Housing Crisis? Maybe the problem is how few communities in America are attractive.

[Danmar]

I am curious about something, since you bring multiple dwellings up: how do you maintain all 3? One of the showstoppers for me in being tempted to acquire a rural cabin is that I simply cannot imagine having the time to deal with more than one house to maintain.

Use property management co's for 2 of the properties, the Toronto condo is lock and go. Ontario lake house takes some attention, but well worth it. Property management has become a bir of a hobbie. Certainly not for everyone but I enjoy the whole thing. You might be surprised as to what you can manage. Agree not for most. But I love it.

 

[haha]

We have a yard with trees in a walkable area near mass transit, parks and open space.

A few years ago anyway this sort of place was easy to find, but expensive in many fairly urban East Bay Communities. I lived on North Campus side in Berkeley. I worked downtown Berkeley on Shattuck Street. It was a 15 minute walk, down a typical leafy, pleasant Berkeley street..My building was a home converted into a 5 plex. We often gathered in the evening for drinks in the back yard.

I don't get all the worry about no trees, too much concrete, the horrors of someone living on the other side of a wall. 2 blocks from where I live there are nice, well designed town homes with decent light on all 4 sides. They have 2 downsides. They cost plenty, like $1mm and up. Also, you have to be young to handle all the up and down. Aging in place would take some luck.

Many US cities everywhere except the bombed out shotgun house districts in the poor parts of eastern US cities have nice, very pleasant neighborhoods. They just tend to cost a lot.

I think the majority here favor suburbs, and luckily this is an area where many of us still have choice. But I'm like Greenspun, give me the city. Not an ugly, frightening South Bronx version, but one of the many nice central city neighborhoods all over America. Likely none of them are cheap now, but as other posters have said, that isn't important except to decide whether you can handle the cost. I have friends who raised their families in the 80s in the same Seattle neighborhood where I am living now. Looking back, they didn't miss anything that I got by moving out for that phase of my life. Today however it would be hard for most people to afford the large 1920s single family homes that they occupied.

Today I had to do a lot of little errands that most places would have taken me multiple trips to Lowes, etc.etc. But I got 12,000 steps and 32 floors, just pleasantly walking around in a 6x10 block area. I never have to eat fast food or pay for a meal that I am not looking forward to enjoying because I have to stack car-trips to avoid more miles. I just walk home and eat. Today I also walked 2 blocks to a little park and did some sunbathing. And cities bigger than Seattle just add more social and cultural features, for more money but no important deletions from quality of life.

The more I think about this, the more I think the issue is money, whether you want to live somewhere where you own the whole mountain top, or in an attractive lively neighborhood in a central city.

Ha

 

[38Chevy454]

Job location has a lot to do with what housing situation you can choose. So does personal preference and what you prefer for living. If your job is only in big city central downtown, you either live in high density walking range or suburbs and tolerate the commute. For this exact reason many will work in the suburbs, even if less money potential, for quality of life reasons.

I can't ever be happy in a big city high density housing. Even suburb apartment or condo drives me nuts. Give me land space and even outside suburb limits and I am happier. Yardwork and upkeep are not a bad thing to me. I like my cars and freedom to drive where and when i want. No buses and loud smelly city out here in the country. One of the main reasons I am much happier being out of SF bay area suburbs where I used to live, although I will admit I had it pretty good there considering my commute was only 6 miles. However a long commute now here would not be as much fun, fortunately I have an easy drive, 23 miles and about 25 minutes.

Back to the orig question, housing crisis is probably driven by good vs bad neighborhoods and limited options for good areas in the cities.

 

[NW-Bound]

...
The more I think about this, the more I think the issue is money, whether you want to live somewhere where you own the whole mountain top, or in an attractive lively neighborhood in a central city...

Yes, that's what it boils down to: having more money allows one more choices.

I do not care to live in the LA area, but that's only because I do not have enough money. If I did, Pacific Palisades would be very livable.

However, I would not care to live in an apartment overlooking Central Park NYC, even if I had that kind of money. It just does not fit my personality.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

A few years ago anyway this sort of place was easy to find, but expensive in many fairly urban East Bay Communities. I lived on North Campus side in Berkeley. I worked downtown Berkeley on Shattuck Street. It was a 15 minute walk, down a typical leafy, pleasant Berkeley street..My building was a home converted into a 5 plex. We often gathered in the evening for drinks in the back yard.

