kiyosaki has reached new low - unbelievable

[saluki9]

Maybe Kiyosaki is making a new career field. We could call it comedic financial entertainment.

New? I would argue that it already is a well developed field. Look at money magazine, iBD, Forbes, fortune, or yahoo finance

 

[OffRoadAudio]

I think he's right. Every time I look at the lame returns on my Mutual Funds, I think of how much more money I make properly investing in real eastate. For me - no comparison, Mutual Funds are crap. I have easily recieved a 30 - 50% ROI on 2 real estate investments in less than 2 years, while my MF sits stagnate by comparison.
The real benifit is safety. I like going out on strong steady limbs.......

 

[ScaredtoQuit]

I think he's right. Every time I look at the lame returns on my Mutual Funds, I think of how much more money I make properly investing in real eastate. For me - no comparison, Mutual Funds are crap. I have easily recieved a 30 - 50% ROI on 2 real estate investments in less than 2 years, while my MF sits stagnate by comparison.
The real benifit is safety. I like going out on strong steady limbs.......

Uh-oh. Looks like Mr. K sent in his reserves.

(Notice the low number of posts)

 

[unclemick]

Hmmm - one does not invalidate the other. I sold and ate the duplex in ER, while my IRA compounded thru the nineties. While I might get severe heartburn talking about timberland and those stinking Spotted Owls - I do know people who successfully retired on real estate only, mostly and various combinations thereof with mutual funds. Different skill sets.

Should I get bored and decide to diversify again into RE - I really really don't think Mr K. is gonna be my go to guy for the 'straight poop.'

heh heh heh - poop maybe, but not the straight poop. :

 

[OffRoadAudio]

Uh-oh. Looks like Mr. K sent in his reserves.

(Notice the low number of posts)

Yes - I truley am a minion from hell, due mostly to my low number of posts.

I do still keep a mutual fund, it's just that I have found a good way to make the money compound faster and greater, so to me - the money in the MF seems like a wasted opportunity. I guess I'll need to validate this so: I'm 34 and work only when I want to- when I'm 40, I'll be done. Real Estate.

 

[Nords]

I guess I'll need to validate this so: I'm 34 and work only when I want to- when I'm 40, I'll be done. Real Estate.

Well, that's a lot more believable than PDF scans of Schedules E...

 

[d]

Mutual Funds are crap

guess that settles it!

 

[brewer12345]

After reading this, my conclusion is that the only logical investments are Amway and Phoenix real estate.

And don't forget beev3r-cheeze futures.

 

[Gumby]

and commemorative medallions.

 

[sgeeeee]

commemorative beev3r-cheeze medallions?

 

[d]

don't diss beev3r cheeze futures ...

 

[OffRoadAudio]

Actually, there is a commemorative plate of ALF that has increased greatly in value. You know ALF right? The fuzzy little alien guy with bad manners. If you find one in good condition - get it!

See, just one more non-conventional way to go about it.

BTW - if that was an actual request for a PDF E - you must be a bigger fool than you think I am.

 

[Milton]

I think he's right. Every time I look at the lame returns on my Mutual Funds, I think of how much more money I make properly investing in real eastate. For me - no comparison, Mutual Funds are crap. I have easily recieved a 30 - 50% ROI on 2 real estate investments in less than 2 years, while my MF sits stagnate by comparison.

I agree that, in the long-term, it is all but impossible to "easily" average annual returns of 30%-50% in mutual funds. It is certainly possible to luck out like this once in a while, but such returns are exceptional.

As to whether it is possible to earn average annual returns of 30-50% on real estate: well, I have my doubts. It just doesn't seem sustainable to me. Your experience is apparently limited to less than two years, which I respectfully suggest is not sufficient to provide a reliable comparison. Various studies have suggested that in the long-term (25+ years), real estate gains have averaged about 2%, after taking inflation into account.

P.S. Generally speaking, I don't think that anyone's opinion is more or less valuable because of the number or scarcity of previous posts.

 

[d]

The fuzzy little alien guy with bad manners. If you find one in good condition - get it!

i actually found one, but he didn't have his green card.

 

[Culture]

Heck, I retired when I was only 19! How did I do it? I started a hedge fund that arbitraged Franklin Mint commemorative NASCAR plates.

Once I made my seed money in the plate Hedge Fund, a bailed out before the money moved to unicorn figurines. I invested the cash in high speed envelope stuffing machines and tripled my money in six weeks mailing "make money quick in real estate" newsletters to working stiffs desperate to become wealthy without actually having to work. I sold out to Sam Zell as a favor to help him out when he was down. He used my system as the basis for Equity Office Properties Trust.

I then took this capital and started a business incubator, funding real estate seminar providers. That is where the real money is! I quit at 1 billion because making money was not longer a challenge.

Today, I am typing this while floating in the pool on my 250' yacht, with a Dallas Cowboy cheerleader giving my foot a massage and a glass of $500/bottle champaign in my hand. Cheers!

 

[justin]

Heck, I retired when I was only 19!

I've got you beat there, buddy. I retired at 16!! Highly complex real-estate based derivatives futures commodities market trading stuff. No one on this board could really understand it (unless you give me a check for $1295 for a one-day seminar where I could teach you all of my wealth building secrets).

I quit at 1 billion because making money was not longer a challenge.

That old saying the first billion is the hardest to make is definitely true. The second, third, etc. billion practically make themselves. After the first ten or so, it's just keeping score as my buddies Warren and Bill like to say.

 

[d]

you'd both have been better off if you had just bought beev3r cheese!

