Alzheimer's and the future

[Tiger8693]

Thank you all for sharing.... So much for me, me, me...

Wow. Having been here (forum) a relatively short while, and seeing some of your most recent posts, I would never have guessed anything of this nature of you. If your recent posts are after so called "diminishment" and at age 75, I would have loved to have met and talked with you 20, even 10 years ago! Actually, the same is true for now....

I sent a private message to you one time before, but want to say here, your thoughts and writings here really give me hope for a positive and beneficial future. I hope to have your insight, wisdom and patience to share as I travel the (hopefully) long road.

 

[audreyh1]

imoldernu - you seem as articulate as ever. And not diagnosed because you don’t see the point of the tests?

From what I hear loss of the sense of smell, and sense of taste is quite common in the elderly and as a consequence they eat a lot less.

 

[imoldernu]

I tried to answer this in post #18. Testing?... to what end?

And... to second the post by West University... about reading. This is one of the more recent problems that has worked its' way in over the past year. too hard to concentrate, and at that... not to remember what i've tried to read. Have totally given up on the daily paper. Hard to explain, because I can still read the news on line, though now, less and less.

A side effect... when responding to longer threads, I have to re-read what has gone on before. Not all bad, and a few things that are pretty funny. Whether lies, or just not remembering, I sometimes go over my posts that go back to 2012... and think "Did I really write that?"

 

[Teacher Terry]

Right now you would pass the tests. They have you draw a clock and set it for a certain time, ask you the year and who is president, etc.

 

[imoldernu]

Right now you would pass the tests. They have you draw a clock and set it for a certain time, ask you the year and who is president, etc.

Right... I'm not quite at that point, and it may be matter of a year or more, before that happens.

The reason the Alzheimer organization sets the qualifying status at 7 steps, is to offer a way to understand the progression of the disease. in some cases, less than a year, in others ten years or more. Here's another link to the 7 stages:

https://blog.caregiverhomes.com/the-7-stages-of-alzheimers

As to the kinds of tests, there are many different types of questions. The ones that you cite, involve visual (picture) type reasoning... A more involved part of the tests are pictures that require abstract reasoning. Not quite as simple, but definitely more challenging.

A few of the kinds of pictures (not the questions that go with them), are here:
https://www.google.com/search?newwindow=1&rlz=1C1GCEA_enUS846US846&q=abstract+iq+test+pictures&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjI3KT21ZvjAhXwmq0KHbPiB-4Q7Al6BAgDEA0&biw=1152&bih=616
If the link doesn't work, search google for ""abstract iq test pictures"

Many of the supposed IQ tests that are on line are silly, but there are also a good number the are meaningful and surprisingly accurate.

In any case... remember that this is not.... not... an on off disease, but one that can take many years. More commonly persons who are not well versed in the matter of progression, only see the cases that are near or at the final stages.

 

[Amethyst]

My understanding is that the tests are neurological protocol for further treatment, such as with Aricept. Did you already decide that treatment is not for you?

I tried to answer this in post #18. Testing?... to what end?

I sometimes go over my posts that go back to 2012... and think "Did I really write that?"

Well in that case I have dementia too, since I can barely recognize myself in my early posts. And here I just thought it was because I'd been learning and growing all this time.

 

[Teacher Terry]

My friend had a slow progression even though she got it young. It was the only last 3 years of her life where you couldn’t leave her alone at night. She died at 65 from cancer that was not treated due to her advanced Alzheimer’s.

 

[bmcgonig]

Just came across this article today. Apparently older gentleman with severe dementia placed by force in a nursing home by his family. I sympathize all around in that one. But then he refused to eat/drink. This is where all my sympathies go towards the patient and none towards the family. They have him removed from the nursing home and have him force fed in hospital. Now some important details are missing about the story from the nursing home side but possibly they saw it as a better end? Either way certainly I would fight force feeding my mom who might just be like that someday soon.


https://www.irishexaminer.com/break...e-had-no-food-or-water-for-a-week-934743.html

Note HSE is the government health service.

 

[imoldernu]

My explanations probably sound like refreshments for a pity party. I think it's time to close this too long post.

To answer the medication part... First, I have discussed this regularly for 4+ years with my doctor, and he is has no argument with my thinking. As to the MRI, and current medications... I don't want to go through tests and reports and being part of a study. Hopefully some of the newer studies will shed more light for a solution for others.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/07/04/738478841/new-markers-for-alzheimers-disease-could-aid-diagnosis-and-speed-up-drug-develop

As a little background... my mom died in 1984 on moving into stage 7 of Alzheimer's. She was 74 and the final months were fortunately not traumatic. My dad died of cancer at age 56, and my mother remarried, happily, two years later. As far as I know, no other relatives with AZ.

