Younger people shouldn’t save for retirement

Wow! What a great article. I can't wait to read the next one. "Roth IRA and Roth 401(k): the world would be a better place without them". :facepalm:
 
https://www.marketwatch.com/story/m...d-on-a-nobel-prize-winning-theory-11664562570

Basic idea is you should have a constant level of standard of living to be happy, so no saving in the beginning when you are making less, start banking your raises as you get older, then spend down savings at retirement to maintain your standard of living.

Thanks for posting.

Personally, I disagree with this idea. IMHO, developing a savings habit when one is young is beneficial for the rest of one's life. Any money put into investments at an early age has a long time to compound, and gives the saver a chance to start learning young.

My grandfather used to say "It's easier to sleep on the floor when you are young. Much harder when you are old." Translation - it's easier to tolerate a lower living standard when young. In my life, i have found this to be true, at least for us.
 
I think this might work mathematically, but not behaviorally. If you don't start saving when you're young, it'll be harder and harder down the road. "I have bigger expenses!" "I have kids!" "I have more responsibilities!" But if you're tucking away 20%-50% of your income starting with your very first low-paying job, behaviorally it becomes second nature. And all those excuses become less impactful. AND you'll make some serious investment gains!
 
The word "assume" is used quite frequently when it comes to their model, and it's what drives their conclusion.
 
To a degree DW and I did this. But we were relatively high earners and were able to massively ramp up savings in the second half when we started thinking in FIRE terms. We were also very lucky. For anyone with an FI outlook this is a dangerous approach. Things have to work out just right to keep lifestyle flat. Your income has to continue to grow, your employment needs to stay secure, and you have to be committed to throttling lifestyle creep in later years. For most people, starting out frugle and staying that way until FI is achieved is a better bet.
 
I think this might work mathematically, but not behaviorally. If you don't start saving when you're young, it'll be harder and harder down the road. "I have bigger expenses!" "I have kids!" "I have more responsibilities!" But if you're tucking away 20%-50% of your income starting with your very first low-paying job, behaviorally it becomes second nature. And all those excuses become less impactful. AND you'll make some serious investment gains!

+1
 
I was a much lower earner starting out. Took me a few years to crack $30k per year without doing crazy amounts of overtime (in the 90's). Was I saving? No! I was scraping by. I was carefully balancing each paycheck with which bills, and carving out a little for having a life. Nothing crazy just an evening out with friends here and there. A few nice things for my room, car maintenance and rent.

And that was all there was.

I was in my late 20's before I started doing more than 1% in my 401k. But I increased it as my earnings did over the coming years.
 
We’ve lived the scenario described by the article - relatively low earnings until my 30s with no savings at all, but also no debt except for the mortgage on a small $68k house. We were very disciplined with our spending out of necessity. Once earnings grew, and they grew significantly, the disciplined habits remained and we lived well below our means, allowing me to retire at 55. So it can be done, but is predicated on a significant increase in earnings starting in your 30s while keeping spending habits in check. What I absolutely disagree with are the comments about high earners being able to defer savings until middle age. That’s a recipe for disaster because once those spending habits are ingrained, they’re almost impossible to break. And there’s no guarantee that those high wages will continue for the remainder of one’s career.
 
In my experience, people who did not start saving when they were young never developed the habit later.
 
The article assumes that everyone is a white collar worker whose income increases higher than the rate of inflation thru out their career. That is not the case for around half the workforce so this article is actually dangerous for many people. Also, you don't know what might happen later in life like with me for example. I had a serious injury that greatly reduced my income potential after age 40. If I hadn't saved in my 20's I would be in real trouble. I saved a third of my modest $40K/yr income for 11 years from age 21-31(2001-2011). Since age 31 I have averaged less than $20K/yr income and didn't save much at all but I didn't touch what I saved in my 20's so I will be ok since I don't spend much. I think everyone should save as much as they reasonably can as soon as they can.
 
