Gallbladder Emergency visit

[CRLLS]

I had a pain about 8PM Fri night, immediately after my regularly scheduled pizza. I've had that sort of pain before, maybe 1 or 2x per year over the last 5 years or so. It starts out as a bloated feeling, then a pain under my ribcage on my right side. I then take Gas-X and Pepto and it subsides over then next few hours. This time, it did not subside. 8 hrs later with no sleep and no letting up on the pain, I was thinking something must be different. I woke DW at 4AM and she drove me to the emergency room. Just as we were pulling into the ER, the pain started to subside. What to do? I decided to have things checked out anyway and went inside. Long story short, they did blood tests and ultrasound. Blood tests were all normal. the diagnosis is I have Gallstones, one as large as 20cm. I guess that was what I was experiencing these last few years, not gas. I was prescribed pain killers that should help thru any future episodes and told to see my GP soon. But it may be 6-12 months before I have my next one to know if the drugs will help.

I am conflicted between having surgery or not. It seems that nothing comes without risk. Both my DB and close friend recently went thru surgery with complications. One took two more surgeries to correct and the other had pain and was in pain therapy for over a year, still not gone totally. If I delay surgery, as I get older, recovery may be more difficult. I am also concerned about falling into that small camp of diahorea.

I generally hate going to see doctors and do not have a GP. I haven't even gone for my "Welcome to Medicare free physical. I go to specialists when I need to have something addressed. I know I'm an outlier in this area.I have a long weekend group meet planned this week and a 5 day trip to China the following week. Based on the previous rate occurrence, I am comfortable with delaying "the decision" for a bit.

Without using scare tactics, please convince me to have the surgery, delay, or just manage thru the pain.I really could use some positive advice one way or the other.

 

[calmloki]

Not a big fan of doctors, drugs & surgery either. That said, I have lived 5 years longer than without their intercession, so I'll say they do have their utility.
Was going to suggest regular oatmeal for breakfast and milk thistle, but am no kinda doctor, so maybe read this:
Gallbladder disease - Penn State Hershey Medical Center

 

[Scrapr]

Had mine out "the hard way" They were hoping to do it laproscopic. Surgery by wire. They tried initially but had to do the big cut. I think I was 57 at the time. A week in the hospital. Worst part? They sent me to the room from recovery with no pain meds on the chart. So just as I'm arriving the surgery meds are wearing off. I was near delerious.

Did have diarrhea. There is a powder called Sandoz (chlorestramine) that will stop you up within an hour. I take it every am. I think after my gall bladder surgery I took it for a while then tapered off. Since had bowel resection (Chrohns) and take it every am.

Don't fear the [-]reaper[/-] surgeon

 

[MissMolly]

I had about 5 or 6 attacks before I finally went to the doctor. They had progressed to me doubled over and throwing up. I thought I was dying. When they get bad enough you will wish you had done the surgery sooner. Had my surgery way back in 1982, so it was done the old fashioned way. A week in the hospital, which was pretty much the norm back then. Not a whisper of a problem since. Really glad I had the surgery.

 

[eytonxav]

If one of those stones causes an obstruction and pancreatic enzymes back up you might be in for case of pancreatitis or if your gallbladder becomes infected both those possibilities could lead to a long and very unpleasant hospital stay. I had pancreatitis, and had my gallbladder removed. The surgery to remove the gallbladder was done laparoscopically and was nothing compared to the pancreatitis.

 

[tps7742]

Several years ago in my early 40's I had a checkup and they found a problem with my gallbladder. The Dr at the time told me I would need surgery within a year so schedule it at my convenience. Being the young macho male at the time I put it off. Long story short, I ended up in the emergency room, the gall bladder had gotten to the gangrene stages of infection. It ended up being a long stay in the hospital with my gall bladder being removed. Use caution and follow up as needed.

 

[MRG]

I had years of misery. Surgery left me with 3 little holes. Awesome choice.

However I didn't listen to my doc about needed diet changes. I decided to eat my way through the problem, not the smartest choice. Today I'm well, eat what I want, but it would have been smart to pay more attention.

 

[Aerides]

Get a GP, go for a good chat, and consult about your specific scenario. 20mm is pretty big. Eat lower fat in the meantime to reduce a re-do. That's gonna be tough to do in China.

