Living abroad 3-6 months at a time?

[teekaymn]

Thanks Akaisha (and MichaelB) -- I trust Billy's recovery is going well. I enjoy reading of your exploits on your blog.
I've seen BUPA and other coverages mentioned before, and I need to do a lot more reading about it. As long as DW knows that others in our potential retirement age bracket are comfortable with getting affordable health care either through BUPA (et al), or out of pocket, I think we'll be more comfortable about making the jump in a few years.

 

[NYEXPAT]

I've been away from the forums for a bit, but this thread caught my eye, as the expat idea is something my DW and I would like to explore. Firecalc results look promising if we stay on course, with a goal of FIRE in 5 years. The big thing that still seems a bit of an unknown to me is how to handle health care once we leave the coverage we get through w*rk. Cost for services in most countries seems much less expensive without even buying insurance, but I'm just wondering what expats do for peace of mind if they've got, say, a 5-7 timespan to cover until residing back in the U.S. to take advantage of Medicare.

I have been retired and living overseas for about 10 years. I have HI for my family at a private clinic ($75.00 mth)we also have a separate cancer policy for $30.00 a month. Next year when I turn 60 we will buy a comprehensive policy with a Major carrier at a cost of $160.00 a month. The reason is unless you do this before 60 major carriers will no longer insure you. If you have it in place, then they will renew it (at a higher cost) but you will have full coverage. One problem with TI or international HI is that you will still be required to pay for treatment in cash (before surgery) and then must fight with the company for reimbursement. The advantage in low cost countries is the insurance company usually laughs at how cheap the operation was and reimburses without to much effort.

 

[Alan]

One problem with TI or international HI is that you will still be required to pay for treatment in cash (before surgery) and then must fight with the company for reimbursement. The advantage in low cost countries is the insurance company usually laughs at how cheap the operation was and reimburses without to much effort.

I agree, but the OP was asking about living abroad for 3-6 months a year. How easy would be it be to sign up to a local HI policy for such a short period? I think that's why TI is being discussed on this thread.

 

[haha]

Billy just recently had an emergency hospital event in Guatemala - 2 nights stay in hospital, MRI, x-rays, intravenous meds, doctors, nurses, concierge care, etc. etc. etc. and the cost was $1,600 USD.

Best,
Akaisha
Author, Your Retirement Dream IS Possible

I hope that he is fully recovered and feeling fine again.

Ha

 

[teekaymn]

I agree, but the OP was asking about living abroad for 3-6 months a year. How easy would be it be to sign up to a local HI policy for such a short period? I think that's why TI is being discussed on this thread.

Sorry, Alan, I think I was the one that hijacked the thread to a discussion of expat/longer stay health care concerns.

 

[Birchwood]

@ aiming-4-55
I'm thinking just Manila, Quezon City, Greenhills, and surrounding areas.
It may be congested, but the areas of makati and Greenhills looks like any big american city.
I'm scared of the south, like Davao, because of the Muslim problems. Think of Kidnapping for ransom?
Manila also has the foremost hospitals if you get sick. Entertainment and restaurants abounds. I also want to be close to the Manila International airport
if things don't work out well.

 

[Alan]

Sorry, Alan, I think I was the one that hijacked the thread to a discussion of expat/longer stay health care concerns.

No worries - it was so subtle, I didn't even notice

 

[Billy]

To all of those who gave their best wishes for Billy and his health, we appreciate it! Billy is fine, and is completely recovered, !Gracias a Dios!


On our website we gave a full review of B’s hospital experience including the detail of his bill. We did a follow up to answer our Readers’ questions on this which we also posted. If you have interest in learning the practical details of this, just PM me and I can direct you.


I don’t know if I am allowed to say that or not.

How easy would be it be to sign up to a local HI policy for such a short period? I think that's why TI is being discussed on this thread.

If you “go naked” of a U.S. based health insurance policy, you can purchase (foreign) local health care services as needed out of pocket or sign up for international insurance to cover your long term stay in foreign countries. If you are living outside the States and want to visit the U.S., you can cover yourself through travel insurance utilizing your foreign address as your home address to get the reasonable price. You can have this travel insurance cover a week, or months or even a year at a time, depending on the company.



Of course, “going naked” can be frightening at first.



Again, thank you all for your good wishes towards Billy. We do appreciate it!


Best,
Akaisha
Author, Your Retirement Dream IS Possible

 

[Bestwifeever]

...On our website we gave a full review of B’s hospital experience including the detail of his bill.

I was able to find this post on your website but not the follow up.

Do you not carry health insurance--it sounds like you paid for all the expenses out of pocket and none were offset by travelers' health insurance?

