this year.

Just curious as to why. Terrorists aren't interested in blowing up planes leaving the US and most the security changes affect international flights arriving into the US.

Flying from the US to Europe isn't going to be much extra hassle.

 

[samclem]

If my and my wife's decision is any indication, there may be lots less folks flying in the next few years. We just canceled both our vacations to Europe this year.

You canceled your vacation to Europe because of the possibility of a 20 minute wait in a security line, or because of the possibility of a 45 second wand/search? Or because of the less than one-in-a-million chance that you'll be the victim of a terrorist attack while flying? Certainly getting into a car and driving any distance at all on vacation poses a greater risk.

I guess we can all maximize safety and minimize inconvenience by staying home, pulling down the shades, and hoping nothing bad happens--'cause if we do it is a sure bet nothing good will happen.

 

[Zero]

Trek, just because of the intense hassles now in place. We were doing quite a bit of flying into and out of Europe, including Amsterdam back to the US and just have lost interest in being questioned, prodded, probed and treated like a criminal.

Flew into Toronto last month and the immigration officer questioned us separately, took 15 minutes for us to both get thru and I was forced to go on ahead and not stand nearby while the wife was questioned.

Kinda feels bad all over.

I was asked twice, "why are you coming to Toronto during the winter?". Uh, what difference does that make?

So not afraid of flying, tired of the hassles.

Just curious as to why. Terrorists aren't interested in blowing up planes leaving the US and most the security changes affect international flights arriving into the US.

Flying from the US to Europe isn't going to be much extra hassle.

 

[W2R]

The extra security is for international flights only. The last hour restrictions are so the terrorists won't know when they are approaching populated areas (as terrorists don't know about watches). And since we don't have terrorists in this country flying domestic flights there's no reason to implement any effective new measures in country.

Good one!

These new restrictions make absolutely no sense to me, either. Oh well. Obviously I have much to learn.

 

[Zero]

If it were only a 20 minute wait and a 45 second wand search, no problem.

But my last three flights have included such things as having to pass back and forth thru the metal detector about 6 times because I have a metal plate and screws in my forearm. I showed them the huge scars and that was not good enough. Had to be pulled aside, then they decide since I'm suspicious, they should search my carryon, to the point of piling the entire contents on the table, sniff the small items, pull on the lining, and basically act like they were onto me and determined to arrest me for something.

Then "OK, you can repack your bag, sir".

So it's more than a simple wait and wanding. And it all depends on your luck at being the random searchee.

You canceled your vacation to Europe because of the possibility of a 20 minute wait in a security line, or because of the possibility of a 45 second wand/search? Or because of the less than one-in-a-million chance that you'll be the victim of a terrorist attack while flying? Certainly getting into a car and driving any distance at all on vacation poses a greater risk.

I guess we can all maximize safety and minimize inconvenience by staying home, pulling down the shades, and hoping nothing bad happens--'cause if we do it is a sure bet nothing good will happen.

 

[Trek]

If it were only a 20 minute wait and a 45 second wand search, no problem.

But my last three flights have included such things as having to pass back and forth thru the metal detector about 6 times because I have a metal plate and screws in my forearm. I showed them the huge scars and that was not good enough. Had to be pulled aside, then they decide since I'm suspicious, they should search my carryon, to the point of piling the entire contents on the table, sniff the small items, pull on the lining, and basically act like they were onto me and determined to arrest me for something.

Then "OK, you can repack your bag, sir".

So it's more than a simple wait and wanding. And it all depends on your luck at being the random searchee.

Well, if that was my normal experience every time, I might wonder if I want to fly too. I fly a lot and I'm a tall, blonde, Nordic looking fellow and I get pulled aside for extra security (body wand) a good 80% of the time I go through security (whether I set off the detector or not). They swab my carry-on for explosives (usually in a separate room, depending on airport) etc about 50% of the time.

100% of the time, this has happened in US airports, not EU airports and I've flown through most all the major ones from Munich to Helsinki. This is all since 9-11.

