Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 06:07 PM   #41
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Mesa
Posts: 3,588
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2B
. . . One key fact is that there are very few one term presidents that are in the top half of presidental performers.* Plus, Carter and Ford are both pretty much considered safely below average.* Even though Bill Clinton had two terms he is right around the middle.* Most presidents fall in their "evaluations" as time goes on.*

I doubt many people remember what political parties Filmore, Teddy Roosevelt, Hayes, Harding or Jefferson represented.* When no one really cares anymore then we can honestly talk about them.
I think the thing you are missing is that your analysis is just that -- your analysis. Either that or the analysis of some biased sources you are reading. Further, that analysis does not seem to support your point that it takes time for us to know the appropriate ranking of a President.

For example, I've never read anyone who believed that Nixon was going to be considered a good President. You seem to think people are changing their minds about the crook. If you are correct, that would support your point, but I just don't see the kind of support for Nixon that you claim in any of the news and analysis sources I follow.

You bring up Carter, but not in a sense that supports your point. Carter was a one term President with fairly low approval ratings. You still think he ranks low. So that would not support your point that it takes time. I think the Wikipedia post supports your point much better since it indicates that while Carter was not terribly popular when he was President, some recognize his significant impact today. But you want to deny this point.

You bring up Ford who never even won an election and couldn't get elected because of poor approval and indicate that he was below average. Again, this does not support your point that it takes time.

You indicate that Clinton was a popular two term President and claim that he will rank sub-standard. Again, that might support your "it takes time" point, but I disagree with your conclusion. Everything I've read recently indicates that Clinton would have won a third term had he been allowed to run and that he could still beat any candidate today.

I actually agree with your point that the way history views Presidential administrations may change over time. But you don't seem to be putting together an argument for that. You seem to be trying to put together an argument to stop blaming Bush for the economy, unsettled mid-East, lack of medical system policy, . . . just in case history book authors bail him out.
__________________

__________________
sgeeeee is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 07:10 PM   #42
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
2B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 4,330
Re: The Power of Makeup!

sgeeeee --

I went to what seems to be the most respected source here -- Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Histori...tes_Presidents

It lists a number of polls.* I'd ignore anything other than scholar or academic polls.* Somehow asking registered voters who were the best presidents is not real useful since a high percentage can't name the current president.

There are other discussions on presidents.* The Wikipedia polls don't address Nixon specifically but there was a lot of positive retrospectives on him around the time of his death.* It's still too soon for his "true" place in history.* There's still too many opinionated ass holes that can't step back.

The same also applies to St. John Kennedy.* He has gone from martyr to lying womanizer.* It's also coming out that Johnson gave Kennedy a lot of undeserved civil rights credit.* Johnson used the Kennedy mourning to ram through bills that would have never been passed without attributing them to JFK.* He greatly expanded the civil rights transition that got rolling under Truman and Eisenhower.

Everybody doesn't always go up.* Some do.* Some don't.

Clinton may have been popular but even liberal academics don't put him high up on the discussions of great presidents.

Nixon was reasonably popular and crushed his opponent in the election -- who ever remembers the loser?* The Watergate break-in was totally meaningless to the election and Nixon was never directly tied to it.* His mistake was using the office of the president to disrupt the investigations that ultimately implicated people close to him.

Of course, we shouldn't neglect Hayes.* I notice that on Wikepedia that he's ranked higher that Carter and the Bushs.* We could have a good discussion on that.

From a personal standpoint, don't confuse me with a Bush supporter.* IMHO, he has done somethings right and somethings very wrong.* He is subjected to what I see as absolute hatred by the "left."* The fixation of the "left" on Bush hate will cost them again in the next election.* Unless I missed something, in less than 3 years GWB will retire to his ranch, make speeches for big bucks justifying his debacles and write his memoirs.

I think we've beaten this enough.* Let's move on to Hitler and Nazis.* *
__________________

__________________
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane -- Marcus Aurelius
2B is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:13 PM   #43
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,408
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Harry Truman - don't need anybody else's opinion - my mind is made up - in my heart I know I'm right.