ETA: I did find your follow up to readers' questions where you mentioned you have a high deductible policy so you did pay for all the expenses out of pocket. You didn't mention the diagnosis--I certainly respect not revealing that and don't wish to know, but I do hope the docs were able to find the problem and treat it so your adventures can continue.

 

[Chuckanut]

For a long trip of 1-3 months, my medical insurance will cover expenses incurred out of the country. I have also signed up for a emergency medical air evacuation service, in the event of serious illness. They will take me to any hospital in the USA>

 

[TeeRar]

for those of you who do this

or are contemplating doing this - I've a question

What do you do with your place in the USA? I saw someone (Sarah?) uses a housesitter - and the rest of you?

 

[Alan]

or are contemplating doing this - I've a question

What do you do with your place in the USA? I saw someone (Sarah?) uses a housesitter - and the rest of you?

We moved into an apartment shortly before we retired just so we can "lock and "leave". We tell them in the office when we are leaving and they have someone come in once a week to check things out. We also keep in touch with them from time to time with e-mail.

PS

Our son picks up the mail once a week from the box and lets us know if anything important arrives.

 

[Billy]

I did find your follow up to readers' questions where you mentioned you have a high deductible policy so you did pay for all the expenses out of pocket.

Yes, we have a high deductible of $10,000 for in-provider coverage and $20,000 for outside of provider coverage. It is simply for catastrophic care when we are in the States and it keeps our monthly premiums low. The prices for catastrophic care in foreign countries are reasonable compared to the States.

An example: A friend of ours had heart bypass surgery in Guadalajara at a top hospital and spent 5 nights there. This was only a couple of years ago. The complete cost to him (with no insurance to help cover) was $15,000.

What do you do with your place in the USA? I saw someone (Sarah?) uses a housesitter - and the rest of you?

We live in an Active Adult Community which is a turnkey situation, perfect for travelers. When we are not in the States for long periods of time we either leave the house empty (we have security in the community and neighbors who watch) or we can choose to rent it out during high season. This covers the annual lease amount.

House sitting options are terrific both to have your own house “sat” as well as being able to visit other locations and not have to pay so much for lodging. (Depending on how long the stay is, you might be asked to pay for your own uts.) House swapping (home exchange) is another option where you swap your place with the same couple that swap theirs with you.

Our friends who have a gorgeous lake-view home in Chapala, Mexico swapped their home to live in France and then when their brilliant son wanted to attend University in the States, they swapped their home again, this time for a place in the western U.S.


Best,
Akaisha
Author, Your Retirement Dream IS Possible

 

[Sarah in SC]

or are contemplating doing this - I've a question

What do you do with your place in the USA? I saw someone (Sarah?) uses a housesitter - and the rest of you?

Our trips have been of around a month in length (sadly, still working) and yes, we've used housecarers and been pleased.

For future longer trips, we plan to build a small garage apartment and have a permanent tenant stay on our place, so we can come and go and still have someone to care for the animals.

Finding a solution to what to do with the house when traveling is a biggie. Everyone seems to have a different answer, from selling up and going perpetual traveler to cobbling together friends and family to check in while you are away.

 

[Zero]

Has anyone recently done a 2-3 month rental in central Paris?

I've looked at VRBO and am finding $2200 for tiny studios to $3000 for one bedroom small, in Arr. 1 & 2.

I've looked at Craigslist and found a place near Rue Mouffetard (great place to shop and eat) for $2400 on a 6 month lease.

BUT, leery of dealing with someone on Craigslist from 6,000 miles away.

Anyone suggest a safe way of finding an apartment?

 

[Tutashen]

I can retire next month but my union rep is saying stick it out till the fall because of possible buyouts with new contract and to take vacation for the summer, i have 7 weeks coming and living in canada want to explore someplace warm to stay in the winter has anyone been to the island of dominica? there are lots of places I would love to see in south america but seems like the drug trafficking has made it to violent for my taste

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

If you “go naked” of a U.S. based health insurance policy, you can purchase (foreign) local health care services as needed out of pocket or sign up for international insurance to cover your long term stay in foreign countries. If you are living outside the States and want to visit the U.S., you can cover yourself through travel insurance utilizing your foreign address as your home address to get the reasonable price. You can have this travel insurance cover a week, or months or even a year at a time, depending on the company.

Of course, “going naked” can be frightening at first.

Hi again, Akaisha,

I read that Billy is OK. Whew!

I am concerned about the age limitations in health insurance outside the US, even travel insurance, that are popping up, as NYEXPAT noted. We are almost 65 and exclusions start at 60 many places. I understand that good care can be purchased inexpensively out-of-pocket, but a catastrophe could still bankrupt us. Is naked the only option for us old fogies?

