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Old 05-19-2015, 03:14 PM   #41
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In a give and take scenario I certainly agree. My siblings have never asked for a loan but if they did, I would certainly trust them and hope vice versa as well. As far as my daughter goes.... No more fish, its time you got the pole handed to you instead...... Go catch some yourself now.


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My sisters believe in the give and take scenario - where everyone else gives, and they take. They know better than to ever try that routine with me, however. I would shut them down before the words were out of their mouth. The only reason they have money issues is because they live far beyond their means. One of these days reality will come knocking at their doors, when they finally exhaust all the suckers who fall for their "poor me" routines.
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Old 06-07-2015, 08:27 PM   #42
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I haven't had any loan requests yet but I've had my siblings introduce me to other people as there rich brother. I'm not rich but certainly financially secure and it made the introduction very awkward.

I come from a large family and most of them live paycheck to paycheck and retirement is only a dream. Sort of weird to say this but at times, I feel out of place at family gatherings because of our secure income.

Arriving at a family members house driving a new car or maybe after returning from a fancy vacation isn't easy. I'm forced not to say anything about purchases or vacations simply because of the friction.
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Old 06-07-2015, 09:36 PM   #43
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I haven't ever been asked for a loan except once 30 years ago after I had offered a loan the day before. My brother was unemployed with a wife and two kids so I asked if he needed a loan, he said no then the next day his frig broke. He paid back with interest as soon as he could.
Now I am in the gifting mode, my dad gifted us money 30 years ago and now we are the older generation. I have given 7-10K each to nieces and nephews or great nephew, they know better than to ask and would starve first. I enjoy it and they know it is a gift I wouldn't let them treat as a loan. I try to give when it would do some good like when they want a house or going to college. Last year I gave the 19 year old 10K to his college might do it again, or not. He is now working two summer jobs and has a school job but is acting like it is ok to just borrow whatever it takes for tuition so I think he might waste any help and just borrow and spend. I will hold off to see how he matures, maybe nice graduation gift.
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Old 06-08-2015, 10:23 AM   #44
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No such thing as a loan to family, it is a gift that occasionally gets paid back.
I agree with this. I also feel, based a lot on what I've learned on this forum, that I need to keep my net worth to myself in order to avoid being asked for money in the future.
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Old 06-08-2015, 11:06 AM   #45
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Polonius had it right way back when. Hamlet, Act I, Scene 3.

Neither a borrower nor a lender be,
For loan oft loses both itself and friend,
And borrowing dulls the edge of husbandry.

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Originally Posted by travelover
No such thing as a loan to family, it is a gift that occasionally gets paid back.


And as the other wise sage - Judge Judy - often says, never lend money to friends or family. If you want them to have some money, give it to them without expecting repayment. Otherwise, the "lender" somehow becomes the bad guy when asking for repayment.
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Old 06-08-2015, 11:33 AM   #46
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And as the other wise sage - Judge Judy - often says, never lend money to friends or family. If you want them to have some money, give it to them without expecting repayment. Otherwise, the "lender" somehow becomes the bad guy when asking for repayment.
[/I][/QUOTE]

We made the mistake of lending to a deadbeat BIL. The week before Christmas he gave me his first check as part of a monthly payback (10% of the loan amount per month).

Now, I had the choice to of taking money from him the week before Christmas or saying "hey, it's Christmas, pay me later".

I just knew that if I didn't take the money, he'd feel perfectly fine with not paying me anything more. In his mind, he'd be off the hook completely. "You said 'never mind'..."

I took the check; never saw another dime! And yes, I was the bad guy for taking money the week before Christmas.

I was out the loan amount either way (and knew it at the time) but at least I got one payment!
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Old 06-08-2015, 01:08 PM   #47
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OTOH, one could turn a negative into a positive:
Once a deadbeat relative doesn't repay the loan, they're unlikely to go back to you asking for more.

"...you still owe me for the last loan, so...no".

I'd expect that each trip to the well would be for higher and higher amounts of money, so early on, you can 'buy' an easy out for more requests.
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Old 06-08-2015, 02:53 PM   #48
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In 1980 I was 25 and my brother was 19. He was living out of state, broke and desperate. I sent him a $50 money order so that he wouldn't starve. It was a gift that I was happy to send because I had plenty to live on and he didn't.

He wrote back to thank me and tell me that he used it to buy some really good weed.

Learned my lesson on that one! Luckily it was only a $50 lesson.
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Old 06-08-2015, 03:20 PM   #49
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Yes, we have helped family members (I thought I'd never say that, but I never foresaw these circumstances).

