Funny Story from When I Went to Business School..........

[MasterBlaster]

The last time I bought a new car I did the research, priced out the car on the internet found the local dealers who had the vehicle on the lot or one as close as I could get then asked for prices. The one I bought it from kept trying to put the purchase in terms of monthly payments. I told him the price I was willing to pay and left it at that. All negotiations were via e-mail. He would come back and say 600 for 72 months I would say, "No, 23000." He'd say ok how about 550 (or something I don't remember the exact numbers) for 60 months. I would say, "No, 23000." This went on until he finally relented and gave me the monthly payment for the term corresponding to the price I wanted. The price I was offering was a fair price where neither would get the short end.

 

[FinanceDude]

Well, when you are competing with a dozen other dealers and their rock bottom sales staff, I guess it could be pretty hard.

As a dealership, your job is to maximize profit. As a customer, your job is to minimize profit for the dealer...........a true conundrum..........

I know $400 an hour corporate attorneys that have driven to Chicago to buy a BMW and save $100.........

 

[73ss454]

For many people buying a car is a game. No matter how much money they have or earn they want to nickle and dime the dealer.

Internet buyers often pay too much for cars also. They think that just because it's on the internet it's the best deal. Do you think dealers have internet people to lose money.

 

[FinanceDude]

Well, I am trying to help, but I guess 7 years working in a dealership doesn't hold much water on here...........

I figure I signed off on over 5000 deals in my career........since I desked most of the deals and had the final call on if we were going to sell a vehicle and at what price.........

But if justin believes he gets the best deal on the Internet, we're not going to talk him out of it..........he is after all, paid to argue...........

 

[audreyh1]

Buying a car is easy. Do it online! I sent out request for quotes for a very specific configuration. No replies from half the dealers. Another few got back but wanted me to give them the info again - duh! One dealer replied with the exact quote I asked for with prices spelled out. It was a good deal even compared to the Edmunds (was that it?) website.

I followed up with phone call request for quote from a couple of other dealers "just to make sure". They quoted way too high.

Seriously - the last three cars we have researched and bought through the internet, and it was very straightforward.

Audrey

 

[73ss454]

FD, working in a dealership for 7 years is more than enough.

I retired after 34 years working in a car dealership last friday. I think I'll also buy my cars on the internet because I don't want to go into a dealership ever again.

If you think you got a good then it's a good deal....

 

[FinanceDude]

FD, working in a dealership for 7 years is more than enough.

I retired after 34 years working in a car dealership last friday. I think I'll also buy my cars on the internet because I don't want to go into a dealership ever again.

If you think you got a good then it's a good deal....

Were you in parts, sales, service, management, or all of them??

You can make good money, but it's kind of like a fraternity of sorts........the only folks who know what really goes on are those who were actually in the business.......I suppose it's that way for a lot of folks.........

Stay healthy.........my neighbor was the parts manager at a local Ford store, and retired at 53 after 35 years there, and died of a massive heart attack 2 months later............

 

[73ss454]

I spent the last 20+ years in a Ford store. Sold cars for the first 7 years and F&I for 27.
27 years in the box should have killed me by now. That's why I got out before I died in there.

There was an article a few years ago about a guy who worked for Edmunds and was going undercover into dealers. He was going to sell cars and report back all the dirty things the dealers did. Well it didn't take him long to figure out that it was hell and the article change to sympathy for the dealers and salespeople. You may be able to find it at the Edmunds site.

 

[riskadverse]

Everybody thinks they got a good deal on a car - walk in, internet, brother in law, you name it. The name of the game is . . . make the customer think they got a good deal.

 

[justin]

But if justin believes he gets the best deal on the Internet, we're not going to talk him out of it..........he is after all, paid to argue...........

I'm paid to argue?? What does that mean??

I'm just presenting my little method of getting a reasonably good deal on a car. I don't really care if I squeeze every last dollar of the dealer's profit out of a deal. I just want a relatively hassle-free way to get a reasonably good deal. I've found the internet sales staff to be more up front and easier to work with than the sleazeballs sitting at the sales desk at the dealership. Why would I go and sit at a single dealership working with one guy who has to "go see if the sales manager can approve that low price you're asking for" four or five times for 20 minutes at a time? For me, time is money. Someone gives me the runaround, I walk out or hang up the phone. Done. There's another guy that likes my green money and will make me a deal.

 

[justin]

There was an article a few years ago about a guy who worked for Edmunds and was going undercover into dealers. He was going to sell cars and report back all the dirty things the dealers did. Well it didn't take him long to figure out that it was hell and the article change to sympathy for the dealers and salespeople. You may be able to find it at the Edmunds site.

I think you posted the link to that article on here a while back. It was a very long account, but I read it anyway and it provided a good introduction to the car sales business for the unfamiliar.