So, on to today and the future (at least the future for jeanie and me).

No secrets in our family. The kids all know what's happening (after their several years of denial), and jeanie and I are on the same track... understanding that at our age each extra day is important...

The good part is that this gives us a head start on planning. We are prepared legally, with wills and POA's. the money part, while not great sees enough for a total of 10 years of nursing home/and or "Memory Lane" as it's called in our CCRC. An old LTC policy provides $36,000/ yr. help with this... Policy for each one of us.

We have regular wide open meetings with our four kids and their families, so they are prepared for whatever happens. Money, housing, medical care and our current lifestyle and budget are all part of this.

For jeanie and Me...? We still do the morning two minute hug, that does wonders for our outlook. No sadness... every day a gift.

 

[ncbill]

Just came across this article today. Apparently older gentleman with severe dementia placed by force in a nursing home by his family. I sympathize all around in that one. But then he refused to eat/drink. This is where all my sympathies go towards the patient and none towards the family. They have him removed from the nursing home and have him force fed in hospital. Now some important details are missing about the story from the nursing home side but possibly they saw it as a better end? Either way certainly I would fight force feeding my mom who might just be like that someday soon.


https://www.irishexaminer.com/break...e-had-no-food-or-water-for-a-week-934743.html

Note HSE is the government health service.

Another example of why people here in the U.S. should have a health care POA, and why you might not want to pick a family member as agent if their wishes contradict your own.

Stopping eating/drinking is a natural part of many terminal illnesses, including dementia.

But if you don't execute the above document making your wishes clear in those situations, yes, you'll likely have a PEG tube inserted.

Which has its own complications, since dementia patients like to mess with anything attached to them, e.g. IV & PEG tubes.

One of the most difficult posts I've ever read online was from a wife who ignored her husband's wish to not have a feeding tube.

She had one placed anyway, he pulled it out, it was successfully replaced a couple of times, but the last time pulling it out resulted in her husband dying horribly from sepsis, leaving her racked with guilt.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

There are countries where Alzheimer's is much less common, especially places /periods without the modern Western diet, so scientific evidence to date tends to point to it not being an inevitable part of aging.

 

[MichaelB]

,There appears to be an association beteeen AD and other factors such as diet and lifestyle, but none of these have been proven to cause AD. As far as I know science has yet to determine the cause of Alzheimer’s Disease and there is no cure. The only treatment so far is to delay the progression, and there is no reliable way to measure the effectiveness on individuals.

 

[robnplunder]

This and other related posts have convinced me to redouble my efforts to stave off the big A (my DM has it). I was already learning/playing the game of Go and added playing piano as of yesterday. I used to play piano & guitar, neither one at any good I am also going to read more.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

This and other related posts have convinced me to redouble my efforts to stave off the big A (my DM has it). I was already learning/playing the game of Go and added playing piano as of yesterday. I used to play piano & guitar, neither one at any good I am also going to read more.

I picked up the book on the the MEND protocol linked to above (The End of Alzheimer's) at the library yesterday and found it pretty interesting. Most of the ideas like a plant based, low glycemic diet, brain exercises, yoga, meditation, exercise, eliminating mold and other toxins in the environment, fasting for 12 hours a day, etc. seem like kind of a greatest hits collection of healthy living tips from ancient Ayurveda and modern functional medicine combined. I'm going to buy the book and see what factors we can change in our lives. We went hiking yesterday on a Saturday evening instead of going out to a pub so I guess that is a good start.

Related news article: "The doctor and his team have published a study documenting 100 cases where patients underwent personalized therapy. In all 100 cases, there is evidence their cognitive decline was reversed."

Added: The published paper on the 100 patients is here: https://www.omicsonline.org/open-ac...ve-decline-100-patients-2161-0460-1000450.pdf

 

[Doc0]

I'm a physician interested in metabolic disease. I think insulin resistance or excess insulin like factors plays a big role if not the cause. Other things may be seed oils which good up fat metabolism. The disease is not just dietary but likely diet interacting with a particular phenotype or phenotypes so there is probably some genetic component, but a fairly common genetic component. The stats are 1/10 get ALZ by 65 rising to 1/3 by 85. Most men are dead pretty much around 85 but not so with women. Women that live to 65 have a 30% chance of living to 90 and a 2% chance to 100 so there is a 1/3 chance as a woman of living with ALZ for a decade or more. The natural course of the disease is relentless leading to death about 12 years after diagnosis but the course is variable. So that's the animal you are dealing with.