I don't think it's something you can put off forever. That said, pick a very good surgeon, one you've researched and feel very comfortable with. I had the lap chole done, but my doctor made an error. I'm fine now but I spent almost 2 months in the hospital as a result.

ETA: why would you not have a GP? a yearly exam is a really good thing to do. Consider this a wake up call?

ETA more: not trying to scare you, but i also delayed. (this was 20 years ago). The pain got worse with each "flare up". I eventually went to the ER when it felt like I had a knife stabbed under my lung. If this is your first attack, you probably have time to find a good doc and schedule things, but do whatever you can with your diet to minimize it in the meantime. Be very careful trying to travel to China with a prescription drug, there are usually restrictions.

 

[Richard4444]

20 cm That's about 8 inches ! I'd want that out. And if it is now elective surgery, it should go easier and you can choose your Doc and maybe some other variables to your liking.

Best of luck !

Rich

 

[97guns]

My mom’s gall bladder was making stones like crazy, after several stone removals the Dr finally removed her gallbladder, procedure done through her mouth. She still had problems after that and the Dr inserted a stent, that did the job, she’s been good since.

 

[marko]

If you're really against surgery, try finding a really good, 'real-deal' acupuncturist. After I had my GB out my acupuncture guy told me he could've probably have fixed it (I forget how he planned to do it).

I had complications after my surgery but would still do it again. Did the lathroscopic and was walking (a bit) about 4 hours afterwards. Minor pain, minor recovery issues outside of some serious digestive issues as a result; that is, recovery from the surgery was a breeze but my system just had trouble adjusting.

Oh, and the acupuncture guy fixed my digestive issues...long after the Western medicine docs gave up.

 

[texcurtis]

Had my gallbladder removed in January this year. Prior to surgery I was having progressively worse pain episodes similar to what you described. My doctor said they'd probably get worse without surgery. Had gallbladder laparoscopically removed. Some minor food adjustments (no fried or greasy) post surgery and the constipation has resolved itself finally. If I had to do again, I'd do the surgery definitely.

 

[Breedlove]

Honest to goodness , get it done ! a couple years ago mine went crazy about 3:00 AM in the morning I hurt so bad I was throwing up . Told my DW get me to the hospital NOW . The most pain I have ever had . I went to the ER they gave me an IV and wanted to do a flow test . Like you I said I feel fine ( Meds Talking ) So they held me till my doctor came in . He told me to get the flow test no big deal , also told me it looked like a bad gall bladder . He said his wife had it done last month and fixed dinner for him and the kids in the evening. So 10min's later a young kid came by while I was on the Flow test talking on his cell phone . I heard him say on the phone prepare for emergency gall bladder surgery . He introduced himself and said he was going to remove my GB, now this kind of shocked me but . They wheeled me into a prep room and an older guy asked me what I thought of the Astros . The next thing I knew I was in a room with my DW . That was at 4:30 PM . A nurse came by and asked me to walk . I walked felt NO pain and was released at 8:30 PM . All in one day . This is a quick very easy surgery , my young kid doc said I had several stones and explained that a gall bladder pain is almost as bad as a woman giving birth .
Get a good doc and get it done !

 

[W2R]

If one of those stones causes an obstruction and pancreatic enzymes back up you might be in for case of pancreatitis or if your gallbladder becomes infected both those possibilities could lead to a long and very unpleasant hospital stay. I had pancreatitis, and had my gallbladder removed. The surgery to remove the gallbladder was done laparoscopically and was nothing compared to the pancreatitis.

In 1993 I went to the ER with sudden, severe, off-and-on abdominal pain, only 36 hours after it started. Turned out it was gall bladder. I had pancreatic enzymes backing up like that, and flooding into my bloodstream where they had reached 20,000 times the concentration that was allowable (whatever that was). The doctors said my pancreas and liver were being eaten up by these enzymes and they said it looked like so far the pancreatic damage was not too bad. Apparently the liver regenerates to some extent so they weren't as concerned about that. I was! They did a good job of scaring me, that's for sure.

