Pastor Wright - What cabinet position suits him best?

[Arc]

Personally I'm thinking Secretary of State - I see tremendous bridges being built throughout the world by this man.

YouTube - Jeremiah Wright - Obama's mentor - Hate speech

 

[Notmuchlonger]

But its grass roots and change! Come on a bit of hate isnt so bad..is it

 

[poboy]

I tend to disagree, I have tentatively slated Oprah as Sec. of State. Sharpton as AG, and Pastor Wright as chaplain of the Senate.

 

[Martha]

So, now Obama is "too black" where he was once not black enough?

I like the guy and if you read his website he has well thought out positions which are inconsistent with Wright. Obama isn't all just charisma. And he, like all the other candidates, does not take all the positions of all their friends and associates.

I have noticed in the press lately that it seems to be a contest of who is going to embarrass which candidate. It is getting more than a bit tedious.

 

[cantlogin]

Any church or religion that conducts political indoctrination sessions should not be tax exempt.

 

[FinanceDude]

I tend to disagree, I have tentatively slated Oprah as Sec. of State. Sharpton as AG, and Pastor Wright as chaplain of the Senate.

Lord help us all if that happens..........

Canada would look nice then.........

 

[retire@40]

Lord help us all if that happens..........

Canada would look nice then.........

Hell, Iraq would look nice then.

 

[packrat44]

Any church or religion that conducts political indoctrination sessions should not be tax exempt.

Totally agree. There are very good reasons why religion should not be involved in politics and vice versa. Simply look at the problems in the middle-east.

Romney received 90%+ of the Republican vote in Utah. Wonder if Mitt's name was brought up during church services?

 

[samclem]

So, now Obama is "too black" where he was once not black enough?

I like the guy and if you read his website he has well thought out positions which are inconsistent with Wright. Obama isn't all just charisma. And he, like all the other candidates, does not take all the positions of all their friends and associates.

I have noticed in the press lately that it seems to be a contest of who is going to embarrass which candidate. It is getting more than a bit tedious.

If this issue (the embarrassing bigot Rev Wright) starts to gain traction and hurt Obama, he'll have to actively distance himself from this guy. The situation would be the same if McCain had been bringing his family to a church for many years led by a segregationist white bigot--we'd all expect McCain to say what he liked about that church and that minister, and to say that he does not agree with his views on race in America. The problem is that such a statement by Obama would (in my opinion) cause him some serious problem with a significant part of his constituency. It's a constituency he might not agree with, but one he can't afford to alienate at this time.
I, for one, hope he does the right thing, openly and specifically disavowing the divisive and inaccurate views held by his pastor.

 

[youbet]

Lord help us all if that happens..........

Canada would look nice then.........

Canada looks nice now actually. But they don't want you. They have immigration laws. And they enforce them........

 

[Rich_by_the_Bay]

He could bring back Rumsfeld and Ashcroft. They were cute.

 

[dex]

That the senator has been a member of this church for 20 years, brought his children there and he didn't speak up against what was being preached speaks volumens to me.

I though there wasn't much of a difference between Hilary and Obama before. Now Hilary looks as if she holds the moral high ground and my vote.

 

[dumpster56]

This is a fascinating story! I mean what in the world is Obama thinking? This is crazy. This is just like when the people of Minnesota elected Jessie Ventura and said holy cr@p we just elected WHO??

The American people have the information with this moron. He really is nothing more than a senator from Illinois and a weak one at that. He gave a real good speech in 2004.

Like the cartoons say yidipyadeep thats all folks!

 

[frayne]

So, now Obama is "too black" where he was once not black enough?

I like the guy and if you read his website he has well thought out positions which are inconsistent with Wright. Obama isn't all just charisma. And he, like all the other candidates, does not take all the positions of all their friends and associates.

I have noticed in the press lately that it seems to be a contest of who is going to embarrass which candidate. It is getting more than a bit tedious.

I agree with you 100%. I have been a life long republican but after eight years of Bush, I will vote for Obama if he gets his party's nomination. If not I will hold my nose and vote for McCain.

 

[Gumby]

Dex:

I don't know about you, but my pastor clears all his sermons with me before he gives them. Don't be ridiculous!

I am a member of the United Church of Christ, just as Obama is. I go to church every Sunday. Sometimes, I agree with the sermon, sometimes I don't. Sometimes I fall asleep. I am no more responsible for the content of my pastor's sermons than you are responsible for the content of the posts here (other than your own). The great thing about my denomination is freedom of conscience. Each of our UCC congregations is independent. We have no tests of faith or doctrinal creeds to which we must subscribe. And within each congregation, we come in a wide variety of beliefs and experiences. Each of us approaches God in our own separate way, and we are comfortable with that. We need not, and often do not, agree with our pastor.