I think the paper behind this Marketwatch article was written by people who have spent too much time in academia and don’t have enough experience living in the real world.

https://jor.pm-research.com/content/early/2022/08/28/jor.2022.1.119

The Life-Cycle Model Implies that Most Young People Should Not Save for Retirement
Retirement policy is often predicated on the belief that more saving is always better, at least at the margin. This belief is used to justify the increasingly widespread practice of automatically enrolling workers in employer-sponsored defined contribution plans. However, the conclusion that individuals do not save optimally for retirement requires a benchmark for optimal behavior. A reasonable benchmark that is often used in the academic literature is the life-cycle model, in which rational individuals allocate resources over their lifetimes with the aim of avoiding sharp changes in their standard of living. We argue that, under realistic assumptions, the life-cycle model implies that most young people should not save for retirement. First, high-income workers tend to experience wage growth over their careers. For these workers, maintaining as steady a standard of living as possible therefore requires spending all income while young and only starting to save for retirement during middle age. Second, low-income workers, whose wage profiles tend to be flatter, receive high Social Security replacement rates, making optimal saving rates very low. Finally, for all workers, low real interest rates make a front-loaded lifetime spending profile optimal. We show that the welfare costs of automatically enrolling younger workers in defined contribution plans—if they are passive savers who do not opt out immediately—can be substantial, even with employer matching.
 
The article assumes that everyone is a white collar worker whose income increases higher than the rate of inflation thru out their career. That is not the case for around half the workforce so this article is actually dangerous for many people. Also, you don't know what might happen later in life like with me for example. I had a serious injury that greatly reduced my income potential after age 40. If I hadn't saved in my 20's I would be in real trouble. I saved a third of my modest $40K/yr income for 11 years from age 21-31(2001-2011). Since age 31 I have averaged less than $20K/yr income and didn't save much at all but I didn't touch what I saved in my 20's so I will be ok since I don't spend much. I think everyone should save as much as they reasonably can as soon as they can.

Yep, that's what my oldest is doing now...30% to his Roth TSP which gets him a 5% match to traditional.
 
I have to say some of his ideas hit home. Not for any long term plan, but by financial capability. When starting out, I had no savable income. Setting up a "lower than average cost" home, having a family, driving used cars, doing my own home maintenance and car repairs all took everything I earned. However, by the time I was 30, I started saving small in a 401K. Then 1/2 of each raise wnet to increase the retirement saving. It worked for us.

I agree with others that waiting until later to save for retirement is not the way to go. Habits are hard to change by then and, as has been mentioned, nobody knows their future capability for earning. Physical health changes. Companies have layoffs. Difficulty for a 50+ year old to find employment and more.
 
The article assumes that everyone is a white collar worker whose income increases higher than the rate of inflation thru out their career. That is not the case for around half the workforce so this article is actually dangerous for many people. Also, you don't know what might happen later in life like with me for example. I had a serious injury that greatly reduced my income potential after age 40. If I hadn't saved in my 20's I would be in real trouble. I saved a third of my modest $40K/yr income for 11 years from age 21-31(2001-2011). Since age 31 I have averaged less than $20K/yr income and didn't save much at all but I didn't touch what I saved in my 20's so I will be ok since I don't spend much. I think everyone should save as much as they reasonably can as soon as they can.

+1

"Get while the getting is good", because you never know how long it will be good.

-gauss
 
It's about forming habits and discipline early to "pay yourself first" (and the benefit of time compounding). My first paycheck over 42 years ago had a $9 deduction into company's thrift plan. I never missed a deduction after that no matter what. The deductions got larger over time and I am benefitting from it now.
 
"As for the folks who might say you’re losing the power of compounding, Scott had this to say: “I think the power of compounding is challenged when real interest rates are 0%.” Of course, one could earn more than 0% real interest but that would mean taking on additional risk"

Scott said. “For investing, our model does look at riskless interest rates. We argue that investment expected returns and risks are in equilibrium, so the core result is unlikely to change by introducing risky investments. However, it is definitely a limitation of our approach.”

Dismissing the power of compounding and stating our model looks at riskless (zero) interest rates...then acknowledged however it is definitely a limitation of our approach.....

Yeah a rather BIG limitation...there are risk no matter what you do. Getting out of bed every morning is risky but staying in bed has its own risk. Waiting to get out of bed ten years to avoid risk probably not a good idea....sleep on that... LOL

This article reminds me of all the people I used to listen to at work who said why bother saving. It's rigged, too complicated and we will never be able to afford to retire. It's just more excuses not to save when your young. Which is the best time to take advantage of the power of compounding.

