No, You Can't Keep Your Health Plan

From the article's description of its author

Dr. Gottlieb, a former official at the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, is a fellow at the American Enterprise Institute and a practicing internist. He's partner to a firm that invests in health-care companies.

Considering his economic incentives, I take what he says with a grain of salt.
 
You can take what he says with a grain of salt, but all you have to do is talk to a few doctors and talk to a few policyholders from companies that are dumping plans and massively increasing rates due to the new laws. If you like your plan, you can keep it....if you can pay a 50% rate increase and the company continues to offer it. If not, you're going to be in a pretty crappy situation from here on out.
 
Well, companies and insurers were reshaping health plans before reform, with more and more businesses dropping insurance because of the cost. Massive increases in rates and increasing numbers of uninsured predated changes in the law so we have to be careful about assigning blame and saying problems are due to the new law.
 
Martha said:
Well, companies and insurers were reshaping health plans before reform, with more and more businesses dropping insurance because of the cost. Massive increases in rates and increasing numbers of uninsured predated changes in the law so we have to be careful about assigning blame and saying problems are due to the new law.
Click to expand...

I was not talking about businesses changing their employee benefits. I was talking about people like me and many others on this board who buy their health insurance on the individual market. Several companies have already announced they will no longer be selling insurance in the individual market. Assurant has announced they will no longer guarantee rates for 12 months. Aetna has given existing policyholders a yearly increase AND an increase based on the new reform mandated benefits. Aetna policyholders who moved into a higher age bracket got the triple whammy. United Healthcare has already announced they will no longer offer child-only policies. This is only the beginning, and all of it is directly related to the bill. You're sticking your head in the sand if you think otherwise.
 
Much of what that article references was taking place long before health care reform was passed. So now the rules have changed and the insurance companies will do whatever it takes to maximize their profits. Is this a surprise? Single payer anyone?

DD
 
DblDoc said:
Much of what that article references was taking place long before health care reform was passed. So now the rules have changed and the insurance companies will do whatever it takes to maximize their profits. Is this a surprise? Single payer anyone?
Click to expand...

I think both government and insurance companies are playing a game of chicken here. I suspect insurance companies will lose, whether they should or not -- because if they respond by pulling out of markets and jacking up premiums 20-30% a year or more as a result of the new law, all they'll do is get people to demand the public option.

Then again, maybe that's what the legislators were hoping would happen...
 
ziggy29 said:
I think both government and insurance companies are playing a game of chicken here. I suspect insurance companies will lose, whether they should or not -- because if they respond by pulling out of markets and jacking up premiums 20-30% a year or more as a result of the new law, all they'll do is get people to demand the public option.

Then again, maybe that's what the legislators were hoping would happen...
Click to expand...

Ding ding ding, we have a winner...
 
The reform debate turned into a circus.
The politicians on both sides seemed to be bought out by the lobbyist.
I'm not sure if the common working people benefited at all.
Got to keep in mind that lots of working people need insurance even if they work for themselves and not part of mega corp.
Whats the difference in a 1000 people working for themselves/in business and a 1000 working for a big company?
Everyone should be able to buy good health care at the same reasonable price.
Just my $.02,
Steve
 
After actually reading the article, looks like it may get ugly for we the (retired) people that buy our own coverage. The powers that be will be busy fighting for the highest ground and we will pay for it.
It may balance out eventually but probably will take some years of higher premiums to get there.
Steve
 
I had individual private insurance and was dumped by my insurer when they pulled out of my state almost 10 years ago. They gave me one month's notice. Blame that on Obama if you dare.
 
My rates have been going up by 10-20% annually for years. Can I blame the rate increases through 2008 on Bush and Clinton?
 
ziggy29 said:
I think both government and insurance companies are playing a game of chicken here. I suspect insurance companies will lose, whether they should or not -- because if they respond by pulling out of markets and jacking up premiums 20-30% a year or more as a result of the new law, all they'll do is get people to demand the public option.

Then again, maybe that's what the legislators were hoping would happen...
Click to expand...