Anyway, I wasn't in any condition to survive surgery so they kept me in the ER for 24 hours and ICU for 4-5 days until I was stable enough to survive it. I was on extremely strong pain medication the whole time, including morphine? I dunno. Anyway I was stoned to the gills and enjoying my mental wanderings through la-la land.

Honestly I felt much better the moment my eyes opened after surgery than I had felt all week. And a couple of days after that I was back at work half time.

So, my long personal anecdote is probably of no use. Here's my best advice:
I'd say you should get a consultation with the best gallbladder surgeon you can find, and follow his recommendations, whatever those may be. If he says to do the surgery, you might feel a whole lot better afterwards.

 

[Breedlove]

Cmon down to Houston and I can give you the kids name that removed mine . A few hours after the surgery we can watch the Astros on TV !

 

[aja8888]

Cmon down to Houston and I can give you the kids name that removed mine . A few hours after the surgery we can watch the Astros on TV !

I'm going to bookmark your post for future reference. (although right now myself and DW are fine).

 

[SecondCor521]

I would advise either getting the surgery now or never. Later is a bad choice. And now that I think about it, never is probably also a bad choice, because it's likely to get worse and hurt more over time.

My Dad had a couple of gallbladder attacks last fall that sent him to the ER and resulted in him having stroke-like symptoms and severe pain for several hours that were only addressed with two strong pain medicines. At the time I was talking with his CCRC about putting him into assisted living because he was dizzy and falling a lot.

It turns out he had a golf-ball-sized stone in his gallbladder. Because he delayed fixing the problem, he had to have a drain tube put in and so he was walking around with 3-4 feet of tubing sticking out of his side with what looked like an IV bag at the end that he got to strap to his ankle. He also got to drain that of bile or whatever every day for about 6 weeks. That kind of cramps one's style.

After 6 weeks his gallbladder calmed down enough that they felt it was safe to remove. We were told that having gallbladder surgery when the organ is inflamed has measurably poorer outcomes (infection and death) than if one waits. He had it done via laparoscopy.

Since then, his color has returned to normal (now pink, used to look sort of jaundiced), his energy levels are better, pain is gone. In retrospect if he had the surgery done earlier he would have not had 6 months of feeling crummy and would be six months further down the road of feeling great.

Obviously there are risks, as one poster mentioned above, and you should consider those. But for my Dad it was a good call.

 

[swakyaby]

An 8 cm gallstone? Can that be right? I would at least get a consultation with a good general surgeon. At the consult, he/she will advise what s/he recommends, your alternatives, the risks/benefits of surgery and the potential risks of waiting and doing nothing. Can’t hurt to listen and ask questions. Not all surgeons recommend surgery if it is not indicated.

 

[Tetto]

My Dad had the same thing for a few years; pain, then it would go away. The last time the pain came, it was tenfold. He had stones and was really bad off. The only thing that would kill the pain was Morphine. After this attack passed, he had the Gallbladder removed laparoscopically, a 25 minute operation start to finish. He’s never felt better, and is completely back to normal. Which is bad for the rest of us...!
I recommend you having the surgery, as long as there are no other concerning co-morbidities. It’ll be over so quick, it’ll make your head spin!

 

[Bir48die]

I'm one who does what the doctor suggests. I would never go to a forum to ask people what they think when you can research and get a second opinion if you desire.

 

[CRLLS]

Correction 20mm not 20cm. Duh! You think after working with metric for 50 years I'd write the right one down.

Good feedback. Thanks one and all.

I do understand most of the risks if left untreated such as 100% blockage, gallbladder infection and pancreatitis. I guess I was looking for successful alternatives to surgery that don't involve lifetime medication. I have read of some meds that can dissolve the stones.

It is not that I don't go to doctors, I just abhor the whole situation. I am currently living 4 years beyond my expiration date thanks to some doctors. So I do see them when I feel it is needed.

As for going to a forum for recommendations, I generally agree with that. However, I feel this group is fairly level headed and tell it like it is with their personal experiences. Some of the recounts that I have read about on other sites are evangelistic for homeopathic remedies or just jump right to the woe-is-me worse case outcomes. And the last doctor, the one who did save my life, was not forthcoming or at least downplayed the possible complications of the surgery. Not that I would have made a different choice. I had no choice to make, really. So relying solely on one or two doctors for their perspectives, without hearing non-interested parties' perspectives would not be wise on my part.

