Morningstar declares 4% safe once again

[GenXguy]

not being a tv watcher cable tv would be one of the first to go

Yeah, I actually watch TV regularly, but I would still consider that discretionary if I had cable, and streaming services if I was paying for any of those.

I don't consider my internet service to be discretionary in the current era, though. It's more of a fundamental need these days just like having a phone, not just entertainment, plus I'm on the lowest tier I can get at 75 Mbps.

I guess, at the end of the day, people can call these how they want to.

 

[Dtail]

Yeah, I actually watch TV regularly, but I would still consider that discretionary if I had cable, and streaming services if I was paying for any of those.

I don't consider my internet service to be discretionary in the current era, though. It's more of a fundamental need these days just like having a phone, not just entertainment, plus I'm on the lowest tier I can get at 75 Mbps.

I guess, at the end of the day, people can call these how they want to.

True, otherwise we will start creating the discretionary police in addition to the definition of retirement police.

 

[LateToFIRE]

But how exactly would you define "police"? I mean is that a para-military kind of thing or do you mean more of a judicial body?

 

[GravitySucks]

Your non-discretionary food budget should be $180 per person a year.
That’s 25 lbs of rice and 5 lbs of beans each month at 50 cents a pound each.

Anything else is just extravagance!

Discretionary or not is always hard to categorize. In my case had a new Camry level of car budgeted every 5 years. I have to have a car where I live. Turned out this Camry is over 10 years old now so it’s been less than half of budgeted essential expense.

We all have to make our own decisions on what we view as essential.

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

According to Investopedia -->

While non-discretionary expenses are considered mandatory—housing, taxes, debt, and groceries—discretionary expenses are any costs incurred above and beyond what is deemed necessary. These are generally considered wants, while non-discretionary expenses are usually referred to as needs. As such, discretionary expenses rarely have anything to do with a business or household's day-to-day operations and, instead, have to do with lifestyle and choice.

 

[mathjak107]

of course if you live in a warm state , a trailer in a park and a fishing pole is all you need . everything else is a want .

the reality is we all have that line in the sand where anything less then is unacceptable

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

of course if you live in a warm state , a trailer in a park and a fishing pole is all you need . everything else is a want .

the reality is we all have that line in the sand where anything less then is unacceptable

I know, but, as with many things financial there are definitions.

Maybe we have first tier wants and second and third tier wants. But, there is a definition of needs (bare basics rent, food, taxes, debt payments).

 

[mathjak107]

even rent …one can always live golden girl style …they just may choose not to want to live with others.
there is nothing that can’t be downgraded to more basic

 

[GenXguy]

Discretionary or not is always hard to categorize.

I've never considered it hard to categorize something as discretionary. I wouldn't buy a new car every 5 years since I don't drive nearly enough miles to justify that as a requirement.

Maybe we have first tier wants and second and third tier wants. But, there is a definition of needs (bare basics rent, food, taxes, debt payments).

I don't have rent or debt payments, but I have plenty of other non-discretionary expenses besides food and taxes.

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

I've never considered it hard to categorize something as discretionary. I wouldn't buy a new car every 5 years since I don't drive nearly enough miles to justify that as a requirement.
I don't have rent or debt payments, but I have plenty of other non-discretionary expenses besides food and taxes.

Yeah, if we had to we could live on a lot less.

 

[Wile E. Coyote]

even rent …one can always live golden girl style …they just may choose not to want to live with others.
there is nothing that can’t be downgraded to more basic

Yes, but, I guess if you have signed a lease or signed up for a mortgage that is Your Non-Discretionary payment.

 

[mathjak107]

leases can be broken ..it may cost a few bucks if you don’t do it right .

if a tenant is not going to pay the rent a landlord would have to be pretty silly not to let them go so as to avoid going to court and the expenses…

but depending on the laws in one’s state it can be pretty easy in some to just break a lease and pay nothing .

my ex wife did it , it was executed brilliantly.

but typically, yes my rent , utilities, insurance ,parking etc are all non discretionary.

even our LTC PLAN and life insurance which i really don’t need are on the non discretionary side .

my discretionary side is our cars , we eat out and bring in a lot , clothes ,, not mine but mrs mathjaks .

she has so many gym outfits sometimes she is in front of me on the tread and i wont know it’s her .

i will fantasize a few minutes and go damn that’s my wife. ha ha .

our frequent trips we do , our camera gear we buy , distributions we make to the kids in good years , money we invest for the grand kids , there is so much we have in our discretionary budget

 

[Dtail]

But how exactly would you define "police"? I mean is that a para-military kind of thing or do you mean more of a judicial body?

These days it could be either one.

 

[TickTock]

Thanks for the examples. I agree there are many situations and circumstances where someone would want to increase the withdrawal. If one retires with the desired level of budget, spending and portfolio, however, I think the case to increase the WR is not so clear.

I've been considering this.

For myself and DW, we have a conservative WR that will support our spending. But, if somehow (never mind how right now) we had an additional $1,000,000 in the portfolio, I could see us choosing a 3% inflation-adjusted withdrawal rate and splitting it in half. I don't know exactly what I would do with the extra spend, but I do know the category - music. Instruments, recording equipment, live sound, perhaps a complete rig that I could use to provide sound for concerts at science-fiction conventions (I have two friends who do exactly that because they love it and it benefits the sci-fi music community). I don't know what DW would do...

What I'm getting at is that there are things that I'd like to do but are not willing to continue w*rking to fund. So I understand increasing spending after a good portfolio run-up.