Plus - guess where I live now.

heh heh heh heh heh heh heh he he
__________________
unclemick is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:15 PM   #44
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
2B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 4,330
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by unclemick2
Harry Truman - don't need anybody else's opinion - my mind is made up - in my heart I know I'm right.

Plus - guess where I live now.

heh heh heh heh heh heh heh he he
Show me!

Any good clothing stores around there?
__________________
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane -- Marcus Aurelius
2B is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:17 PM   #45
Full time employment: Posting here.
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 718
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cute Fuzzy Bunny
Oh come on.* We can only go so far on mortgages, inflation, annuities and taking early social security...
So I was looking at this excellent annuity the other day and....
__________________
Mwsinron is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:36 PM   #46
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Mesa
Posts: 3,588
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2B
. . .
I think we've beaten this enough.* Let's move on to Hitler and Nazis.* *
And how is it that you think this tabulation of polls makes your point?

Look at the details of those surveys. *I can see why you want to discount the surveys of American voters. *They all seem to argue against the rankings you've been claiming. *For example:

Quinnipiac University poll
A Quinnipiac University poll, taken May 23-30, 2006, asked 1,534 registered American voters to pick the best and worst U.S. President of the last 61 years. [7].

Quote:
"Thinking about the United States Presidents we have had since World War II – Harry Truman, Dwight Eisenhower, John Kennedy, Lyndon Johnson, Richard Nixon, Gerald Ford, Jimmy Carter, Ronald Reagan, George Bush Senior, Bill Clinton, and George W. Bush, which one would you consider the best president?"

Ronald Reagan (28%)
Bill Clinton (25%)
John Kennedy (18%)
Harry Truman (7%)
Dwight Eisenhower (5%)
Jimmy Carter (5%)
Don't Know/No Answer (4%)
George W. Bush (3%)
George H. W. Bush (2%)
Lyndon Johnson (1%)
Richard Nixon (1%)
Gerald Ford (1%)
So registered voters rated Clinton as the best recent President the second highest number of times. *Nixon, Ford and Johnson least often. *Nixon does rank high on the "who is the worst President?" question, although George W. Bush ranks significantly higher on that question.

But if you really believe that the scholar rankings are superior to the popular opinion, look at the two Schlesinger polls taken 14 years apart. *There is very little shift in relative rank of the Presidents between those two polls. *That actually surprises me, but the data just doesn't seem to support any of your positions. *
__________________
sgeeeee is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:40 PM   #47
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,408
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Even tho my sister works for Goodwill in the PacNW - I prefer Salvation Army.

When I'm rich - maybe Tractor Supply or -- I need to hunt down Stetson hat - rumored to around here somewhere.

heh heh heh - before Jimmy Buffett shirts - I had a thing for Western shirts - haven't had a cowboy hat since I hung up my cap pistols.
__________________
unclemick is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:47 PM   #48
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 11,615
Re: The Power of Makeup!

This "who was the best President" question just doesn't mean very much. Each administration had a completely unique environment--different internal conditions in the economy, different Congress, entirely foreign relations issues. Clearly to rate their "accomplishments" without factoring in these factors is ludicrous, and there's no way to factor them in. Let's poll some youngsters for some equally good match-ups:

- "If Godzilla fought Mothra, who would win?"
- "If a bear fought a tiger, who would win?"
- "Which is faster, a snake or a fish?"

__________________
"Freedom begins when you tell Mrs. Grundy to go fly a kite." - R. Heinlein
samclem is online now   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:55 PM   #49
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Mesa
Posts: 3,588
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by samclem
. . .
* - "If Godzilla fought Mothra, who would win?"
*. . .
I think we are too close to the Godzilla movies to make this distinction. We need to wait a few decades and let historians decide.
__________________
sgeeeee is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 08:57 PM   #50
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,408
Re: The Power of Makeup!

