Magic mushrooms are magic

[Martha]

In follow-up interviews conducted two months later 67 percent of the volunteers rated the psilocybin experience as among the most meaningful of their lives, comparing it to the birth of a first child or the death of a parent, and 79 percent reported that it had moderately or greatly increased their overall sense of well-being or life satisfaction. Independent interviews of family members, friends and co-workers confirmed small but significant positive changes in the subject's behavior and more follow-ups are currently being conducted to determine if the effects persist a year later.

Further scientific investigation is warranted to determine how the drug achieves its effects as well as how they might be used in the treatment of "the ennui and anguish of impending death" as well as "alcoholism and other forms of drug addiction," argues Charles Schuster, a neuroscientist at Wayne State University and a former director of the National Institute on Drug Abuse, in a commentary on the paper. "The misuse of these substances … cannot be allowed to continue to curtail their use as tools for understanding the neurobiology of human consciousness, self-awareness and their potential as therapeutic agents."


http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa003&articleID=00057DC8-20C7-14B4-A0C783414B7F0000

This article may be of interest to both Rich in Tampa, as a medical doctor dealing with end of life issues and HFWR, as a possble volunteer for further research.

 

[mickeyd]

Maybe Tim Leary was on the right track after all.

 

[Cool Dood]

Once again, science comes to the rescue of obviousness. I wonder if this will be a major turning point in America's (and by extension, the world's) attitude toward drugs.

At the least, it's some more evidence explaining the origins of religions (hope that doesn't qualify as anti-religion bigotry, Laurence!). And, naturally, it shows the harmlessness and goodness of mushrooms.

 

[Martha]

There was a longer article with more detail in the WSJ.  What was interesting is that there were actually a few people who had very bad, though managable, experiences with the psilocybin. Way back when the word on the street was that psilocybin was one of the safest drugs.  No bad personal experiences to report amongst my friends and family, but not earth shattering either.

 

[thefed]

Ive eaten many shrooms in my day 8) and they sure were good! no more though, its usually too intense

 

[brewer12345]

Ive eaten many shrooms in my day  8) and they sure were good! no more though, its usually too intense

What's it like? I assume no "high" as with alcohol/pot? Do you hallucinate (see things that aren't there)? Is perception altered in some way?

 

[Rich_by_the_Bay]

That is very interesting. We'll see where it leads, if anywhere. It's probably increasing endorphins or such.

I'm sure you meant your post in a lighthearted way, but it got me to thinking about some of my terminal patients. If theoretically you could take some sort of safe and effective "happy pill" when you found out you were terminal (not talking about severe pain, etc. -- bring on the morphine) would you really want it?

This is hard to explain in words, but I've developed a healthy respect for the power of grief and tears and sadness.  It's hard for the dying to get to "acceptance" without some version of all that, not to mention for the loved ones. Somehow it's like you've got to pay serious emotional dues to get to a sense of completeness in such things. But when you get there, you feel able to move on.

Wonder if suppressing or masking it medically would be a good thing.

Sorry for the morbid digression. Gotta go get some shrooms .

 

[brewer12345]

If theoretically you could take some sort of safe and effective "happy pill" when you found out you were terminal (not talking about severe pain, etc. -- bring on the morphine) would you really want it?

I was actually thinking along the same lines when I read the lead-in post. I don't think I'd want to experience something chemically induced that meant more to me than the birth of my daughters or spending time with my wife.

 

[wallygator69]

If theoretically you could take some sort of safe and effective "happy pill" when you found out you were terminal (not talking about severe pain, etc. -- bring on the morphine) would you really want it?

Hell yes!

 

[Martha]

I didn't intend to make light of end of life issues.  But if you are suffering and want some temporary relief, maybe hallucinogens or psychedelics  should be an option.  You wouldn't be out of it for long. 