I've not though been made to feel like a criminal. Most TSA agents do seem pretty dense and I've been questioned as to why I've been to Estonia (then they ask me where it is). I look at TSA agents as people that had their application turned down at Walmart. I assume (and by the demeanor of the TSA) believe I'm the guy they screen because I'm the opposite of a terrorist. I'm the token white guy they have to screen so they don't get blamed for racial profiling.

Personally I wouldn't cancel a trip over it. I love to travel and as they say, getting there is part of the adventure. I try to look at airports/security/etc as part of the adventure and not stress about it. I always arrive to airports early (my nature, I'm early to everything).

But Zero, if they make you feel like a criminal and threaten you every time you fly, then I do understand you wanting to spend your time locally.

 

[samclem]

Had to be pulled aside, then they decide since I'm suspicious, they should search my carryon, to the point of piling the entire contents on the table, sniff the small items, pull on the lining, and basically act like they were onto me and determined to arrest me for something.

Then "OK, you can repack your bag, sir".

I wonder if there's any actual prohibition to packing 20 dirty diapers as your only carryon?

(Between dry heaves)"Okay, you can repack your bag, sir"

"No, that's okay. You can dispose of it where you put all the expensive scissors and colognes that you confiscate."

 

[travelover]

I flew from Portland to Salt Lake City on New Year's Eve. I sat next to an African man who kept trying to send text messages during the flight on a old cracked faced cell phone. The guy made me nervous, though I'm generally no xenophobe.

We did not run into any enhanced security that we could perceive.

Fortunately, all was well.

 

[Alan]

I flew from Portland to Salt Lake City on New Year's Eve. I sat next to an African man who kept trying to send text messages during the flight on a old cracked faced cell phone. The guy made me nervous, though I'm generally no xenophobe.

We did not run into any enhanced security that we could perceive.

Fortunately, all was well.

The last few times I've flown, cell phone use in flight is banned completely. (IED's are often triggered with cell phones though I suspect the reason is more commercial than safety)

 

[Zero]

Well, if that was my normal experience every time, I might wonder if I want to fly too. I fly a lot and I'm a tall, blonde, Nordic looking fellow and I get pulled aside for extra security (body wand) a good 80% of the time I go through security (whether I set off the detector or not). They swab my carry-on for explosives (usually in a separate room, depending on airport) etc about 50% of the time.

100% of the time, this has happened in US airports, not EU airports and I've flown through most all the major ones from Munich to Helsinki. This is all since 9-11.

I've not though been made to feel like a criminal. Most TSA agents do seem pretty dense and I've been questioned as to why I've been to Estonia (then they ask me where it is). I look at TSA agents as people that had their application turned down at Walmart. I assume (and by the demeanor of the TSA) believe I'm the guy they screen because I'm the opposite of a terrorist. I'm the token white guy they have to screen so they don't get blamed for racial profiling.

Personally I wouldn't cancel a trip over it. I love to travel and as they say, getting there is part of the adventure. I try to look at airports/security/etc as part of the adventure and not stress about it. I always arrive to airports early (my nature, I'm early to everything).

But Zero, if they make you feel like a criminal and threaten you every time you fly, then I do understand you wanting to spend your time locally.

I've been flying 15-20 times a year for the last 40 years, and many of those were DC to London or Los Angeles to Hong Kong. And in the 70-80's flying was a joy, and as a business person you got treated royally. I often knew ever flight attendant by name and they me. The 90's it seemed like the hijackings had taken their toll on the enjoyment aspect of flying and there was security to a moderate extent but starting in 2000 it really is more of a chore for me.

Maybe I have just flown too much but it is no longer fun. I can't hype myself into believing I enjoy it.

And SamClem, you gave me a great idea. I may ask my neighbor to save me some of his babies "used" pampers. Watching the TSA agent turn green round the gills might break the mood a bit.

 

[harley]

And SamClem, you gave me a great idea. I may ask my neighbor to save me some of his babies "used" pampers. Watching the TSA agent turn green round the gills might break the mood a bit.

Yes, TSA agents are well known for their sense of humor. Can you say biological weapon? Missed flight? Multi-orifice search? And all with no recourse, since you can't sue and they make up the rules as they go.