When I was little - I liked Ike - until my Dad took me to one side and explained - he was one of THEM and as a Democratic Ward Committeeman it was best for his kid to remain silent.

Seemed like a nice guy - when I was a kid.

heh heh heh
__________________
unclemick is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 09:21 PM   #51
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Mesa
Posts: 3,588
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by unclemick2
When I was little - I liked Ike - until my Dad took me to one side and explained - he was one of THEM and as a Democratic Ward Committeeman it was best for his kid to remain silent.

Seemed like a nice guy - when I was a kid.

heh heh heh
But could he have beaten up Godzilla?

I still like Ike -- one of the most underated Presidents we've had. This gives me an idea for a new poll.
__________________
sgeeeee is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-30-2006, 09:30 PM   #52
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
cute fuzzy bunny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Losing my whump
Posts: 22,697
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mwsinron
So I was looking at this excellent annuity the other day and....
an oxymoron if I ever saw one.

__________________
Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful. Just another form of "buy low, sell high" for those who have trouble with things. This rule is not universal. Do not buy a 1973 Pinto because everyone else is afraid of it.
cute fuzzy bunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-31-2006, 08:35 AM   #53
Recycles dryer sheets
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 473
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by unclemick2
in my heart I know I'm right.
Wow, that was Goldwater's slogan in 1964, wasn't it? You have a durned good memory!
__________________
Scrooge is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-31-2006, 08:53 AM   #54
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,408
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Yep - worked on girls who read Ann Rand - back in the ancient 60's - the first half decade - before the hippies.

Boy am I getting old or what.

heh heh heh
__________________
unclemick is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-31-2006, 06:51 PM   #55
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
2B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Houston
Posts: 4,330
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by unclemick2
Yep - worked on girls who read Ann Rand - back in the ancient 60's - the first half decade - before the hippies.

Boy am I getting old or what.

heh heh heh
You are old.

I tell my son that I dated girls before pantyhose. He just stares in disbelief.
__________________
The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane -- Marcus Aurelius
2B is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-31-2006, 08:25 PM   #56
Moderator Emeritus
Nords's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Oahu
Posts: 26,616
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2B
I tell my son that I dated girls before pantyhose.* He just stares in disbelief.
That'd get a much different reaction if you told him you only dated girls who didn't wear pantyhose...
__________________
*
*

The book written on E-R.org, "The Military Guide to Financial Independence and Retirement", on sale now! For more info see "About Me" in my profile.
I don't spend much time here anymore, so please send me a PM. Thanks.
Nords is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 07-31-2006, 08:55 PM   #57
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
HFWR's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Lawn chair in Texas
Posts: 12,964
Re: The Power of Makeup!

You, or the girls... :P
__________________
Have Funds, Will Retire

...not doing anything of true substance...
HFWR is offline   Reply With Quote
Re: The Power of Makeup!
Old 08-01-2006, 09:48 AM   #58
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
cute fuzzy bunny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Losing my whump
Posts: 22,697
Re: The Power of Makeup!

Great. First we got sean connery in a red diaper, now I expect we'll get burt reynolds in panty hose... :P :P :P
__________________

__________________
Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful. Just another form of "buy low, sell high" for those who have trouble with things. This rule is not universal. Do not buy a 1973 Pinto because everyone else is afraid of it.
cute fuzzy bunny is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
I-Shares and Power Shares vs Vanguard ETF Hydroman FIRE and Money 6 05-23-2007 09:37 AM
Solar power for boats Jay_Gatsby Other topics 14 06-01-2006 01:53 PM
Has anybody bought/used Neuton Power Mower? education Other topics 14 05-30-2006 10:27 PM
Laptop Power Jack -or- Get Rich Quick BigMoneyJim Other topics 4 03-02-2006 03:10 PM
Wind Generated Power REWahoo FIRE and Money 35 10-06-2005 01:14 PM

 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:40 PM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.