There are all sorts of issues and questions here.  About using drugs to facilitate religious experiences.  About having your most meaningful experiences in life drug induced (no good in my mind). But then again, I know a number of people who have used psilocybin and I used mescaline several times 30+ years ago, and although the experiences were intense and unforgettable, they were not among the most "meaningful."

Hasn't man used mind altering substances throughout history? 

Edit: Brewer, the Wikipedia entry on psilocybin describes the effects:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psilocybin

 

[wallygator69]

I was actually thinking along the same lines when I read the lead-in post.  I don't think I'd want to experience something chemically induced that meant more to me than the birth of my daughters or spending time with my wife.

Shrooms are amazing, did them twice in college. Once by accident, second time on purpose.

Sense of euphoria. Colors, light are brighter and more intense. Most people get a little more profound and philosophical and you ahve amazing energy. You could be on the verge of falling asleep and an hour later you could be at a disco until 1 a.m.   Best part is your happy and just about everything is amusing. I've seen some folks over do it and take too much and end up with is essentially and LSD trip..

I can't say for sure what you'd feel if you are dying but I bet you could go to Disney World with your kids or a tropical Island with dear wife and enjoy yoursel as much as the first time you went.  Is this better for your family or not is up for debate.

I don't have kids but think if I did they would want to remeber me that way as oppose to sitting arund pontificating on my imminent demise...

Could also go out with a Bang with the DW in Tortola for however long it takes...  

Lots of activity would probably speed the process up but I always told my wife if I die young to screw the wake. I want a Keg Party in the backyard. Stand me up on the deck like Weekend At Bernie's so I can watch.

I'm dead serious too (no pun intended)..

Wally

 

[Rich_by_the_Bay]

Yep, drugs will be with us forever, beit alcohol or shrooms. Even birds fall out of trees drunk when they get in to the over-ripe berries .

In the terminal illness situation, I've noticed that when a grieving, crying terminal patient shares the grief and tears with an equally suffering loved one, it is oddly enough often not a bad thing. It is very sad and very difficult but not necessarily "bad." Hard for me to picture an artificially happy dying patient interacting with a grieving loved one. I'd guess the asynchrony would be emotionally devastating.

Just a personal reflection.

 

[haha]

Lots of activity would probably speed the process up but I always told my wife if I die young to screw the wake. I want a Keg Party in the backyard. Stand me up on the deck like Weekend At Bernie's so I can watch.

Wally, this is pretty much like the old Irish wakes, according to what I was told when I little. The dead guy is seated in his chair in his living room, and everyone else gets blind drunk.

Ha

 

[wallygator69]

Hard for me to picture an artificially happy dying patient interacting with a grieving loved one.

I'd share the shrooms I'm not that selfish.

Seriously, never had to face it and if I never do it means I'm going before anyone close to me. Only had the unexpected drop dead scenario happen up to this point.

Thanks your thoughts..

W

 

[Cool Dood]

Wally, this is pretty much like the old Irish wakes, according to what I was told when I little. The dead guy is seated in his chair in his living room, and everyone else gets blind drunk.

So.. just an ordinary day?

Just kidding!

 

[donheff]

Interesting article. The results sound similar to some of the studies on LSD in the early 60s before Leary, et al.

I "experimented" with Psyllocybin, Mescalline, and LSD back in the day. I was always the in-control guy in the crowd so I kept the dosage down below the "white-light experience" level. I even helped out at an "LSD rescue" bad trip handling outfit for a brief stint. After entering the Federal work force I avoided any drug use and, ironically, had to institute a drug testing program for my agency (what a waste of resources - testing a bunch of senior executives and law enforcement types). But I always kept in the back of my mind the possibility that I could "experiment" at the "white-light" level after I retired. Alas, the legal prohibitions make it not worth the risk.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

i've always felt that simply living in society can install a bit of neurosis in the individual. it forces upon a person a way of seeing & limits, to a degree, the person to a certain perspective.

experiences with altered states of consciousness allow a person to break the mold. once able to see in a new way, continued use of the original external vehicle seems, at best, old hat, at worst, dangerous.

