How do you deal with a wife with no FIRE plans?

[tmm99]

No, you're not overreacting... though I'm not sure if you and your DW had a meeting of the minds when you agreed to marry each other.

You and your wife are at a fork in the road... either divorce and go your separate ways or jointly decide on how much or little you are willing to give to provide for her family and communicate that to them and stick to it.

I am leaning toward pb4uski's advice.

Also, even with a prenup, alimony will come to play (you could have put a no alimony clause, but I heard that that doesn't make you look good in front of a judge if you make considerably more money than she does, and the judge may ignore the clause.) so the sooner you divorce, the better off you will be if you cannot come to an agreement with your wife.

 

[jollystomper]

To the OP, it seems you have to make a decision about which is more important to you - FIRE at age 40, or your marriage. And then decided, based on that, what to do with the marriage. And if you do decide to end it, you should do it right away, before kids are in play, and do not hold on to the fantasy of "I'll end it but after the finance are where I want them to be" - you do not know what will happen down the road. Better to take whatever losses you have now as a sure thing, than the future uncertainly that could be worse.

In these situations one only gets to hear one side. Finance is just one part of a marriage. It is important, but it is still just one aspect. Only you can decide the priority of this aspect. For example, the amount she is sending, and even spending, from your original post, did not seem like it was draining your money completely, but was more slowing your desired goal for FIRE.


In all honesty, howe

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Happened to a friend.....the wife was bad with money, spent a lot on frivolous items, got pregnant on purpose without his buy in, had arguments over giving money to her family, she opened up credit cards and ran up bills he didn't know about. Don't wait 5 years if you intend to file for divorce. Getting money out of the house might be the least of your worries 5 years from now.

 

[pacergal]

Sad situation.
AS others have mentioned, if you are going to divorce, do it now.
Five years from now you have far more financial issues to be dealt with during a divorce.
Do everything in your power to avoid pregnancy, as children will certainly complicate the matter if the marriage is already in trouble.

 

[Walt34]

I will add another sad voice of experience: Cut your losses and run. The best time to do that was yesterday and it'll only cost you more tomorrow.

 

[Car-Guy]

got pregnant on purpose without his buy in

I suspect he might have been partly at fault, that is unless she was cheating on him.

 

[pj.mask]

Wow I’m shocked at all this ‘run for your life’ comments over $175*12+500= $2600/yr?!

Most Asians prioritize family, that includes financially. You should have realized this before you got married. You say you’re divorcing because she spends $3k/yr on family?

There is much more to life than that small amount of money. I’d imagine she probably saves you that much cleaning, cooking, etc.

 

[gwraigty]

Wow I’m shocked at all this ‘run for your life’ comments over $175*12+500= $2600/yr?!

Most Asians prioritize family, that includes financially. You should have realized this before you got married. You say you’re divorcing because she spends $3k/yr on family?

There is much more to life than that small amount of money. I’d imagine she probably saves you that much cleaning, cooking, etc.

It may be more of a trust issue than the amount of money involved.

 

[bolt]

It may be more of a trust issue than the amount of money involved.

Exactly use percentages akin to prospering businesses.

Whats that dated adage "double-a-penny" every day for a month => $1,000,000.

 

[pj.mask]

It is and there is definitely a cultural barrier here - a lack of understanding of each other.

Does he understand what help was given to his wife before he met her? There is payback for help and also sharing the success.

If you commit to marrying anyone you should be able to talk about this and set boundaries that both of you are happy with.

It really doesn’t sound like you have tried to understand each other. It sounds like you know you are right from the beginning and you expect your wife to change her culture and get on board with you. You need to talk about what each of your limits are and work on a compromise towards joint goals.

I’m speaking from experience.

 

[Niuatoputapu]

Yes, I think you're overreacting. She's saved enough to help her sister in her time of need, she'll be able to save that much again; and she's purchasing 30-35% of a house; and she's sending $175/mo to the Philippines. This doesn't really sound like a spendthrift lifestyle.

