ACA Vs Medicare, Is this Fair?

[ShokWaveRider]

Is it ok, as long as you agree to have all your wealth confiscated.

That is not a very informed response. You have absolutely no bases for it. I hope they do not confiscate our wealth when I go on Medicare next year.

 

[Ian S]

The last part is nonsense... they can only sign up once a year for two months... if they get "really sick" in January then they'll be either dead or bankrupt by the time they get to the next open enrollment period.

Doctor: You have cancer and it needs to be treated right away.
Patient: Can we wait six months until the next Obamacare open enrollment period?

Are you really trying to make the argument that because open enrollment is only two months a year, that the insurance pool premiums won't be adversely affected by the requirement that insurances companies take all applicants with no underwriting? Wow!

Many if not most costly to treat diseases take time to kill you. And even something like a heart attack or stroke is going to be treated even if the patient can't afford it. Odds are very good that the patient will survive and be able to get insurance during the next open enrollment. Furthermore, many who are healthy will opt for the new cheap short term plans and if disaster strikes, use up those benefits while waiting until they can get covered by Obamacare. There are lots of ways to play the game but the end result is a higher cost for the folks actually covered under Obamacare.

 

[Fedup]

That is not a very informed response. You have absolutely no bases for it. I hope they do not confiscate our wealth when I go on Medicare next year.

I think from your posts, you don’t like to pay for healthcare even though you don’t pay a lot already. But you keep advocating for free healthcare system in USA. But do you think you would make as much wealth if you were in other countries with free healthcare. It’s rhetoric question. The fact that you and your wife came from two countries with free healthcare but you are still here answers the question.

 

[marko]

You're sort of comparing apples with oranges though... the $1,500/month includes hospitalization insurance and the $180 does not... that was paid through Medicare taxes over your working career.

I suppose that's true.
OTOH, my cost NOW went from $1500 to $180 despite that I've been sort of paying ahead for the past 40 years.

My post was more in reply to a comment about Medicare being 'a good deal'. As you point out I'm only more or less getting my money back now, but looking at it from a narrow 'annual spending' my annual expense went down almost $16K.

Telling myself that I'm just getting my money back doesn't make me feel as good as thinking that I'm getting something for nothing; I'm getting it regardless. I'm not the type to split hairs on the 'how'.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

I think from your posts, you don’t like to pay for healthcare even though you don’t pay a lot already. But you keep advocating for free healthcare system in USA. But do you think you would make as much wealth if you were in other countries with free healthcare. It’s rhetoric question. The fact that you and your wife came from two countries with free healthcare but you are still here answers the question.

You obviously did not read my posts. Nowhere do I say is should be free. It should not, just everyone should pay their fair share and Medicare for All would help towards that.

 

[Ian S]

You assume alot…..

I don't think so. The article deals solely with the effect of the elimination of the mandate penalty so it's perfectly reasonable that the numbers they produce are related to that theme.

 

[Fedup]

You obviously did not read my posts. Nowhere do I say is should be free. It should not, just everyone should pay their fair share and Medicare for All would help towards that.

Maybe not on this thread but in the last few months and other threads.
Medicare for All would bankrupt everybody, there’s an article in WSJ. Even for Californians, the LA times didn’t think it’s possible moneywise.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Maybe not on this thread but in the last few months and other threads.
Medicare for All would bankrupt everybody, there’s an article in WSJ. Even for Californians, the LA times didn’t think it’s possible moneywise.

NEVER Free, it is NOT free in Canada and any other Civilized Country that offers it. It is paid for by Payroll taxes and Supplemental Insurance, Just like Medicare.

 

[kgtest]

My ex-bil opted out of part D. He was diagnosed with a brain tumor and unable to afford the medicines. The tumor was in the part of the brain that controls emotions and low level fight flight responses. He recently beat his current wife to death after a disagreement.

I'd probably sign up, but that's just me.

Do inmates get medicare?

 

[MRG]

Do inmates get medicare?

Don't know. He's gonna be in for life, probably not a long time as he's elderly.

Actually my nephew screwed up and he's in prison. There's not really any healthcare where he's at, not sure how typical his situation is .

 

[Fedup]

NEVER Free, it is NOT free in Canada and any other Civilized Country that offers it. It is paid for by Payroll taxes and Supplemental Insurance, Just like Medicare.

Free as in if you don’t work, you still get it as my SIL in UK.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Free as in if you don’t work, you still get it as my SIL in UK.

Read the post again...… They pay in income tax. HC is part of everyone's income tax in the UK. (I am English).

 

[Fedup]

Read the post again...… They pay in income tax. HC is part of everyone's income tax in the UK. (I am English).

Not if you are not working and don’t have income. AKA unemployed.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Not if you are not working and don’t have income. AKA unemployed.