I just got a library card from the Berkeley public library. The tie dyed version!

 

[Mulligan]

Yes, that's what it boils down to: having more money allows one more choices.

I do not care to live in the LA area, but that's only because I do not have enough money. If I did, Pacific Palisades would be very livable.

However, I would not care to live in an apartment overlooking Central Park NYC, even if I had that kind of money. It just does not fit my personality.

Money can even change the meaning of "apartments and condos". In my middle class world those terms remind me of 800-1700 sq. ft and the potential for noisy neighbors. Some of those buildings near Central Park have 3000 plus square foot "apartment and condos" in them. I call that a house!


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[NW-Bound]

Sure. Some of them take up an entire floor. And I am sure that the rich neighbors or building cotenants are all very nice.

Still, when you get down to the streets, it is still crowded. With money, you do not have to take the metro, and can take a cab or even a limousine to go to your favorite restaurants, but in traffic jams you still breathe exhaust fumes. Ugh! That's not quality life for me.

 

[Mulligan]

Sure. Some of them take up an entire floor. And I am sure that the rich neighbors or building cotenants are all very nice.

Still, when you get down to the streets, it is still crowded. With money, you do not have to take the metro, and can take a cab or even a limousine to go to your favorite restaurants, but in traffic jams you still breathe exhaust fumes. Ugh! That's not quality life for me.

Crowds are something I am just too late in life to deal with except for the usual suspects of vacations, ball games, or concerts. In my small town world if someone is walking next to you and not giving you 10 feet spacing they must be an oddball or idiot. I am not used to banging shoulders while walking.


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[Danmar]

Yes agree that crowds are uncomfortable. I think that is why we don't enjoy the Toronto condo as much as we used to. Traffic is awful, construction everywhere and the Pan Am games start next week. Ugh!

 

[Tree-dweller]

We have lived in a close suburb of a major eastern city for 30 years. We bought this modest sfh when we wed specifically because of the well regarded schoool system and the reasonably short commute to the city where we both worked. The house is in a nondescript neighborhood, where neighbors keep to themselves, but it worked for us. Now empty nesters, we have an itch for living in a "destination" area, be it waterside or cityside. For admittedly shallow reasons, we want to live somewhere fun for us, and fun for future visitors so they can easily entertain themselves. That doesn't describe the practical but boring suburb we moved to so many years ago. So we go out on our weekend open-house jaunts, then come back to our modest ranch with single level living and think, "Ya know, this really ain't so bad." Torn.
Somehow I think there are many others here rowing that same boat.

 

[haha]

Sure. Some of them take up an entire floor. And I am sure that the rich neighbors or building cotenants are all very nice.

Still, when you get down to the streets, it is still crowded. With money, you do not have to take the metro, and can take a cab or even a limousine to go to your favorite restaurants, but in traffic jams you still breathe exhaust fumes. Ugh! That's not quality life for me.

Some of them were mean to Richard and Pat Nixon Remember that one or more coop boards refused to let them in? You get the black ball, Tricky!

Ha

 

[Danmar]

We have lived in a close suburb of a major eastern city for 30 years. We bought this modest sfh when we wed specifically because of the well regarded schoool system and the reasonably short commute to the city where we both worked. The house is in a nondescript neighborhood, where neighbors keep to themselves, but it worked for us. Now empty nesters, we have an itch for living in a "destination" area, be it waterside or cityside. For admittedly shallow reasons, we want to live somewhere fun for us, and fun for future visitors so they can easily entertain themselves. That doesn't describe the practical but boring suburb we moved to so many years ago. So we go out on our weekend open-house jaunts, then come back to our modest ranch with single level living and think, "Ya know, this really ain't so bad." Torn.
Somehow I think there are many others here rowing that same boat.

As they say "you only live once". Why not make a change? As long as the finances work. Destination locations are usually fairly expensive. I think I might be be a little bored if we were in your position too. All our places would be considered " destinations".
Having "fun" in retirement is important I think. Lots of different ways to do this of course but where you live can certainly be a factor.

 

[Ronstar]

We have lived in a close suburb of a major eastern city for 30 years. We bought this modest sfh when we wed specifically because of the well regarded schoool system and the reasonably short commute to the city where we both worked. The house is in a nondescript neighborhood, where neighbors keep to themselves, but it worked for us. Now empty nesters, we have an itch for living in a "destination" area, be it waterside or cityside. For admittedly shallow reasons, we want to live somewhere fun for us, and fun for future visitors so they can easily entertain themselves. That doesn't describe the practical but boring suburb we moved to so many years ago. So we go out on our weekend open-house jaunts, then come back to our modest ranch with single level living and think, "Ya know, this really ain't so bad." Torn.
Somehow I think there are many others here rowing that same boat.

