Join Early Retirement Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 07-29-2012, 09:47 AM   #61
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by donheff View Post
You were not listening. It was just with some assistance from the government, like the Army, Navy, Air Force and Marines, and the fire department, police, roads, sewers, water systems, schools and a few things like that. Other than that and your parents, and maybe your employees if you were a business owner you were on your own.
Hmmmmmm..... Don, while I completely agree that we need shared services generally provided by the gov't, it's not like the gov't provides these things as an act of kindness and benevolence. The gov't is simply aggregating resources we provide and executing the services with those resources at our direction.

The human resources involved, with the exception of those impacted by the now defunct military draft, all seem to be well paid and anxious to perform.
__________________

__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 Early Retirement and Financial Independence Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

Are you planning to be financially independent as early as possible so you can live life on your own terms? Discuss successful investing strategies, asset allocation models, tax strategies and other related topics in our online forum community. Our members range from young folks just starting their journey to financial independence, military retirees and even multimillionaires. No matter where you fit in you'll find that Early-Retirement.org is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with our members, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create a retirement blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 07-29-2012, 10:20 AM   #62
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,420
Many people here worked extra years to ensure a safety factor of 2X or better. Just so single people do not think married guys got it made.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marita40 View Post
So, if I can ask. . .is everyone here a millionaire? Just curious.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rescueme View Post
No. Some are multi-M's, according to prior polls ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelover View Post
Some are 1/2 millionaires, .....their wives just haven't told them yet.
__________________

__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 11:40 AM   #63
gone traveling
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 3,851
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
(snip) Just so single people do not think married guys got it made.
As for me?

I'm glad what I "have" rather than "what may be" (yes, I love my DW).

As an (old) married guy, I have no regrets - and yes, i've got it made ...
__________________
rescueme is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 12:00 PM   #64
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
NW-Bound's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 19,420
I don't believe I will ever have to split the $$ either, but many posters here did have to.

In any event, it takes more to feed 2 mouths, so married guys need more than single people anyway.

PS. Come to think of it, I usually eat 2X to 3X what my wife does. She also does not drink, so all the beer and booze are just for me. I guess I have won big too!

PPS. On yet another 2nd thought, love takes two. So, happy married guys should not be complacent either.
__________________
"Old age is the most unexpected of all things that can happen to a man" -- Leon Trotsky
NW-Bound is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 12:32 PM   #65
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by NW-Bound View Post
........so married guys need more than single people anyway
There's the understatement of the day!
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 01:36 PM   #66
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
donheff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 8,643
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
Hmmmmmm..... Don, while I completely agree that we need shared services generally provided by the gov't, it's not like the gov't provides these things as an act of kindness and benevolence. The gov't is simply aggregating resources we provide and executing the services with those resources at our direction.
Isn't that the purpose of government? Not sure why kindness and benevolence even enters into the discussion. Your hmmmm implies that you think I somehow disagree?
__________________
Every man is, or hopes to be, an Idler. -- Samuel Johnson
donheff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 01:57 PM   #67
Moderator Emeritus
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,929
Quote:
Originally Posted by donheff
Isn't that the purpose of government? Not sure why kindness and benevolence even enters into the discussion. Your hmmmm implies that you think I somehow disagree?
Eh? The purpose of government is to provide the instrumentality through which the economic elite and policy planning networks wield power. The form of government determines the efficiency of the instrumentality.

If standardized road systems, utilities, and protective services such as fire departments suit their needs, then we can have them. Unsuitable or undesirable services that do not meet the policy requirements won't happen, or will be dismantled.


Bottomore, T. (1993). Elites and Society (2nd ed.). London: Routledge

Schwartz, M. (ed.) (1987). The Structure of Power in America: The Corporate Elite as a Ruling Class. New York: Holmes & Meier. ISBN 0-8419-0764-1.

Putnam, Robert D. (1977). "Elite Transformation in Advance Industrial Societies: An Empirical Assessment of the Theory of Technocracy". Comparative Political Studies 10 (3): 383–411
__________________
M Paquette is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 02:05 PM   #68
Full time employment: Posting here.
NYEXPAT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Miraflores,Peru
Posts: 880
One word....... PLASTIC!
__________________
NYEXPAT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 05:28 PM   #69
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Kansas City
Posts: 7,408
Quote:
Originally Posted by donheff View Post
I knew that -- I was too.
Me too. Me too. I actually made it doing nothing - except posting on this forum.

Heh heh heh - unless you call watching Mr Market and tearing dryer sheets in half work.