As it is in the USA (Medicaid). That is not the mainstream. You are splitting hairs. If you cannot see my point so be it.

 

[ncbill]

Medicare & Medicaid are two very different programs.

"Medicaid for all" might be an affordable solution, but people would still scream about its restrictions (vs. ACA plans or Medicare)

 

[Fedup]

As it is in the USA (Medicaid). That is not the mainstream. You are splitting hairs. If you cannot see my point so be it.

Not true, there is no difference for UK people.
In USA, my sister went out of her way to have some income so she can avoid the lower tier, not sure if it’s Medicaid or not.

 

[Fedup]

Medicare & Medicaid are two very different programs.

"Medicaid for all" might be an affordable solution, but people would still scream about its restrictions (vs. ACA plans or Medicare)

Isn’t Medicaid have an asset limit like $2000 or something.

 

[MichaelB]

Is there a point here?

 

[pb4uski]

Are you really trying to make the argument that because open enrollment is only two months a year, that the insurance pool premiums won't be adversely affected by the requirement that insurances companies take all applicants with no underwriting? Wow! ...

The insurers don't seem to have the same fear of adverse selection as a result of gutting of the individual mandate that you have... they know that for 2019 the individual mandate has been rendered ineffective because the amount of the penalty is $0... yet their proposed premium increases have been modest and actually premium reductions in many cases... and some insurers that previously exited the individual insurance market have re-entered. Those are all just facts.

If you were correct then they certainly would not have re-entered for 2019 and would also have proposed much larger increases to reflect the risk of adverse selection.

Wow!

 

[Fedup]

Is there a point here?

Who are you asking here?

 

[swakyaby]

Do inmates get medicare?

My oldest brother who was 60 years old was incarcerated in California 2 years ago. He had a painful inguinal hernia that was surgically repaired while in prison. It was completely free.

 

[REWahoo]

Do inmates get medicare?

My oldest brother who was 60 years old was incarcerated in California 2 years ago. He had a painful inguinal hernia that was surgically repaired while in prison. It was completely free.

This sounds a lot like an old early retirement strategy known as the "baguette maneuver."

 

[ivinsfan]

You obviously did not read my posts. Nowhere do I say is should be free. It should not, just everyone should pay their fair share and Medicare for All would help towards that.

You know you are not consistent right? Do you mean fair share as defined by the tax code, or net worth or what number would you use.. you are the guy who wanted to cash out dividend stocks for an annuity so your spouse could continue to get free healthcare, right? Now that you have to pay you want everyone to pay?

 

[Mulligan]

I think you mean to say the taxpayers are paying for the subsidies , not the mandates?

Aja, I got sweet news today...My long time GF found out her employer allows “domestic partners” to join on to their health insurance plan. She will move in with me within a year or so (no hurry). Anyways through her cafeteria plan after tax break, my health, dental, and vision insurance will be under $200 a month total. And the annual health deductible is $200. It will be like the 1980s again! She has to work 10 more years chasing a pension and that will take me right up to Medicare. I will be able to rid myself of this ACA crap plan and rip off premium for good soon.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Do you mean fair share as defined by the tax code, or net worth or what number would you use. you are the guy who wanted to cash out dividend stocks for an annuity so your spouse could continue to get free healthcare, right? WRONG! Now that you have to pay you want everyone to pay? Again Not True.

You are also focused on FREE. That is NOT my point. How many times do I have to repeat it? How it is measured or calculated is also NOT my point. My point is EVERYONE should pay their fair share (Sort of Like Medicare is today) whatever that may turn out to be, most likely based on income is probably the fairest. I am sorry if I do not explain my points more clearly sometimes.

As the ACA system stands today, folks who can control their MAGI can gain more in subsidies to offset their MONTHLY payments. Yes a lot of us here do that, it is NOT illegal. We still have to pay an OOP and Copays and Co-Insurance, at least we do. Again NOT FREE! Is this right? Not for me to argue. But neither are some other tax loopholes folks take advantage of every year. BTW we do NOT own Dividend stocks, which is irrelevant anyway.

Same as the Canadian and European systems are NOT FREE, even though the uneducated seem to assume they are. In their cases recipients pay tax on, or have paid tax for them on their income, capital gains, dividend or unemployment taxes. Please do not misinform people that Socialized Systems are Free. The load is spread (as it should be) across the country's demographic. Yes, the costs are reduced significantly for those without or with very little means, that is the same here in the USA with Medicaid . We have all also paid Medicare Tax to help offset our Medicare in old age.

Healthcare is NOT FREE anywhere I have lived (6 different countries, 5 of which had a socialized HC system)

To repeat, Medicare for All is probably the most equitable solution IMHO as most have paid, or are paying into it. It may have to be modified in order to make it more equitable and to ensure it is well funded in the future. That is another story.