Pickens Plan segment on 60 min tonight

[wildcat]

Just in case anyone is interested. I am curious to see the 60 min version/analysis of it.

 

[samclem]

Dang! On a Sunday, can I buy natural gas futures to take advantage of the one-day bump when all the armchair strategists cal their broker after seeing 60 Minutes?

The Pickens Plan would have garnered more public interest with oil north of $120/bbl. The energy issue is so last month--we've got a different crisis now.

Thanks for the tip. I'll try to watch it and see what they say.

 

[TromboneAl]

But I have to record America's Funniest Home Videos!

I was very disappointed when Pickens was on Jay Leno. He spent most of the time talking about other things; actually sounded like a rambling old man.

 

[Frugality_of_Apathy]

But I have to record America's Funniest Home Videos!

I was very disappointed when Pickens was on Jay Leno. He spent most of the time talking about other things; actually sounded like a rambling old man.

If you're using a VCR you can set it to record a channel even while the TV is showing a different channel.

I'll probably watch it. The issue is so divisive all the reports are either claiming it's just a money grab for pickens companies or if it doesn't get enacted volcanoes will erupt in my living room.

 

[TromboneAl]

If you're using a VCR you can set it to record a channel even while the TV is showing a different channel.

And watch it with the commercials?

 

[Frugality_of_Apathy]

I refuse to believe you can't also do that with a DVR.

Or you could always wait the two seconds for it to show up on youtube.

 

[Midpack]

I watched, it was fine. If you are familiar with his plan, you wouldn't have learned anything new, but the exposure can only help. I support The Pickens Plan, but I am not aware of any other serious comprehensive plans...

 

[Texarkandy]

Didn't see it - too bad

All I can say about the Picken's Plan is - at least he's got one!

 

[wildcat]

I would say the plan is way too ambitious and govt could never pull it off.

It's like changing strategies when you are small company vs a gigantic company.

 

[Yankees Rule]

But are pressurized tanks a good thing?? What happens when someone T Bones you running a red light?? Boom and land a mile down the road?? Pressure is really not your friend. Then the tanker trucks running all around the country again all under extreme pressure.

Think about that.

 

[samclem]

But are pressurized tanks a good thing?? What happens when someone T Bones you running a red light?? Boom and land a mile down the road?? Pressure is really not your friend. Then the tanker trucks running all around the country again all under extreme pressure.

Think about that.

Not much of a difference from the risks we are used to. The modern CNG tanks are made of carbon fiber composites and are VERY tough. They are far more resistant to damage than a typical automobile gasoline tank. And that gasoline tank contains a flammable fluid that contains more potential energy than the energy in the compressed natural gas (that's why the NG cars have a more limited range).

Thousands of CNG vehicles operate on the road today with no significant difference in safety from their gasoline-powered neighbors.

If we weren't already using gasoline to fuel our cars and somebody were to propose it, it would never be able to gain acceptance as a motor fuel due to the safety issues.

 

[Yankees Rule]

Not much of a difference from the risks we are used to. The modern CNG tanks are made of carbon fiber composites and are VERY tough. They are far more resistant to damage than a typical automobile gasoline tank. And that gasoline tank contains a flammable fluid that contains more potential energy than the energy in the compressed natural gas (that's why the NG cars have a more limited range).

Thousands of CNG vehicles operate on the road today with no significant difference in safety from their gasoline-powered neighbors.

If we weren't already using gasoline to fuel our cars and somebody were to propose it, it would never be able to gain acceptance as a motor fuel due to the safety issues.

Yes but have you seen some of the explosions from these tanks in testing?? I will get the websites later for you but they are really interesting to see what happens in real time. Wow.

http://www.seattle.gov/fire/publications/cng/CNGAutoFire.ppt You must see this power point presentation, it loads slow but worth the wait.

 

[samclem]

Yes but have you seen some of the explosions from these tanks in testing?? I will get the websites later for you but they are really interesting to see what happens in real time. Wow.

http://www.seattle.gov/fire/publications/cng/CNGAutoFire.ppt You must see this power point presentation, it loads slow but worth the wait.