I personally think diet is the best chance of avoidance and the sooner the better. I see no evidence plants help NONE. Insulin resistance is best treated with an all meat no carbs diet something called Carnivore. You can fart around with Keto but Carnivore is better No carbs allows the normal cycling between insulin and glucagon and the ability to live off fat. The brain does fine living on fat as does rest of the body. Omega oils have proven fruitless as a treatment in a recent study. You can eat fish if you like but it won't save you. Some studies done with carnivore diets have shown improvement in ALZ but once you got it it's pretty much too late so the only protection is don't get it. It's somewhat more complex than this but these are salient highlights in the 2019 understanding from real research.

My diet is carnivore basically steak, hamburger, some eggs and water. My diabetes dissolved, my hypertension dissolved I lost 60 lbs and I became much more healthy. My bp is120/60 and my A1c is 5.4. ALZ doesn't run in my family but metabolic syndrome does and that can be prodromal to neuro degenerative disease. Don't know if it's too late but it's the best I can do. People have been on this diet for decades and their "numbers" are perfect.

The obesity crisis is basically related to sugar carbs and seed and plant oils which are poison. We've been sold a bill of goods about all this "healthy eating" crap. It's the most unhealthy diet in the world which is why when it moves to somewhere with another diet people start developing all kind of diseases. The exactly the same diseases were experienced by ancient Egyptians who basically lived on bread and beer. I read an article today which looked at fruit juice like OJ and it has a 30% INCREASE chance of causing cancer. That's what your "healthy eating" gets you It's the sugars in the juice that are the stimulus. I've spent several years researching the science of this and I am qualified to understand the research and I've seen the results in my own body and blood work. I'm essentially 100% adherent. You can buy it or not.

This has a big impact on retirement planning as full time memory care in 2009 was 72K/yr I'm sure more now. If you're married each of you has a 1/3 at 85 which could mean 2 end of life bills. I have 2 friends probably 5 years older than me one is ALZ the other ALS which has a 5 year horizon but a more expensive course

 

[robnplunder]

My diet is carnivore basically steak, hamburger, some eggs and water.

Doesn't it have other issues like prone to heart disease?

But I agree that diet has a lot to do with AZ. DM who has AZ has been carbo hydrate rich diet + fat all her life. She likes to eat and I could not stop her from becoming obese as she got older. This led to diabetes, high BP, and AZ (I believe). At 82 and with moderate AZ symptoms, the best I can do (so did her doctor said) for DM is to make her comfortable for the remainder of her life. At the same time, I have taken measures to avoid AZ myself. It probably isn't fool proof and I may well end up with AZ. Until then, I will keep trying.

 

[WWDog]

NAD+

 

[Bongleur]

Doc0 - Did you lose that 60lbs eating ad libidum, or counting calories?
What does Carnivor do to your bowels? Do you still eat roughage, but without the carb flavorings?

 

[audreyh1]

Doesn't it have other issues like prone to heart disease?

But I agree that diet has a lot to do with AZ. DM who has AZ has been carbo hydrate rich diet + fat all her life. She likes to eat and I could not stop her from becoming obese as she got older. This led to diabetes, high BP, and AZ (I believe). At 82 and with moderate AZ symptoms, the best I can do (so did her doctor said) for DM is to make her comfortable for the remainder of her life. At the same time, I have taken measures to avoid AZ myself. It probably isn't fool proof and I may well end up with AZ. Until then, I will keep trying.

No. There is no link between heart disease/CVD and mortality and high fat and even high saturated fat diets. This has been shown in numerous clinical trials.

There may be links between processed meat and cancer, but unprocessed meat by itself (not lumped together with processed meat) hasn’t been studied so much. Most epidemiological studies showing links between meat and long-term health problems have had numerous other confounders such as more smoking, more overweight, less active, more diabetes - so you can’t just point to the fact that they self reported as eating more meat and ignore the rest.

 

[robnplunder]

NAD+

Made me look. After a few articles, I found that beer have Nicotinamade Riboside which boots NAD+. I am going out to stock some beer.

 

[bmcgonig]

What was the problem with the MIND diet study in your opinion? It's almost the opposite to carnivore.

I'm a physician interested in metabolic disease. I think insulin resistance or excess insulin like factors plays a big role if not the cause. Other things may be seed oils which good up fat metabolism. The disease is not just dietary but likely diet interacting with a particular phenotype or phenotypes so there is probably some genetic component, but a fairly common genetic component. The stats are 1/10 get ALZ by 65 rising to 1/3 by 85. Most men are dead pretty much around 85 but not so with women. Women that live to 65 have a 30% chance of living to 90 and a 2% chance to 100 so there is a 1/3 chance as a woman of living with ALZ for a decade or more. The natural course of the disease is relentless leading to death about 12 years after diagnosis but the course is variable. So that's the animal you are dealing with.