 

[spideyrdpd]

The average us salary according to wikepedia is about 50k. I think it was 2005 figures. Anyway So lets say the person can afford to put away 500 a month it would take 30 yrs to get to the million if he earns an avg of 10%
Which would be worth less than 500k of todays dollars due to inflation. Oh wait it gets better cause then he has to pay taxes.

Of course RK doesnt think the market will do well. He and others believe that the market will be forced to go lower when the boomers retire in force. Less money going in and less demand. Also you know how you guys would rather buy bonds or pay off yer mortage

Oh as a ps the aig lady was here again today. Maybe the aig should be pig. As they rape you over the coals with their fee's. I think they are the ones that are telling people they will help you pick which mutual funds to pick for an extra % of your money.

 

[calmloki]

Yes - I truley am a minion from hell, due mostly to my low number of posts.

I do still keep a mutual fund, it's just that I have found a good way to make the money compound faster and greater, so to me - the money in the MF seems like a wasted opportunity. I guess I'll need to validate this so: I'm 34 and work only when I want to- when I'm 40, I'll be done. Real Estate.

Dang. I knew we were doing it all wrong. I'm 57 and work mostly when i don't want to - unplugging kitchen drains on Thanksgiving, letting in drunks who lost their keys at the bar at lo the freaking dark-thirty - dunno if I'll ever be done. Just drove to Salem to return a 3rd party check and pick up an apartment's partial month rent and the weekly excuses. Fielded calls from the unhappy lady who just had a triple bypass - moved her to a nicer downstairs apartment, didn't raise her rent or charge the carpet cleaning/touch-up fee - unfortunately I learn that the PO charges $25 to re-key mailboxes when someone moves into an apartment. Sorted that out with the PO and got the fee waived for her. - I'm sorry - what do I have to do with the US mail again?
In my experience over the last 30 or so years for the vast majority of the time real estate appreciates about at the rate of inflation. Heck of a good enforced savings program, rentals are a fine multi-skill job to buy.

 

[haha]

Heck of a good enforced savings program, rentals are a fine multi-skill job to buy.

Very good point, and for the right guy a good plan.

Ha

 

[Nords]

The average us salary according to wikepedia is about 50k. I think it was 2005 figures. Anyway So lets say the person can afford to put away 500 a month it would take 30 yrs to get to the million if he earns an avg of 10%
Which would be worth less than 500k of todays dollars due to inflation. Oh wait it gets better cause then he has to pay taxes.

Expecting people to save $500/month for 30 years is like expecting them to withdraw 4% per year for 30 years.

Regardless of how we spin the math, I'm not sure that I understand this "all or none" campaign. It's all about diversification!

We have our ER portfolio in stocks and we have money invested in a rental home. Both have done well over the last 18 years but the stocks have done better. At this point it's hard for the house to catch up, even if the portfolio reverts to the mean.

But maybe that's because we're not buying bonds or paying off mortgages, either.

 

[sgeeeee]

I've been intrigued by real estate investing in the past. Periodically we get some of these testosterone charged real estate investor posts singing the praises of one or two of their hero results. It sounds good. It clearly is working for them.

But when I looked into real estate in more detail, I realized that owning real estate typically requires you to be a landlord -- and a landlord has to choose appropriate property, find tenants, plan for required legal obligations, arrange financing, and direct or perform maintenance. The more of these tasks the landlord can do himself or herself, the better the investment performs. A single irresponsible tenant can have a devastating impact on real estate returns. If a tenant does not pay rent or refuses to pay for damages, the required court and lawyer’s fees reduce investment returns. It can takes months to evict a bad tenant. Not only the cost, but the time and energy required to exorcise them from the premises can be significant.

Investing in real estate can be lucrative for someone who wants to do all of the above, but it just sounds like a job to me. If you are making more money in real estate than I am with my index funds, you certainly deserve it. I spend my time traveling and playing.

 

[haha]

Investing in real estate can be lucrative for someone who wants to do all of the above, but it just sounds like a job to me.

Agree. Today I had a guy clean my carpets. The job took maybe one hour and he charged $75. He had 3 other jobs in the same complex.

He is a one man, one truck operation. His van and equipment costs max $50,000. His only advertising is to court the office staff in large complexes, and to put fliers in supermarkets, etc. His strategy is to undercut the large companies on price. If he does only 6 per day, for only 200 days he grosses $90,000. The skill set needed is very narrow. The work is active but not really heavy.

He can go away for short periods without worry. His liability is limited. To me, this is a higher return to labor and some small skill than the average guy with rental property, with only the risk of not being able to get enough business to support yourself. In this case his rig still should have pretty good salvage value in a pretty broad market, so even this risk is bounded.

I am not suggesting that this is a good business for someone who could be a software entrepreneur, but more the average high school graduate who also could invest in property if he got a bit of capital. But the RE investor would have to keep his job for some years to support himself or a family, whereas this business would accomplish that.

He really isn’t building any equity as the RE investor often is, but he should have surplus funds to invest in index funds to accomplish that goal. Another negative is that he doesn’t have the huge upside potential of maybe buying in a crash and getting well in the recovery. But then he isn’t exposed to being early and getting his ass kicked either.

Ha

 

[rmark]

Having lived in a college town now for 25 years, I'm convinced that you have 3 choices in real estate investing.
1. REITS
2. one rent house you take care of yourself
3. buy enough property that its your only business

 

[tryan]

Yup, rentals is not for the faint heart. Still working a vacancy: mice baits reveal another 2 dead mice; fridge is filthy beyond repair; don't ask about the bathroom; 2 dump runs to haul abandoned furniture; 2 abandon cars hauled. Entire unit has been repainted ... now steam clean the rugs; paint rather than replace the cabinets ... AND THEN rerent the place and start all over.

All in all not too bad ... I am thankful I didn't need to evict (he stifted me a month and a halfs rent).