It happened after I retired, but I'm sure it had nothing to do with my retirement. They could look at my job title and know I had more money than their other relatives.

All (yes, more than one) have characterized it as a "loan". In all cases, I believe they were sincere at the time. But, I always felt these were "gifts". Any repayment would be a welcome surprise. I've had a trivial amount of welcome surprises.
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Old 06-08-2015, 03:47 PM   #50
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Not family, but one of DW's closest friends from college. A couple of years ago she asked for a loan of $150 to get her through a brief patch of trouble. DW sent it to her and told her it was a gift. That pissed the friend off for some reason. She didn't want charity. I am fairly certain that it would never have been paid back, however. From some other family stories regarding "loans" within my family it seems that a number of people are comfortable with getting a loan and not paying it back, but they would NEVER accept a gift.
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Old 06-08-2015, 03:59 PM   #51
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Really never been asked for money but both DW and I have given fairly large gifts to friends and relatives. Mostly outsized birthday presents, or house warming gifts, or gifts when they become unemployed, etc. works best if you can attach some sort of reason to it. Seems less like charity that way.
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Old 06-08-2015, 06:27 PM   #52
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No, and I don't expect to be asked. Although we are just fine, our children have much higher paying jobs than we did and are very frugal. Our other relatives also do very well and are not spenders. If we were asked in an emergency, we would consider it a gift.



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Old 06-08-2015, 07:03 PM   #53
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OTOH, one could turn a negative into a positive:
Once a deadbeat relative doesn't repay the loan, they're unlikely to go back to you asking for more.

"...you still owe me for the last loan, so...no".

I'd expect that each trip to the well would be for higher and higher amounts of money, so early on, you can 'buy' an easy out for more requests.
That didn't work in our family. My sister never borrowed from my parents. I borrowed some towards the down payment of my first house. This was so I could avoid PMI and have a 20% downpayment. We had signed contracts and I made monthly payments with interest. My dad matched the bank interest rate on the primary loan but a shorter term (5 years instead of 30). I paid it off in 4. My brother borrowed every time a car died. He'd make sporadic payments that always ended before the loan was paid off. My dad finally declined, pointing out he was still owed for the previous car (and the car before that). They didn't speak much for about 3 years, reconciling only when they both got terminal diagnoses the same week. (Both felt the need to reach out to the other and patch things up.)

My brother had no problem coming back to "bank of Dad" multiple times, despite having outstanding loans.
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Old 06-08-2015, 08:32 PM   #54
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That didn't work in our family....
My brother had no problem coming back to "bank of Dad" multiple times, despite having outstanding loans.
My two sisters kept returning to the Bank of Dad up until a few months before my father died. I have no idea how much they still owed him when he died, but I'm sure it was a substantial sum for each of them. I never took a penny from him after the age of 18.

One sister has worked at a world-class university in Mass for about 25 years, and will receive a good pension when the time comes. As for the other sister, I have no idea how she supports herself these days. They both know better than to darken my door with their hand out, however.
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Old 06-08-2015, 09:29 PM   #55
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My brother asked for a $3500 loan for a retainer to get a divorce. I gifted him 1/2 and the remaining half was a loan which he repaid within 5 months. The other times I sent him money I just said they were gifts, he was having a rough time. I was glad I was able to be there for him. Other than him I don't loan money.
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Old 06-08-2015, 11:06 PM   #56
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My brother and sister (my last immediate family) are better off than we are as is one of my DWS sibs. The other two wouldn't dare ask.

Some think we are well off because I worked overseas. If I had not, we would be in deep doodoo now, but we are not well off, just safe.

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Old 06-08-2015, 11:07 PM   #57
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Old 06-08-2015, 11:59 PM   #58
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In 1980 I was 25 and my brother was 19. He was living out of state, broke and desperate. I sent him a $50 money order so that he wouldn't starve. It was a gift that I was happy to send because I had plenty to live on and he didn't.

He wrote back to thank me and tell me that he used it to buy some really good weed.

Learned my lesson on that one! Luckily it was only a $50 lesson.
He may have eaten it and fulfilled two of his "needs", food & fun.
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Old 06-09-2015, 06:33 AM   #59
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That didn't work in our family....
My brother had no problem coming back to "bank of Dad" multiple times, despite having outstanding loans.
But that was Dad's fault. Dad could've said "no, you still owe me money...so, no more until it's repaid".

I was pointing out that an outstanding loan not repaid gives you that opportunity to say no. And in that case, a loan not repaid can be a positive thing.
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