Furthermore, a congregation is much more than a pastor. He is important, of course, but the most important thing is that we are a group of Christians who come together to worship and praise God and to carry out the works that Jesus charged us with. Pastors move in and out of churches, but the congregation remains as an everlasting, if ever evolving, entity. (My own church is 370 years old this year). For me to leave my church as a consequence of a few sermons with which I disagree would be a precipitous step. It would require cutting ties with a community of faith that has sustained me over many years.

There is a reason the Constitution explicitly prohibits a religious test for public office -- to prevent people from doing precisely what you are doing. It is positively un-American to require that any presidential candidate worship in a manner and in a place that YOU deem acceptable.

Gumby

P.S. I don't think it matters, but for those who might be interested, I believe that Pastor Wright has retired and that Trinity UCC has a new pastor.

P.P.S. -- If you want to start parsing religious backgrounds, you might want to investigate Clinton's membership in a Washington DC group called The Fellowship. One of its leaders is the Reverend Bob Schenck, who is the former head of the militant anti-abortion group Operation Rescue. Should Clinton be held responsible for all the things Schenck has said or done? I think not, but by your standards maybe yes, so you ought to look into it.

 

[Notmuchlonger]

A bit of news.


Minister leaves Obama campaign - Decision '08 - MSNBC.com

 

[EarlyRetiree1978]

That the senator has been a member of this church for 20 years, brought his children there and he didn't speak up against what was being preached speaks volumens to me.

I though there wasn't much of a difference between Hilary and Obama before. Now Hilary looks as if she holds the moral high ground and my vote.

I couldn't have said it better. I find it impossible to trust him now because I don’t believe he was not present when this Pastor spoke this hate speak. I believe the pastor spoke like this many times before.

We'll see what Pennsylvania thinks about this as well as Michigan and Florida (when they re-vote).

If I went to my synagogue and my Rabbi spoke negatively against others or this country and all else which I believed in, I would RUN not walk out of that sermon and synagogue.

He is just trying to do damage control now.

 

[samclem]

There is a reason the Constitution explicitly prohibits a religious test for public office -- to prevent people from doing precisely what you are doing. It is positively un-American to require that any presidential candidate worship in a manner and in a place that YOU deem acceptable.

There's a very big difference between a government-imposed religious test (which the Constitution prohibits) and the electorate making decisions on a candidate based on the views (religious and otherwise) that a candidate holds. For example, there's just no way that I could vote for a presidential candidate who really believes that the earth is no more than 6000 years old. For that reason alone, I would not have voted for Huckabee.

We have freedom of religion, but that does not mean that we can't laugh out loud at some of the stuff that passes for theology.

None of which has anything to do with Reverend Wright and Obama. Nothing the Rev said about theology or sin or redemption is what is at issue here. It's his anti-America, anti-white message of division and hate that is what is getting folks upset. He's free to spout that stuff, but if a candidate for President voluntarily subjects himself and his family to it and calls the old bigot a "mentor" and thinks enough of him to single him out in his autobiography, it is right to question that candidate's judgment and values. The statements of Obama to date sure haven't put things right. Or, maybe you are right--maybe he likes the social life of the that congregation--which is apparently a whole bunch of people who thought this type of sermon was okay and didn't think they should reign this guy in or dump him. From the looks of the audience reaction in the video, there are apparently many in that congregation who are in total agreement with Rev Wright's view of the world. Maybe the covered dish get togethers and other social aspects are a welcome break from the hateful sermons.

The link goes to a 13 March 2008 Good Morning America segment on this pastor's message. Video at the bottom.
The Raw Story | ABC: Is former Reverend a liability for Obama?

 

[Texarkandy]

Dex:
There is a reason the Constitution explicitly prohibits a religious test for public office -- to prevent people from doing precisely what you are doing. It is positively un-American to require that any presidential candidate worship in a manner and in a place that YOU deem acceptable.

This is not about "religion" or a "religious test" and those who say it is either don't understand the issue or are being disingenuous.

It's about Afrocentricity.

How about Christian Identity - would you vote for a Christian Identity adherent if you otherwise liked his/her policies & style? Would it not be an issue?

I looked into this long before it became a media issue - BO is not just a casual attender in the audience at this church - he is deeply involved with Pastor Wright on a personal level and has said as much himself.

 

[laurence]

Mmm, hmm, I think Gumby is right, but hey, if everybody who wasn't going to vote for Obama anyway has now loudly proclaimed how this incident has helped them "make up their mind" that's cool. Or is it just a tempting point to start a lobbying campaign with? I mean, really, none of you have a close friend or relative who's said things that might embarrass you? Don't you think if he was preaching this kind of stuff every weekend they'd have more than 2 quotes over the last 5 years to freak out about? Meanwhile Michael Savage gets on the radio every night and says Barack HUSSEIN Obama every night with impunity.

 

[chinaco]

Dex:

I don't know about you, but my pastor clears all his sermons with me before he gives them. Don't be ridiculous!

