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Old 03-25-2009, 07:14 PM   #141
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I don't know what it shows (other than I'm a cheap b**tard) but I still have the last new car I bought, a 90 Astro van, still runs great at 240,000 miles and I intend to keep it as long as the original motor and transmission last. ER'd since December 2002. Incidentally, having an old truck like this saves you money in more than the expected ways... My wife was stopped by a cop for going over 65 (yes, it still does over 65) but let her go because he looked at the van and said..."i'll let you go since you obviously couldn't afford the fine - slow down!
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Old 03-25-2009, 09:03 PM   #142
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I don't know what it shows (other than I'm a cheap b**tard) but I still have the last new car I bought, a 90 Astro van, still runs great at 240,000 miles and I intend to keep it as long as the original motor and transmission last. ER'd since December 2002. Incidentally, having an old truck like this saves you money in more than the expected ways... My wife was stopped by a cop for going over 65 (yes, it still does over 65) but let her go because he looked at the van and said..."i'll let you go since you obviously couldn't afford the fine - slow down!
That's hilarious There are a lot of advantages for folks who have money to look lower income. I think about Sam Walton and the old pickup truck he drove. Anyone who didn't know who he was probably felt sorry for him.
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Old 03-25-2009, 09:27 PM   #143
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Our spending hasn't changed. Still have a vacation or two. Still have 3 vehicles ranging from 2003 to 2007, worth C$40K tops. Still the same house.

Should we lower our profile or just not raise it?
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Old 03-25-2009, 09:55 PM   #144
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Oh, please... Stop pretending, putting on camouflage and decoy.

You can fool your neighbors, friends, or cousins, but they do not matter.

To think that you can fool the guvmint is ludicrous.

It knows that you are rich, and you can't hide.
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Old 03-25-2009, 10:37 PM   #145
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Oh, please... Stop pretending, putting on camouflage and decoy.

You can fool your neighbors, friends, or cousins, but they do not matter.

To think that you can fool the guvmint is ludicrous.

It knows that you are rich, and you can't hide.
Your guvmint can't get my assets (see profile) unless they want another war. YMMV

My guvmint isn't interested YET. They don't have a drunken sailor in charge (YET).
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Old 03-26-2009, 01:23 AM   #146
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The thing with 'rich' is it is a sliding scale between income and networth. (picking semi-arbitrary numbers)

If you make greater than $400k year then you're rich.
If you have greater than $6mil in Net worth then you're rich.

If you have a $1-1.5mil net worth and zero income... not so much.
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Old 03-26-2009, 07:09 AM   #147
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I was rich once - I made more than 6k/yr.

1966.



heh heh heh -
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Old 03-26-2009, 09:09 AM   #148
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I agree, $1M is not a lot of money in the world of FIRE. But I haven't been immersed in this world long enough to have forgotten that, to most people, $1M is more money that they'll ever dream to have in their lifetime. You may not think of yourself as rich, but you better believe that if the average joe out there knew you had $1M in the bank, you'd be just another fat cat. You can rationalize it all you want, it doesn't change a thing... In the context of my question, what matters is other people's perception of your financial situation. Whether you think you are rich or not is irrelevant.
Little late to the party, but the foregoing sentence of FIREdreamer's post made me think of the fires of class warfare recently fanned by the media. Perception of your cushy financial situation is all that seems to matter. How you acquired your wealth is irrelevant (i.e., LBYM). How other people failed to acquire similar wealth is also irrelevant (i.e. spendthrift). The fact that you have it, and other people don't, makes you their enemy.
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:27 AM   #149
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Little late to the party, but the foregoing sentence of FIREdreamer's post made me think of the fires of class warfare recently fanned by the media. Perception of your cushy financial situation is all that seems to matter. How you acquired your wealth is irrelevant (i.e., LBYM). How other people failed to acquire similar wealth is also irrelevant (i.e. spendthrift). The fact that you have it, and other people don't, makes you their enemy.
And this is exactly in that context that I started this thread. I didn't want it to turn into a political thread, so I left out anything pertaining to "class warfare"...
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:39 AM   #150
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And this is exactly in that context that I started this thread. I didn't want it to turn into a political thread, so I left out anything pertaining to "class warfare"...
Sorry to bring it back in then. But it's actually more than just class warfare. It comes down to jealousy and an inability to take responsibility. People would rather claim something is "unfair" than face the reality that it really isn't. Personal wealth is something best kept to oneself since there is nothing to gain from disclosing it, except to make someone else feel miserable.
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:56 AM   #151
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Sorry to bring it back in then.
No need to apologize, I lost control of this thread many moons ago...
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Old 03-26-2009, 08:20 PM   #152
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I hope it will not become class warfare. The spendthrifts vs. the LBYM'ers. The "work till I croak" vs. the ERs. The latter groups will simply be labeled "rich".
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Old 03-26-2009, 09:11 PM   #153
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The assumption that $1 million in savings/retirement accounts makes a retiree rich is really laughable. A 4% withdrawal is, of course, only $40K, and the principle is subject to stock market crash. A nice government pension of $45000 probably has a present value much greater, a stable payout with little risk, but that person would be considered "middle class."

So, a lot of the people on this board are only "rich" in the sense that they know how to manage their money and their lifestyle so that they don't become a burden on society during downturns like this one.
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Old 03-26-2009, 10:53 PM   #154
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The assumption that $1 million in savings/retirement accounts makes a retiree rich is really laughable.
How I see it too. Even without the risk involved, the income stinks. When an autoworker makes >=$75,000 (one person), how is $40,000 rich?

Ha
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Old 03-26-2009, 11:01 PM   #155
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As some of us tried to point out, the ignoramuses (read majority of the people) do not understand the 4%SWR. As Firedreamer points out, perception may become political reality. What if they decide that these "rich" people must be soaked, or their SS reduced? Who cares if you have been a LBYM'er? The fact is that you have "more", and must "share".

I hope it will not happen, but stranger things have happened in my life.
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Old 03-27-2009, 07:04 AM   #156
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As some of us tried to point out, the ignoramuses (read majority of the people) do not understand the 4%SWR. As Firedreamer points out, perception may become political reality. What if they decide that these "rich" people must be soaked, or their SS reduced? Who cares if you have been a LBYM'er? The fact is that you have "more", and must "share".

I hope it will not happen, but stranger things have happened in my life.
Unfortunately, it already has to a certain degree. Mark my words, you will see an increase in the estate tax, which is essentially a wealth tax (and a transfer from the haves to the have nots). Somehow certain people believe it's unfair for the next generation to enjoy the fruits of the previous generation's sacrifices.
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Old 03-27-2009, 07:54 AM   #157
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Am I still keeping low profile.

Let's see.

Underware still torn and very thin, I can afford a new dozen, but what for?

Haven't washed car in 6 months, let the rain do it.

Go "grazing" in supermarket, pour myself a cup of soup, and sit there smiling to myself eating it. Flies still buzzing around me. Read the NY Post without paying, then put it back.

Tee shirt still stained.

Need to replace cardboard in shoes, bad for my thin socks.

Will never ever pay full retail.

However on Weekends, have no problem dropping big money on nice gourmet meal, however must wear good underwear, no stains, otherwise wife will kill me in sleep.

jug
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