+1

If you think the marriage is simply a business relationship and you have changed your mind about how it should be conducted financially, then the best thing for her is probably divorce. She is young enough to restart, hopefully with a work visa or residency in your country. Hopefully she can find a true love, have a few children, and work until she's 60 and continue to send $175/month home.

Marriages are difficult and require constant care, dedication, and compromise.

If you prefer to be 40, retired, and divorced versus whatever the compromises may bring, then cut and run.

 

[dirtbiker]

I suspect he might have been partly at fault, that is unless she was cheating on him.

It depends. Obviously it takes two to tango, but if one party stops taking birth control without the knowledge of the other party, that shifts the blame quite a bit from 50/50. I've got a friend with an ugly custody agreement who was in that situation. She never mentioned to him that she had her OBGYN remove her IUD...

 

[Mdlerth]

WTF?

So much here is just wrong, so wrong I find it beyond credibility.

Last year in August 2018, I got married to a Filipina and brought her to Europe. At first I thought she was going to be a good saver the way she handled the money when we were travelling in Philippines.

But her attitude changed when she started working in Europe, moving to my country. She only wants to buy or do things to brag about how luxurious her life is here. Basically everything ends up as a successful life picture on Facebook.

Seriously, how is that different from everything else on FB?

3 weeks ago, her sister, 26 years old and been working for 3-4 years required surgery. She had gall stones. The surgery required roughly 3000-4000 USD, or roughly 60-75% of my wife's savings after a year. Only 25% of her lifetime savings would be left.

It's only her first year. Everybody's savings after their first year is by definition their lifetime savings. Doesn't mean they won't ever save anything in the future.

I went for advice in Filipino investor groups, but they confirmed what I thought, that she could just as well get natural treatment, or it would be costly anyways going to a private hospital in Philippines. I told her sister she could try the natural treatment, but she wouldn't have it. Now she's been home for 3-4 weeks, without surgery. Even though we sent 500 USD as an advance deposit to get admitted.

Ditto what earlier posters said about investor groups being the wrong people to consult for medical advice, gall stones being a serious condition requiring surgical treatment, etc.

Her dad stopped working the moment my wife started working abroad.

So 2 weeks ago, I had enough of it, I told my wife I was going to divorce her if her family had another emergency come up. We are already sending 175 USD to Philippines per month, they can easily get a job and work themselves out of poverty, or just save for emergencies like this.

Am I overreacting here?

Not just yes, but Hell Yes! OP's father-in-law can retire early on the paltry $175 bucks a month his daughter sends over? Surely that ought to be cause for celebration on this forum!

Anyways, if we are to be divorcing, it's going to be in roughly 4-5 years. My prenup is protecting my savings anyways. By contract we are keeping how much money we are earning and splitting the ownership into the house according to the payment schedule of the mortgage. So my stake in the house is roughly 65-70% because I earn significantly more.

"By contract"? I'm usually a vigorous defender of matrimony, but this doesn't sound like a marriage. The story reads more like human trafficking. If there's any truth in it, perhaps the OP could provide some clarification about what his expectations were in entering this arrangement at all?

 

[gwraigty]

Not just yes, but Hell Yes! OP's father-in-law can retire early on the paltry $175 bucks a month his daughter sends over? Surely that ought to be cause for celebration on this forum!

Mdlerth, I often agree with your POV, but in this case, I have to question why OP's FIL thinks he has the right to have his daughter support him just because she got married. We don't know a lot, like how old FIL is, did he have any savings at all, etc. Is it a cultural thing that parents in the Philippines quit working when their kids get married and expect to be totally financially supported by them for the rest of their lives? If such a thing had been spelled out before the marriage and agreed to by the OP without limitation, then he has not much cause for complaint now, but it sounds as though this wasn't discussed in enough detail.

What about the sister? She isn't working right now because of supposed health issues, but she hasn't done anything to get the needed surgery, despite receiving some money for it. Is she making it up, intending to use OP as her meal ticket, too?

For reasons I don't care to get into right now, I have a bias against otherwise able-bodied parents who treat their kids like meal tickets/retirement plans. Please note that I'm not talking about parents who are doing the best they can for themselves and just need some financial assistance. (Other relatives also included.)

