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Old 07-13-2016, 09:05 AM   #81
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Thanks very much clifp. You've articulated something I've long thought might be the case far better than I could.
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:37 AM   #82
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Thanks very much clifp. You've articulated something I've long thought might be the case far better than I could.
+1

I really hope clifp doesn't get in trouble for revealing the secret sauce recipe.
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Old 07-13-2016, 11:39 AM   #83
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In contrast, Wellesley is constantly looking at both stocks and bonds and deciding what is the best way to get income from a corporation, buy bonds or buy stocks. I'm a pretty sophisticated investor, but I'm pretty clueless on how to determine I'm a better of buying Wells Fargo stock with 3.1% yield or Wells Fargo 2025 bond with the same yield. I suspect that most firms and fund managers that only buy bonds or only buy stocks aren't be that much smarter.

So moving forward, I think Wellseley will continue to provide Alpha because their balanced approached to stocks and bonds is pretty unique and not easily replicated.
There's probably something to that, though Wellesley is also bound to their stated objective of a 35/65 to 40/60 stock/bond mix. They may have to decide in your example that the WF stock is a better investment than the bond, but they go with the bond because it's close enough and they need more bonds for their stated AA.
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Old 07-13-2016, 02:36 PM   #84
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+1

I really hope clifp doesn't get in trouble for revealing the secret sauce recipe.
Actually, I really think the sauce is three parts A1, one Part Siracha, and a dab of Dijon Mustard.
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Old 07-14-2016, 05:04 AM   #85
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HMMMM....Back to the original post. When Kevin stated he saw the returns to be better than the Boglehead 3 fund, no one really showed an argument. In the following link I entered the two W's in a chart against the 3 Bogle funds since 2001. Over the long haul what can be argued? I really am open to more allocation diversity with indexing, but the chart is fairly clear on what did best over time.
PerfCharts - StockCharts.com - Free Charts
Does the chart include dividends? Many times I have seen charts like this that don't include them...

Also, VWINX has lower expenses (admiral share) and it would have a higher return than VWAIX.

Yes, I have a lot of Wellesley.

See ya,

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Old 07-14-2016, 12:59 PM   #86
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If you put an_ under score in front of the mutual fund symbolit will display without Dividends. __VWIAX is the admiral shares symbol for Wellesley without dividends.




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Old 07-14-2016, 02:13 PM   #87
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If you put an_ under score in front of the mutual fund symbolit will display without Dividends. __VWIAX is the admiral shares symbol for Wellesley without dividends.

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Nice! Thanks I didn't know that...

See ya,

W
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Old 07-14-2016, 03:25 PM   #88
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Personally I can really see having up to 25% of total assets in Wellesley but I'm too much of a Boglehead to not have broadly diversified index funds as my core holdings. That said, my wife and I have agreed (and put it in our investment plan) that if at any point either of us aren't sharp enough to deal with rebalancing or other aspects of monitoring things we'll go to 50:50 Vanguard Lifestrategy Conservative Growth and Wellesley and call it a day.
Good point kevink. Have been thinking what to do if the "wealth manager" (me!) has "issues". I like the idea of splitting between Wellesley in DW's IRA and perhaps a Vanguard indexed 60/40 balanced fund in my IRA.

I too am a late convert Boglehead and indexer, but I doubt DW would want to bother with rebalancing and figuring out what to sell (bonds?, stocks?, which ones?). It's a good reminder for other folks too that some sort of simple crash plan is needed if the in-house money manager is unavailable for any length of time.

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