Well guess what retirement age gets here a lot quicker than you expect. Glad we finally wised up and started to act our wage...only wished we had done it a lot sooner to take advantage of the compounding that was dismissed in this article. We would be in a much more comfortable position if we would have started early and let time and compounding do there thing.
 
I read the article. The quote that stood out for me is this one:

Scott doesn’t disagree that workers should have savings benchmarks as a multiple of income. But he said a high-income worker who waits until middle age to save for retirement can easily reach the later-age benchmarks. “Savings for retirement probably is more in the zero range until 35 or so,” Scott said. “And then it is probably faster after that because you want to accumulate the same amount.”
My bullet points, some of which agree with the article, some of which disagree:

  • I do believe the priority, before savings is figuring out the lifestyle and required income you need to support that lifestyle.
  • They are not knocking saving in general; they are specific about saving for retirement. No where is mentioned that one should not have savings for emergencies, in case of job loss, for large purchases, etc. That is part of figuring out the lifestyle you want to live.
  • Just as we who invest cannot assume the market will provide a "linear" return of 8-10% every year, one cannot assume that a high paying job will always provide salary increases, or even be there. Back in the early 80s, writing programming code was a very lucrative, high paying job, wherever one was. Now, not as much so. I get offers for jobs that 15-20 years ago would have paid $150K that are now paying around $100K 9and they expect you to know and much wider range of technologies).
  • If you are fortunate to have a job that consistently pays well, and your desired lifestyle is below your income, you can wait to heavily save for retirement - though I do not think you would have as much as if you have started when young. This is my situation. While we had savings and did LBYM, I did not get serious about saving specifically for retirement until I was in my late 30s/early 40s and Megacorp changed the retirement plan to reduce my pension. Fortunately, since we already had the discipline of saving, we could build on that to save more. I did not max out my 401K contributions until age 40. Looking at the 40 calendar years I worked for Megacorp, 38% of my earnings occurred in the last 10 years (staring at age 50), and 75% in the last 20 years (starting at age 40). Not letting our lifestyle rise too much above what it was at age 40 helped the rapid savings buildup.
  • They ignore the fact that "risky" investments, the way they define them, over the long term are not really risky. Of course, with the daily economic "financial porn" of "it's up! it's down!", that is to be expected :).
In sum, the article should a put a better emphasis on "you might not have to start saving specifically for retirement later in life, but the discipline of saving should be started as early as possible". Many will read this at take is as "I do not need to save at all now, it will not make a difference".
 
Life doesn't always go as planned. One bad car accident can change your future earning prospects overnight. It is best to save while you can and focus on having a fun lifestyle that fits in your budget even when you are young.
 
First, high-income workers tend to experience wage growth over their careers. For these workers, maintaining as steady a standard of living as possible therefore requires spending all income while young and only starting to save for retirement during middle age.

My goal throughout my career was never to "maintain as steady a standard of living as possible". It was to maximize my income and to save/invest as much as possible while not depriving myself. I'm pretty sure if I'd pursued the "steady standard of living" goal, I never would have amassed enough to FIRE in my mid-40s. Maybe the article is irrelevant to those who are interested in FIREing?
 
I started saving early because we were pretty poor, poorer than I realized until later in life. I actually saved and counted my savings as having enough money for 1 year of food, then 2 years of food .. etc.
It was a good habit, and I'm glad I learned to save.
Since nobody knows the future, not saving until much older is (IMHO) really stupid.
 
I don't agree either. If you have no savings, you are going on credit card debt early for stuff that even a few grand would cover. Then you pay interest.

Seems like such an easy thing eh? Oh, but don't mess with my "lifestyle"

Amazing.
 
insane. Having lived the lifestyle of being minimally able to save in our 20s we were both graduate students on stipends, we tried our best to not have CC debt (successful), bought a house, and paid off our student loans and car loans. So I can see that saving for retirement was minimal for us and many others in our 20s. But we were still "saving" if you consider paying off student loans and car loans savings. We weren't living it up and running up more debt to live a lifestyle we had to have our entire lives. Insane.
 
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