This is my 2nd issue/wakeup call in 4 years. I do need to be more proactive about my health. I know that. I will search out for a GP and a surgeon to talk to as soon as I return from my trips. In the mean time, I have pain meds on the ready, including one that is opioid-based. As for finding the best surgeon, how would one search for one, or the best (or at least very good) GP? The emergency room doctor recommended one surgeon, but I have no idea if he is great, above average, or just next up in rotation for recommendation.

 

[Telly]

I had a pain about 8PM Fri night, immediately after my regularly scheduled pizza. I've had that sort of pain before, maybe 1 or 2x per year over the last 5 years or so. It starts out as a bloated feeling, then a pain under my ribcage on my right side....

OK, I'll halt the story right there, and switch in MY details...

After having pizza for a Sunday night dinner, within an hour or so, I started to have a full feeling in the upper right abdominal area. Then some pain. As the evening progressed, it got worse. When I went to bed, I wondered if I would sleep. Only fitfully. At 2 AM, got out of bed and sat in an easy chair. Getting worse, sharper pain. DW checked on internet, most likely a gall stone blocking output of gall bladder. By the way, never had this before, ever.
By 6 AM, DW getting up for work, I was in severe pain, I was hanging over the porcelain hoping I'd throw up, thought I would feel better if I did. No go with that, tried finger down the throat trick, finally succeeded in a couple of humongous dry heaves (stomach long empty). Suddenly, felt incredibly better! Pain gone! Just a little soreness! Amazing! The spasm of my diaphragm must have passed the stone through! Don't stop reading here, as I was wrong!

I slept for hours that morning, felt great. Read that if one has ONE GB attack, that doesn't mean that you will always have another. But if you do... surgery is the solution.

I felt fine the rest of the week, but by Friday started to notice like an "echo" of the full feeling, just a bit. So the following Sunday night (1 week after first trouble), about an hour after dinner (not pizza!), I started to feel that fullness again. Got worse quicker, then the pain, increasing. Stopped kidding myself, it WAS the same thing all over again! Arrived at ER connected to a big hospital at 11:30 PM Sunday night. I did not look good. They streamlined the input procedure, and I was into an available ER room within minutes (a good low-ER traffic day/time to arrive!).

Full card blood test, EKG, on to ultrasound. Yup, stone blocking GB output. I most likely kicked it backwards into bigger area of GB that Monday AM, that's why pain quit then. But stone still wants to play, it ain't going away.

They had trouble getting any IV pain meds to work for me. I seemed to be resistant. Admitted, surgery next morning about noon. Went well, surgeon had visited me in room first. By coincidence, one of our relatives worked with him then, gave very good review of him. Afterwards, he visited me back in room, said he had quite a job doing it lapro, as it turned out to be much more swollen than expected, had to piece it out.

Recovery was not too bad, took very few of the pain pills at home. I used the same surgeon later to do an open-cut IG hernia repair on me. Recovery for that was a lot longer and more painful! The GB removal was relatively simple, for me.

I have had zero problems living without a GB, but a do know a person who had diet troubles after GR removal, takes the powder mention above to handle it.

Far be it from me to push anyone towards surgery, but after my experience, I wonder what would have happened if I went on a foreign trip, or out of the way place, etc., and had the GB emergency then!

 

[DrRoy]

I had no symptoms, but an ultrasound for something else saw gall bladder polyps. We watched them for a while and when they started getting bigger the Dr said to do it. Still no symptoms. I went ahead with the procedure. Didn't sleep well the first night after but it was steadily better day by day after that. I never really had a diet adjustment period that is sometimes suggested. I just ate whatever I used to and it seemed the same.

DW had stones for a while and put off the surgery. It finally caught up with her and she had to go through a beach trip with some discomfort and could not eat anything she wanted with the rest of us. She had it done when we got home and all was well.

I would say get it over with. Recovery is easier earlier as you said, and you won't get caught by an attack at a bad time.

 

[JoeWras]

After reading this thread, I might give up pizza.

 

[braumeister]

After reading this thread, I might give up pizza.

Please! Don't even joke about such a horrible decision.