Sorry Gumbo. But I disagree. There is a bit of guilt by association... this is not a court of law, it is an election.

He has the backing of a number of Radicals that have an ax to grind. What is it about these radicals that makes it OK for them to spew racist rhetoric?

If McCain were attending a southern church that had a clearly racist pastor that intertwined their services with racist and divisive rhetoric would you vote for him? I would not! If McCain has embraced the teachings of some radical racist... few would vote for him.

This is not much different than Al Sharpton spewing hatred from his pulpit. Wright has just remained out of the broad public eye by not being directly involved in national politics. It is a concern that someone is still spewing that sort of hatred toward and entire class of people.... People of European Origin.

Al Sharpton - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia - Accusation of Racism.

I would have a difficult time voting for Obama. I could see myself voting for Hillary. But if she is not in the general election, I would lean more towards McCain.

Although, I have a little trouble voting for a Republican this time around because of the damage and out and out deception of GWB. But I do not think I will let my disappointment with GWB override my judgment and vote for someone who clearly associates and takes council from people who apparently hate me.

Anything Obama says trying to distance himself from his associations will be merely for political reasons. You cannot tell me that someone spent 20 years (and even now) attend those services and it not affect his opinions. Those opinions work their way into decisions.

 

[igsoy]

nm

 

[dex]

Dex:

I don't know about you, but my pastor clears all his sermons with me before he gives them. Don't be ridiculous!

If you want to seriously discuss issues don't use such poor rhetorical techniques. I stopped reading your post after the quote above. It is poor rhetoric because it attempts or borders on sarcasm, straw man argument, introducing information not presented and a an ad honimen attack.

If you do not understand what a person posts; ask for a clarification.

Generally, the techniques you attempt to use subtract from your key points.

 

[dex]

Controversial minister off Obama's campaign - CNN.com

I don't know if the press will raise the issue; but to me the issues is that the senator was a member of this church for 20 years and did not do anything about the offensive sermons.
Did he not know the content was wrong?
If he did; why didn't he speak up against them - publicly or privately when it was happening?
The content didn't change; so why did he stay there for so many years?
This is not a one time mistake but a multiyear decision.
Finally, how could he expose his children to such content?

A leader needs to know what is right and wrong and have the courage to speak up about it. The senator has not demonstrated either with his association with the pastor.

 

[Gumby]

Dex:

You presume a priori that the content is "wrong". I cannot claim to have heard all of Reverend Wright's speeches, nor, I suspect, can anyone else on this board, so I don't know whether this represents a weekly occurrence or once in a while. I have only heard the few clips that have been played on the news, which have undoubtedly been cherry-picked for sensationalistic value. With broader context, I might have a different view of Reverend Wright's words. As might you.

But based on the little that I have heard, I don't find anything particular disturbing. It is a historical fact that black Americans have suffered horrific treatment at the hands of white Americans over the centuries. Even today, blacks are incarcerated more frequently and for longer periods of time than whites for identical crimes. The disparity in sentences for crack cocaine versus powdered cocaine is viewed by many as an effort directed specifically toward destroying the black community. When the pretty blond white girl goes missing, it is national news; when the young black girl goes missing, no one notices. No one with their eyes open can miss the fact that racism continues n our country. And we have, in fact, encouraged and supported despots and dictators around the world. It is not entirely unreasonable to view some of what has occurred lately as the "chickens coming home to roost".

The Bible is replete with stories of God punishing his people for their transgressions. Read any of the Prophets (Isaiah, Jeremiah, etc.) in this regard. That is the biblical context for Wright's use of the phrase "God damn America". And he lists the reaons why God should damn America: for treating part of its people as less than human, for oppression and injustice. It is not an unreasonable conclusion to draw (I believe that God will do as he pleases regardless of Reverend Wright's imprecations, but that is another matter).

Reverend Wright serves a black congregation, many of whom have felt the sting of injustice and oppression on a personal level. I do not find it surprising that he speaks to the issues that they feel are important in a manner that they can accept. Is he florid and over the top? Perhaps from my white, suburban, privileged point of view, yes. Might I feel uncomfortable with some of the things he says? (if nothing else, the shouting would turn me off). Again, yes, but it is not his job to make we white people feel comfortable. In fact, we probably should be uncomfortable, because only then will we change.

I return to my earlier argument. Reverend Wright's words should not be ascribed to any one of his congregation, be they senator or sanitary worker. They are his own views. And trying to coerce a man to leave his church because YOU find his pastor's words uncomfortable is just plain wrong. Obama has stated what HE believes and has decried some of Reverend Wright's comments that he does not believe. That should be enough for anyone.

Gumby

P.S. - As Lawrence noted, many, if not all of the people who raise a hue and cry about this issue weren't going to vote for Obama anyway. This just gives them cover. If it weren't this, it would be because he is a secret muslim. I really don't know why I even bother.