 

[Sarah in SC]

Is naked the only option for us old fogies?

Now there's a visual for ya!

 

[Lsbcal]

Has anyone recently done a 2-3 month rental in central Paris?

I've looked at VRBO and am finding $2200 for tiny studios to $3000 for one bedroom small, in Arr. 1 & 2.
...

We were looking for a shorter period like ~2 weeks but the best deals seemed to be for 4 adults in an apartment. So maybe best for 2 compatible couples. I think occasionally a new listing will pop up and be grabbed if it's really a good price.

We would up just staying in a hotel in the Rue Cler for 115 Euros/night.

 

[explanade]

For a long trip of 1-3 months, my medical insurance will cover expenses incurred out of the country. I have also signed up for a emergency medical air evacuation service, in the event of serious illness. They will take me to any hospital in the USA>

What kind of policy and with which company did you get this evacuation coverage?

Typically, medical evacuation is with travel insurance policies.


There are a number of countries which offer retirement visas. Otherwise, in the Schengen countries, you can stay only for 90 days out of a 180-day period. So you finish one 90-day stint, you can't return until 90 days have passed.

 

[Billy]

Hi again, Akaisha,

I read that Billy is OK. Whew!

I am concerned about the age limitations in health insurance outside the US, even travel insurance, that are popping up, as NYEXPAT noted. We are almost 65 and exclusions start at 60 many places. I understand that good care can be purchased inexpensively out-of-pocket, but a catastrophe could still bankrupt us. Is naked the only option for us old fogies?

Hi Ed,
Thanks again for your kindness towards Billy. Yup, he’s doing well, thank God, and back to being ornery.


World Nomads offers travel insurance with several different underwriters. Depending on who is underwriting your trip, there can be an age limit of up to 67 (I believe I have seen up to 70 but I’m not sure.) And yes, there are some insurances in foreign countries that aren’t available to us as we age.


I know it’s nerve wracking to consider the idea of “going naked” in regards to health insurance policies, but in many cases, the place that a catastrophe would actually hurt you financially would be in the States. One can receive good, solid, or reasonable care in many countries for something catastrophic, and the out of pocket is still manageable – being low tens of thousands instead of hundreds of thousands. (For instance a friend of ours suffered a motorcycle accident, had his face sewn back on and was in a body cast in the Guatemala City Centro Medico hospital for over a month. Cost was still under $20kUSD)


For travel insurance your rate depends on

**if you are an Expat full time,

**are a US resident and are covered with a plan “back home” while you travel,

**or if you are an Expat and travel to the States and your travel policy covers you there,

**or are an Expat and then you travel outside your new home country.



OTOH, if you are currently paying $6k to $36k (or more) annually for health insurance in the States for you and your spouse, if you choose to “go naked” you can save that money yearly and put it aside for exactly that catastrophic medical purpose. (We have friends who are carrying a full insurance policy that covers them worldwide. Their greatest fear is having cancer since it runs in both families. They pay $36k annually and are very comfortable with that.)


We hear from our Readers how some of them pay large amounts monthly (2k monthly for husband for heart condition + spouse’s coverage) or cannot be covered because of a diagnosis or condition they had 10 years prior. The money that they would normally spend on those policies, if put aside, would add up quickly. For the man with the heart condition, in just over 4 years, he would save close to $100k to cover his medical costs if he lived outside the States. (Inside the States, all bets are off.)


Often meds overseas are not the same price as they are in the States, so you would also save there.


I know it’s a lot to think about, and basically you need to decide where you would like to live in order to figure out the health insurance part of the equation. But there are lots of options, once that door is open.


In my opinion, Fear is the biggest thing to manage. That and the idea of “making a mistake.”


People in the U.S. are often willing to be held hostage to that one piece of their retirement puzzle. These decisions are very personal and no “one size fits all” answer is available.

I hope you find my perspective helpful.


Best,
Akaisha

 

[Ed_The_Gypsy]

I hope you find my perspective helpful.

Best,
Akaisha

Always, Akaisha!

 

[obgyn65]

Yes I have been contemplating living 6 months abroad when I fully FIRE. About 3 months in Central America and 3 months in Western Europe, where I have a condo. Will keep you updated as I plan to be part of this community for a long time Have you looked at IMG for your healthcare ?

Now that ER is within a few months, I am seriously considering living abroad for a few months at a time. Perhaps, 2-3 months in a smaller town in Italy, or Germany, or maybe Eastern Europe??

 

[explanade]

IMG?

 

[Alan]

IMG?

International Medical Group for travel insurance.