Retiring early at any particular age shouldn't be considered the most important thing in this whole marriage. It comes across as though the wife's income was a major consideration in deciding to marry, to more readily achieve his FIRE goal. OP's complaints aren't limited to just the money she's sending back to her family, but all the money she's spending on things she posts about on Facebook. Is she contributing anything to their FIRE goal, or does she spend it as fast as she makes it? How long as this been going on? Would she restrain her spending in time after the newness of her new lifestyle wears off?

Inquiring minds want to know....

 

[street]

I would first talk to her about the issues you have with the relationship. If there is no line drawn I would be filing tomorrow. I would be very clear what I want in this 50/50 relationship and would stand firm on what you to agree on going forward.

 

[Teacher Terry]

I think it goes beyond the 175/month because now she supposedly needs 3-5k for surgery. He is probably worried that it will be a endless string of emergencies. Someone I know took his girlfriend from the Philippines home and he was expected to pay for everything for her family despite not being a wealthy man. I also find it ridiculous to pay healthy parents so they don’t need to work.

 

[aja8888]

I think it goes beyond the 175/month because now she supposedly needs 3-5k for surgery. He is probably worried that it will be a endless string of emergencies. Someone I know took his girlfriend from the Philippines home and he was expected to pay for everything for her family despite not being a wealthy man. I also find it ridiculous to pay healthy parents so they don’t need to work.

From m y post #19:

My nephew married a Fillipino lady younger than him when he was about 35. He told me he really married her whole family once the dust settled. Divorced in a couple of years and left the Philippines with only the shirt on his back and an airplane ticket I bought for him.

Not that all these kinds of marriage/arrangements are like this with Filipino gals, but it seems to be a usual theme as I recall.

 

[DFDubb]

"By contract"? I'm usually a vigorous defender of matrimony, but this doesn't sound like a marriage. The story reads more like human trafficking.

I didn't want to say it, but this is the vibe I got as well. Whole thing sounds/feels icky.

 

[timemoveson]

Jonash come back!

Perhaps junior poster OP Jonash would come back and actual tell this engaged group what he means by all this and answer the excellent challenges put out there. I have my popcorn.

 

[pj.mask]

In a lot of Asian families, there are 3 generations (as the story goes):
1) poor and uneducated. Works hard and puts all their resources (no retirement savings) into their kids so that the kids may have a better life
2) educated and working, doing well. The kids have a paid for education and successful career. They live frugally like their parents and know the value of money. They earn enough to help the parents and support their kids. They build wealth.
3) spoiled. They grow up with ample resources and parents always helping out and leading the way to success. They don’t build on the momentum of the second generation but instead spend it. And so the cycle repeats.

In many Asian cultures, the kids are the retirement plan. They invest all their money into their kids. It isn’t like the US where the parents are always focused on themselves. Asian families can be very selfless. The OP has issues with the reciprocal nature of that.

There are cultural differences between the asian country stereotypes. But the stories of a young poor asian immigrant girl marrying an older geeky white guy are all very similar. I don’t know what the OP was expecting here?

I know many who are very happy because they have communicated and accepted each other’s position.

Edit: I think the most telling is his intent to divorce her a few years down the road, when it is most financially beneficial for him (she cooks/cleans/romance while he saves them he dumps her with nothing after 5 years right before the prenup ends)

 

[Teacher Terry]

Prenups don’t end.

 

[Scratchy]

If OP's wife would tell her side of the story, I might even pay for the gallbladder surgery myself.

 

[BoodaGazelle]

I suspect many older men who have married outside the basic first world culture would have similar stories, especially about the DW’s family wanting to mooch off of the wealthy American. I have specifically heard this about Latinas.

This is not to criticize *their* cultures. But if you are smart enough to FIRE, you should have been able to predict this.

 

[Red Badger]

https://youtu.be/912DKxD0H1U

Git r done

 

[socca]

I'm perplexed by all of the cultural content in this thread. Back in the old days, at least, you married a family, not a person. If your spouse has significant family baggage, that baggage often becomes your baggage.

I have never, and will never, get married, so I can freely pontificate upon a subject with which I have no practical experience. Hey, it's the internet!