That's impressive. I still think it is a PR problem more than a real one. We could all find 50 clips of gasoline-fed automobile fires, people being burned alive, etc. After all, in this case the tank only exploded because the vehicle had already been engulfed in flames for quite some time.

 

[Yankees Rule]

That's impressive. I still think it is a PR problem more than a real one. We could all find 50 clips of gasoline-fed automobile fires, people being burned alive, etc. After all, in this case the tank only exploded because the vehicle had already been engulfed in flames for quite some time.

I did like the slide where the tank probably hit the overpass 90 feet above!!

And I was thinking about getting one of those hondas.. Seriously.

 

[unclemick]

Hmmm - as far as I know the NASA plant where I used to work has been running CNG forklifts and some pickups for over forty years now. And bat powered Cushmans(yeck) - can't burn rubber with a Cushman - at least I couldn't back in the day.

heh heh heh - didn't watch Pickens - but one I read about up in the Dakotas wants the taxpayer to spring for shooting the lawyers/building the transmission lines/network to get the windpower to the user markets. A little humor. I'm really a Democrat/ oh wait that's another thread. .

 

[travelover]

We heard the same type of worries when air bags first came out, then again over the dangers of the high voltage present in hybrids. The problem of CNG is the cost of creating a distribution network, including filling stations. The technology is here, now.

 

[jambo101]

I think his plan calls for more than just natural gas as alternate fuels to energy independance ,wind,solar,and hydro are also good sources of energy that could ultimatly keep a lot more American dollars in America instead of giving it to other nations around the world,most of whom dont even like us.I'd love to see the day when we could tell those arabs and venezuelans where they can shove their oil.

 

[haha]

I'd love to see the day when we could tell those arabs and venezuelans where they can shove their oil.

Oil is hard to shove.

 

[tryan]

For those who missed it ... here's the link for 60 minutes:

Man On A Mission Video - CBSNews.com

 

[jambo101]

Oil is hard to shove.

 

[tryan]

Interesting video ... the obvious ?? was never asked - "What does a barrel of oil need to cost to make his plan feasible?".

My guess is with oil down over 50% from its high, Boone's plan is a non-starter. At 80 yo, I hope Boone didn't put his entire wad into this.

 

[jambo101]

Interesting video ... the obvious ?? was never asked - "What does a barrel of oil need to cost to make his plan feasible?".

My guess is with oil down over 50% from its high, Boone's plan is a non-starter. At 80 yo, I hope Boone didn't put his entire wad into this.

I think the question should be how long are we going to supply other countries with huge amounts of our money to supply us with energy?

Just because the price for oil has taken a temporary dip expect prices to be back up to $4 a gallon very soon.

 

[samclem]

I think the question should be how long are we going to supply other countries with huge amounts of our money to supply us with energy?

It might feel good for the US not to be buying oil from a particular country (or all of them), but they'll still be getting the same amount of money from others. Even if we could find alternatives rapidly (unlikely), the growing petroleum demands of China and India would more than make up for whatever we don't buy.

Just because the price for oil has taken a temporary dip expect prices to be back up to $4 a gallon very soon.

Agreed. But while we can get it cheap, we should.

Realize that for as long as we are developing and using alternative energy that costs more than oil, we are, in effect, subsidizing the energy costs of China, India, and others, and thereby:
1) Helping their industries to outcompete ours on the world market
2) Increasing pollution (since US users of oil burn it more cleanly than Chinese users of the stuff).

Maybe by developing the more expensive non-petroleum energy technologies we'll someday be at a competitive advantage vs these other nations (when oil prices go up far enough and fast enough). But folks have been chanting that mantra for 30 years, and if we'd made those investments back then they still wouldn't have paid offf and we'd be at an even greater disadvantage than we are today. It's counterintuitive, but waiting do develop this stuff might be better for the US economy and for the environment than developing them now.

None of this applies to alternative energy development that can compete right now against oil (without govt subsidies, carbon offsets, or other mumbo-jumbo scale tipping). We should be developing these technologies, and private industry will certainly take the lead.