Many people have been stating this for a long time. Many others simply dismissed it as paranoia.
 
eridanus said:
My rates have been going up by 10-20% annually for years. Can I blame the rate increases through 2008 on Bush and Clinton?
Click to expand...
Why not also blame the increasingly profitable insurance companies?

Audrey
 
To add a little more fuel to the fire, I also want the same tax break on paying my premium as I was getting before walking out the mega corp gate.
Might as well shoot for the stars, right? :LOL:
Don't you just love the insurance wars?

Steve
 
I am truly amazed at all the very smart people on here thinking that a single payor system run by the Fed govt will fix everything. Based on personal horror stories of family members suffering under Medicaid and Medicare, let's just say my trust is almost zero that the whole health care reform bill is anything about high quality care being made available to the everyone..........:(

I agree the system is broke, it was been borke for many years. Did we really think the insurance companies, who know they will be forced to take everyone with no pre-existing conditions, would not jack up rates before the bill takes effect?

There's more furor over halth care insurer's record profits than any record profits that big oil or big pharma or Goldman Sachs hijinks ever created..........that's unbelievable to me.......:(
 
FinanceDude said:
There's more furor over halth care insurer's record profits than any record profits that big oil or big pharma or Goldman Sachs hijinks ever created..........that's unbelievable to me.......:(
Click to expand...
I think the uproar is the same.

But when the "middle men" such as GS and Insurance companies make outsized profits when they don't actually produce anything - that's a bit different than Oil and Pharma which actually do produce a tangible product, not just shuffle money around and take their cut.

Audrey
 
ziggy29 said:
I think both government and insurance companies are playing a game of chicken here. I suspect insurance companies will lose, whether they should or not -- because if they respond by pulling out of markets and jacking up premiums 20-30% a year or more as a result of the new law, all they'll do is get people to demand the public option.

Then again, maybe that's what the legislators were hoping would happen...
Click to expand...


That is why I think they fought tooth and nail to get the public option in the first go round.... now that we can see what is happening... it will be a lot harder to get it done...
 
audreyh1 said:
I think the uproar is the same.

But when the "middle men" such as GS and Insurance companies make outsized profits when they don't actually produce anything - that's a bit different than Oil and Pharma which actually do produce a tangible product, not just shuffle money around and take their cut.
Audrey
Click to expand...

How do you define "outsized"? I find it interesting that the doctors on this forum are staying out of this discussion. Maybe the ones still working will have something to say when they get a 50% paycut, courtesy of the govt setting maximum rates on what doctors can charge........:nonono:
 
FinanceDude said:
How do you define "outsized"? I find it interesting that the doctors on this forum are staying out of this discussion. Maybe the ones still working will have something to say when they get a 50% paycut, courtesy of the govt setting maximum rates on what doctors can charge........:nonono:
Click to expand...
Not sure what you are going on about, but I was talking about the increasingly outsized profits of the middlemen - i.e. health insurance companies - not about doctors.

Audrey
 
FinanceDude said:
How do you define "outsized"? I find it interesting that the doctors on this forum are staying out of this discussion. Maybe the ones still working will have something to say when they get a 50% paycut, courtesy of the govt setting maximum rates on what doctors can charge........:nonono:
Click to expand...


Yes... this is the place that people don't want to discuss... no other place pays doctors as much as we do...

This is going back 30 years... when I used to do tax returns... there was a doctor that worked for a famous heart surgeon... and he finally made it... he was doing the surgeries himself... and his salary increased by $1 million... not that he was getting $1 mill, but his INCREASE was $1 mill.. I wonder what this kind of person makes today...


And we have a new memember... who is going to be a doc and his wife a doc (sorry, not trying to jump on you... just using you as an example)... and he said they will start at about $250K to $300K each (on average)... I am not trying to get into a debate on how long it took to get his education etc. etc.... but just pointing out that docs in other countries when we want to 'be like' pay less than half... and probably less than 25%...

Hmmm... any link someone can find to show what different docs make in different countries:confused:
 
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