We're rowing the same boat. I haven't got to the open house stage yet. I can't find a place to downsize to that meets our criteria so we'll stay put until we do. I need a DW approved 1500 sf single level home on the edge of suburbia close to recreational activities. Can't even find a location that we like and agree on. The search could go on for years.

 

[kcowan]

Surely the issue is the change in lifestyle that accompanies retirement. I lived on an acreage but faced a 25 mile train ride to get into work. Once retired, that acreage no longer met our needs and the commute into town became intolerable, especially with the lousy service outside of commuter times.

Although we could stay active, our community was geared to young families, and so we moved. One size seldom fits all when you move through the stages of life.

 

[karen1972]

I think its about planning communities.. so we moved from Chicago burbs to apartment in Raleigh and we have looked at similar places in Denver and Texas. The new hot thing is Resort living..ie your apartment complex is in the middle of a walkable space, but the complex itself creates the park like environment one wants with outdoor areas and large club house that's similar to a nice resort with lots of amenities. We never hear our neighbors and the kitchen and bathrooms are made extra large. Its really the best of all worlds and great for empty nesters or people with a single kid (once your past that sure more space may be desirable). There are plenty of 3 bedroom apartments that are as big as most houses. You are typically walkable to at least a few coffee shops, a market, a target or Walmart, a movie theater, and a few bars. You don't get the road traffic and most are young professionals or near retirees thus not being loud or disrespectful. It doesn't work in huge cities like NYC, but can work well is more sprawled out cities like Denver, San Jose, etc. However, like in Denver I heard most of condo construction has stopped due to new regulation, leaving the ones that are out there left as rent so they can charge massive premiums to the huge influx of 20 somethings. You can't buy a place in boulder without outbidding 20 other people.

 

[haha]

You can't buy a place in boulder without outbidding 20 other people.

This often means it is best to wait out the press and if you are still interested try again under more favorable circumstances.

In many areas I have felt fine about "good enough", as opposed to best. I'll happily buy pork when beef is expensive. But some things really matter. Do you want to marry any wallflower, thus having to beat fewer competitors, or the woman you want? (Assuming that women or marriage are interesting) Do you want to be near the mountains, or in them? Near the beach, or at it?

Luck helps, as does timing, as does having more than enough money.

Ha

 

[Danmar]

This often means it is best to wait out the press and if you are still interested try again under more favorable circumstances.

In many areas I have felt fine about "good enough", as opposed to best. I'll happily buy pork when beef is expensive. But some things really matter. Do you want to marry any wallflower, thus having to beat fewer competitors, or the woman you want? (Assuming that women or marriage are interesting) Do you want to be near the mountains, or in them? Near the beach, or at it?

Luck helps, as does timing, as does having more than enough money.

Ha

Agree. Some things just have to be "right". Which things will depend on the person. Real estate may be one of these things. Eg. Location, location, location. Within reason of course.

 

[LOL!]

Here is an article about a US map of property values by county that seems appropriate for this thread:
A Map of the U.S. by Property Value Instead of Land Area - CityLab

It kind of shows where people want to live and work. The article has a fantastic morphing of regular map geometry to property value geometry. It's worth a look.

Map from Max Galka / Metrocosm

 

[JoeWras]

Looks like a diseased organ.

Go to the link to see the pulsing graphic. It helps you zero in on specific counties.

Very interesting way to map things! I like it.

 

[ERD50]

Cool, I'm curious if I can link to the animation (gif):

I guess so!

-ERD50

 

[NW-Bound]

Looks like a diseased organ...

OMG! We have cancer growing all over the place. The pulsating nightmarish thing makes it difficult to pinpoint my home. Oh lordy, we may be inside one of the blobs ourselves.

 

[FUEGO]

Cool, we end up in a small red nodule next to the DC metro area monstrosity even though we're 2 states away.

 

[JoeWras]

Cool, we end up in a small red nodule next to the DC metro area monstrosity even though we're 2 states away.

It's ok FUEGO. Not sure about you, but I'm glad we're not a tumor yet.

Afraid we will be some day.