I personally think diet is the best chance of avoidance and the sooner the better. I see no evidence plants help NONE. Insulin resistance is best treated with an all meat no carbs diet something called Carnivore. You can fart around with Keto but Carnivore is better No carbs allows the normal cycling between insulin and glucagon and the ability to live off fat. The brain does fine living on fat as does rest of the body. Omega oils have proven fruitless as a treatment in a recent study. You can eat fish if you like but it won't save you. Some studies done with carnivore diets have shown improvement in ALZ but once you got it it's pretty much too late so the only protection is don't get it. It's somewhat more complex than this but these are salient highlights in the 2019 understanding from real research.

My diet is carnivore basically steak, hamburger, some eggs and water. My diabetes dissolved, my hypertension dissolved I lost 60 lbs and I became much more healthy. My bp is120/60 and my A1c is 5.4. ALZ doesn't run in my family but metabolic syndrome does and that can be prodromal to neuro degenerative disease. Don't know if it's too late but it's the best I can do. People have been on this diet for decades and their "numbers" are perfect.

The obesity crisis is basically related to sugar carbs and seed and plant oils which are poison. We've been sold a bill of goods about all this "healthy eating" crap. It's the most unhealthy diet in the world which is why when it moves to somewhere with another diet people start developing all kind of diseases. The exactly the same diseases were experienced by ancient Egyptians who basically lived on bread and beer. I read an article today which looked at fruit juice like OJ and it has a 30% INCREASE chance of causing cancer. That's what your "healthy eating" gets you It's the sugars in the juice that are the stimulus. I've spent several years researching the science of this and I am qualified to understand the research and I've seen the results in my own body and blood work. I'm essentially 100% adherent. You can buy it or not.

This has a big impact on retirement planning as full time memory care in 2009 was 72K/yr I'm sure more now. If you're married each of you has a 1/3 at 85 which could mean 2 end of life bills. I have 2 friends probably 5 years older than me one is ALZ the other ALS which has a 5 year horizon but a more expensive course

 

[cbslc]

Don't forget pesticides

Just as important as what you eat is how that food was grown. There are numerous studies linking alz with pesticides. DDT, which is still persistent in our ecosystem, was found as a risk factor in several studies.
https://news.rutgers.edu/research-n...ked-alzheimer’s-disease/20140127#.XSnlXfZFzhc
I have pictures of my grandfather painting trees and spraying his crops with DDT. He would then come home in those clothes and they would eat the crops... He died of lung cancer and all his children that survived >70 developed Alzheimer's.
There is also some research showing different types of alz, so causes and treatments may be all over the boards.
Eat healthy, exercise your mind and your body!
And then we just have to hope that we either keel over or hope for a breakthrough.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

Loma Linda, CA in the U.S. is a Blue Zone, and home to many Seventh Day Adventists on vegetarian or vegan diets and overall healthier lifestyles. They have a much lower incidence of Alzheimer's than surrounding communities and live 5 - 10 years longer than U.S. average. Blues Zones, the MEND protocol, American Heart Associations recommendations, Harvard Health, Stanford, M.D. Anderson cancer centers, almost every health organization's recommendations we looked at - they all seem to be recommending variations of plant based / MIND diets, so that's what we're going with for now unless we read about evidence based studies to the contrary.

 

[GLM]

Alzheimer's is a subset of dementia

Just have not heard anyone mention this yet. Alzheimer's is the most common type of dementia. Unfortunately I did a lot of research when my mom started to loose it a few years back. She had Lewy Body dementia and probably a touch of vascular dementia . It's often misdiagnosed and actually only confirmed by autopsy but once I found the symptoms and progression it fit her like a glove.

That's what Robin Williams had.

The best prevention or treatment of all dementia's appear to be what helps health in general . One of information source I really respect is Dr Perlmutter

https://www.drperlmutter.com/dementia-change-odds/

Also, on a early diagnosis tangent , loss of smell ( and therefore taste ) is an early sign . I recently ordered and did the 12 scent biomarker test. Actually DH and I both shared a test . ( And saved a few bucks ) Relieved we both did well .

https://thedr.com/smell/

 

[2177V]

Fasting to help alzimers?

FYI

A recent discovery by a Japanese researcher who discovered the health benefits of fasting.

He won the Noble prize for medicine. Therefore... fasting has merit.

Click the following link and watch the youtube video.

I am already fasting to reduce my weight and improve my health. Fasting detox your body. I am also hoping that fasting will help me avoid Alzimier's disease by getting rid of any plaque within my brain.