P.S. I liked Bernstein's version/speculation/theories in his The Birth of Plenty.
__________________
unclemick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 06:41 PM   #70
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Nemo2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Belleville, ONT
Posts: 4,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by NYEXPAT View Post
One word....... PLASTIC!
Hi, Mrs Robinson.
__________________
"Exit, pursued by a bear."

The Winter's Tale, William Shakespeare
Nemo2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 06:45 PM   #71
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Nemo2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Belleville, ONT
Posts: 4,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
Hmmmmmm..... Don, while I completely agree that we need shared services generally provided by the gov't, it's not like the gov't provides these things as an act of kindness and benevolence. The gov't is simply aggregating resources we provide and executing the services with those resources at our direction.
If the government is credited for providing services such as roads, etc, thus making the 'winners' winners, isn't it logical to claim that the government is also responsible for the 'losers' to whom the same services have been supplied?
__________________
"Exit, pursued by a bear."

The Winter's Tale, William Shakespeare
Nemo2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 06:47 PM   #72
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,889
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemo2 View Post
If the government is credited for providing services such as roads, etc, thus making the 'winners' winners, isn't it logical to claim that the government is also responsible for the 'losers' to whom the same services have been supplied?
You mean like railroads?
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 06:55 PM   #73
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Nemo2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Belleville, ONT
Posts: 4,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelover View Post
You mean like railroads?
All services are there for the using....some people do, others don't.
__________________
"Exit, pursued by a bear."

The Winter's Tale, William Shakespeare
Nemo2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 06:59 PM   #74
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
travelover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,889
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nemo2 View Post
All services are there for the using....some people do, others don't.

Perhaps the rail cars could be retrofitted with rubber tires.
__________________
Yes, I have achieved work / life balance.
travelover is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-29-2012, 07:09 PM   #75
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Nemo2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Belleville, ONT
Posts: 4,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelover View Post
Perhaps the rail cars could be retrofitted with rubber tires.
Kinda like this?
__________________
"Exit, pursued by a bear."

The Winter's Tale, William Shakespeare
Nemo2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 05:06 PM   #76
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
youbet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 9,965
Quote:
Originally Posted by donheff View Post
Isn't that the purpose of government? Not sure why kindness and benevolence even enters into the discussion. Your hmmmm implies that you think I somehow disagree?
Your post seemed to imply that "the gov't" deserved some sort of credit for the achievements of the successful as though it was some sort of independent entity apart from the citizens who formed it and fund it. My pov is the gov't is a subset of the citizens. The successful citizens provide the resources and frequently the direction for shared services to be provided and delivered. There is no need for them to share credit with some perceived second party named "gov't." They are the gov't.

Of course here in Illinois, the politicians have a completely different view of the role of gov't...........
__________________
"I wasn't born blue blood. I was born blue-collar." John Wort Hannam
youbet is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 06:12 PM   #77
Moderator
rodi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: San Diego
Posts: 8,817
I didn't see anyone mention the way many get to $1M.
Having the good luck/fate to have wealthy parents.
Even if they don't inherit - they are usually able to go to better schools, without accruing student debt, making the connections with future board room buddies.

I've seen studies that show the best indicator of financial success is the wealth of the parents.
__________________
rodi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 06:48 PM   #78
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
donheff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 8,643
Quote:
Originally Posted by youbet View Post
The successful citizens provide the resources and frequently the direction for shared services to be provided and delivered. There is no need for them to share credit with some perceived second party named "gov't." They are the gov't.
But some of them act like the government, their fellow citizens, and their employees don't even count in the equation. As you say, the citizens are the government and the government provides the foundation on which the successful build their success. They owe a debt to America just like everyone. Some seem to be saying the government (i.e. all their fellow citizens) owe them for being the job creators. Or, as your first sentence above could be construed (not as you intended I suspect) -- that some elite undefined subset of citizens, the " successful citizens" provide the resources and direction for government.
__________________
Every man is, or hopes to be, an Idler. -- Samuel Johnson
donheff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 07:54 PM   #79
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso)
Give me a forum ...
freebird5825's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: East Nowhere, 43N Latitude, NY
Posts: 9,017
Ask these 3 lovely ladies...bonus points if you solve the riddle.

__________________
"All our dreams can come true, if we have the courage to pursue them." - Walt Disney
freebird5825 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-30-2012, 08:02 PM   #80
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Nemo2's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Belleville, ONT
Posts: 4,319
Quote:
Originally Posted by freebird5825 View Post
Ask these 3 lovely ladies...bonus points if you solve the riddle.

Ah, 1953.....I remember it well.
__________________

__________________
"Exit, pursued by a bear."

The Winter's Tale, William Shakespeare
Nemo2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


 

 
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:56 AM.
 
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.