 

[73ss454]

You are right Justin, I had mentioned it and someone else had the link. I don't remember what it was but it was fun to read.

 

[REWahoo]

I'm paid to argue?? What does that mean??

We're lawyers. We get paid to disagree.

 

[Sheryl]

OK, you guys have totally depressed me. I just want a danged new car and not to be ripped off.

There are not enough dealers within a 100 mile radius of here to make shopping them against each other profitable.

I think I will just do the internet research and contact them as Audrey suggested.

F. Dude, if you've got any advice, let me know!

 

[justin]

Sheryl, try carsdirect.com to see what kind of a price quote they give you, and use that as your backup plan. Negotiate down from there.

 

[justin]

"We're lawyers. We get paid to disagree."

Oh, I'm not a real lawyer!

 

[MasterBlaster]

There was an article a few years ago about a guy who worked for Edmunds and was going undercover into dealers. He was going to sell cars and report back all the dirty things the dealers did. Well it didn't take him long to figure out that it was hell and the article change to sympathy for the dealers and salespeople. You may be able to find it at the Edmunds site.

Here's the link to the Edmunds undercover car salesman writeup...

http://www.edmunds.com/advice/buying/articles/42962/article.html

it's a pretty long story but very interesting.

 

[REWahoo]

Oh, I'm not a real lawyer!

That would make you an unreal one?

 

[HFWR]

Thank Allah I only buy a car every 8-10 years...

 

[justin]

That would make you an unreal one?

Just a non-lawyer. Although the CEO of the company I work for keeps refering to me as an attorney or "his corporate attorney" (I graduated from law school, but never took the bar exam). I know just enough about the law to be dangerous...

 

[FinanceDude]

I'll agree with a lot of the stuff he founs out. However, the part abou changing the numbers AFTER the customer initialed the paperwork never happened in the dealerships I worked in.

But I admit I overpaid for trades and went deep into holdback to move cars, particularly at the end of the month, or on bad weather days.......

The 4-square was our method also, we called it "payment-downpayment"...........

If I find an old list of "closes" we used, I'll post it on here. Here's a few:

Puppy Dog Close: Let the customer take the vehicle home, and then they have to have it.

Takeaway Close: I'm sorry, it sounds like we're too far apart, I don't want to waste your time or mine...........

This or That Close: Would you like THIS car at the payment you want, or THAT car with the options you WANT at $75 a month more

Another manager had his own version of the "up-to" close, and I'll share it:

Manager: So what monthly payment are you budgeting?
Customer: $250 a month.......
Manager: Up to
Customer: uhhh.......$275 a month
Manager: Not to exceed?
Customer: $300 a month...........
Manager: And if you find you love this car more than life itself the most you are prepared to pay is??...........(said quickly)
Customer: $325........that's ALL I can pay!!

So the salesman just "bumped" the customer $75 a month in about 1 minute............I didn't believe this would work, but saw a few good salesman work it like a charm.......

 

[youbet]

For many people buying a car is a game.

Yep. It can be a bit of a pita researching and deciding what brand, model, options, etc., fill your needs in the MSRP range you're interested in. But once you know exactly what you want, negotiating does turn into an interesting game. I'd probably feel differently if I had to purchase my car from a small list of dealerships or in a short time frame. But I live in a major metropolitan area and have never had to rush a purchase. If I keep the right mental outlook on the process, it actually has some entertainment value!

Never having time constraints to finalize the purchase really is the key to not having the process seem like self-imposed purgatory. It keeps you free to laugh and walk at any stage of the deal for any reason. And we haven't purchased a car with time payments since our 1970 VW Beetle right after finishing undergrad school.

I used the internet as a supplemental tool for the past two cars and found that method to be very beneficial.

Still, doing this every few years is often enough!

 

[FinanceDude]

I find it funny people think that Carmax is going to pay "top dollar" for your trade........ I used to buy cars at auctions, and appraise them for the dealerships I worked at, and I NEVER overpaid for a car that some guy just wanted me to buy, who bought a car ELSEWHERE..............

MOD EDIT Removed incorrect quote (and fixed a typo ).

 

[youbet]

I find it funny people think that Carmax is going to pa "top dollar" for your trade........ I used to buy cars at auctions, and appraise them for the dealerships I worked at, and I NEVER overpaid for a car that some guy just wanted me to buy, who bought a car ELSEWHERE..............

FD, I think you placed your comments below the wrong quote. I mentioned nothing about Carmax or trade-ins. Perhaps you meant to click on "reply" but inadvertantly chose "quote" instead?

 

[FinanceDude]

FD, I think you placed your comments below the wrong quote. I mentioned nothing about Carmax or trade-ins. Perhaps you meant to click on "reply" but inadvertantly chose "quote" instead?

OOPPPPSSSSSSSSS......my bad...........