society as a whole has benefited from past transgressions. my brother would never allow his kids to do drugs. he figures he already had all the fun for them. truth being, all that information is now readily accessible within the overall awareness of western society.

a much better (cleaner, safer, healthier, clearer & helpful) way of altering one's consciousness would be the use of meditation and dream techniques. there are a multitude of varieties of these.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

This is hard to explain in words, but I've developed a healthy respect for the power of grief and tears and sadness.  It's hard for the dying to get to "acceptance" without some version of all that, not to mention for the loved ones. Somehow it's like you've got to pay serious emotional dues to get to a sense of completeness in such things. But when you get there, you feel able to move on.

i think that is quite accurate.

Wonder if suppressing or masking it medically would be a good thing.

while researching my mother's alzheimer's i once read that suppressing tears can lead to the physical destruction of memory.

 

[cube_rat]

I've done my share of mushrooms, mescaline and LSD back in the day. Which explains the brain damage, but I digress.

The good part: Mescaline and mushrooms provide wonderfully mellow hallucinations.  Colors become sounds, sounds become color.  Also you get a cosmic connection with everyone you come in contact with.  

The bad/weird part: Sometimes you can't stop laughing.  Everything is funny.  It's like the thing on the brain that controls laughter turns on into overdrive.  Simple things like ironing a shirt becomes a comic relief session.  Also sleep is impossible as hallucinations (auditory and visual) are still very prominent with the eyes closed.

I found acid to be downright scary stuff.  Things move and fly around.     Faces turn into other faces.  Weird.

Thanks for the 70's flashback folks    It's bad enough reliving the campy music from the 70's.  Too much 70's this week.

Seriously though, I think my propensity for panic attacks were triggered by bad acid trips.  I wish I never took drugs in my younger years.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

Yep. Everything is funny. Music and television are really incredible. Sex is amazing.

Do not eat anything.

 

[HFWR]

"So, next time you want to go out there; you feel like feeding your head.
Best think twice about doing acid. Hold out for mushrooms instead."

The Acid Song, Loudin Wainwright III

I do not encourage, nor condone, the use of illicit substances... 

 

[Dreamer]

So many memories.... I have been so responsible for so many years now. I think that if I were terminal and my relatives would not find out and I knew that I would not get busted, then I would again for old times sake! Of course, I would want DH with me. We used to have some good times and only had 1 bad trip. Would not want any more though! I also would not want my children to think that I approved of doing drugs, because I woud never want them using them!

 

[cube_rat]

I also would not want my children to think that I approved of doing drugs, because I woud never want them using them!

AMEN Dreamer!!!

 

[unclemick]

New Orleans, Beer, Country music.

Now I'm old before my time.

I think .

heh heh heh heh heh heh - didn't need any mushrooms.

 

[SteveR]

Yep, drugs will be with us forever, beit alcohol or shrooms. Even birds fall out of trees drunk when they get in to the over-ripe berries .

In the terminal illness situation, I've noticed that when a grieving, crying terminal patient shares the grief and tears with an equally suffering loved one, it is oddly enough often not a bad thing. It is very sad and very difficult but not necessarily "bad." Hard for me to picture an artificially happy dying patient interacting with a grieving loved one. I'd guess the asynchrony would be emotionally devastating.

Just a personal reflection.

I would agree with your assessment on this. A partnered couple needs to come to terms with the death. Death is a loss and any loss creates some level of greif. The closer the relationship the deeper the grief. I believe it is even more important for the surviving partner to have prepared themselves for the death than the patient. Preparing for death together may make shorted the active grief process but cannot ever remove it completely. Avoidance of dealing with the impending death is much like having an elephant in your living room but no one wishes to be improper by discussing it openly.

That said, I would rather deal with the approaching death while allowing my family member to avoid as much of the reality of their approaching death as they could while still maintaining their grasp of reality. A line line for sure but were I the one on the death bed I think I would rather be dreaming than crying.