Ethical question: fire vs retire
- Thread starter ReadyOrNot
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Tractor guy
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Like others on this thread, I vote against trying to get fired. A lot of my retired friends have come back as part time consultants. Most are doing if for the companionship rather than the money. I learned long ago to never burn any bridges because sometimes you have to cross them going the other way.
Also, in my case there was a significant year end bonus that is prorated to retirees if they leave with an "acceptable" performance rating.
I also don't think its wise to tell anybody that you're thinking about retiring until a RIF actually is announced. I made the mistake of telling my boss that I was considering it. Heard 3 months later when a RIF was being discussed that the management team had discussed my situation and decided to keep me in place. Apparently they thought that I'd likely leave without the retirement incentive and concluded that they could eliminate my position when I pulled the trigger. Just one more way for them to save a dollar.
My company required 60 days notice. If I'd done it over, that's all I would have given them.
Also, in my case there was a significant year end bonus that is prorated to retirees if they leave with an "acceptable" performance rating.
I also don't think its wise to tell anybody that you're thinking about retiring until a RIF actually is announced. I made the mistake of telling my boss that I was considering it. Heard 3 months later when a RIF was being discussed that the management team had discussed my situation and decided to keep me in place. Apparently they thought that I'd likely leave without the retirement incentive and concluded that they could eliminate my position when I pulled the trigger. Just one more way for them to save a dollar.
My company required 60 days notice. If I'd done it over, that's all I would have given them.
GoodSense
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The same thing happened at my company: Less competent people were let go and given a generous package, while the rest of us slaved away with a heavier work load. It was hard to watch my former coworkers enjoying the summer off while I was busy all the time at w*rk!
I thought about goofing off to see if I could be laid off, but decided 1) it's really not worth it to my dignity, 2) If I goof off, someone else would have to pick up my slack, 3) never burn any bridges, and 4) I would have to be nearly completely unproductive for my company to do something. So instead, I landed a new job and quit my old j*b last week. It's true that when you resign, you get nothing. But my pride was intact, which in retrospect, was important to me.
I thought about goofing off to see if I could be laid off, but decided 1) it's really not worth it to my dignity, 2) If I goof off, someone else would have to pick up my slack, 3) never burn any bridges, and 4) I would have to be nearly completely unproductive for my company to do something. So instead, I landed a new job and quit my old j*b last week. It's true that when you resign, you get nothing. But my pride was intact, which in retrospect, was important to me.
obgyn65
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Corporate ORphan
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I agree with the people who said not to try to get fired. My company had an early buy-out right before it was taken over. If you stayed and gambled that you would be one of the thousands that were let go after the buy-out, the package was more. A couple more years was added to your age and service for your pension. Depending on your situation this could have added a lot or a little to it.
I was just a year and a half shy of the age to take the early retirement package. I would have very much preferred to have taken it though it would have cost me 3% of my pension.
The reasons I feel this way are:
1) Having no control over what was happening to me was very stressful.
2) I couldn't plan for it since I didn't know what was going to happen. The early retirees got a least a month or more to make plans and "adjust".
3) Even though you know you didn't do anything "wrong" going through the process with HR and my boss felt "awful". Instead of celebrating 30 years of my "working" life ending and a new beginning, I had 15 minutes to "clean out my desk". It still hurts a little when I think about it.
which brings me to:
4) I'm not one for parties but I missed out on the company sponsored retirement party that they had for people. I went to a few for other people and the really nice thing about them was people who you used to work with (that you had forgotten about) showed up.
plus I didn't get any of the "fun" people had saying good-bye, knowing they were retiring and that great "I'm going on vacation forever" feeling.
Some of this might sound petty but until you actually go through it, you don't know how you will feel. I liked my job and the people who I worked with. Maybe that makes a difference.
Your boss knows by your age that you are probably a "short timer". My two cents would be go to him/her and explain that you like working there but you wouldn't mind a package. That way if they do need to downsize they will keep you in mind but they don't know when you plan to retire.
I was just a year and a half shy of the age to take the early retirement package. I would have very much preferred to have taken it though it would have cost me 3% of my pension.
The reasons I feel this way are:
1) Having no control over what was happening to me was very stressful.
2) I couldn't plan for it since I didn't know what was going to happen. The early retirees got a least a month or more to make plans and "adjust".
3) Even though you know you didn't do anything "wrong" going through the process with HR and my boss felt "awful". Instead of celebrating 30 years of my "working" life ending and a new beginning, I had 15 minutes to "clean out my desk". It still hurts a little when I think about it.
which brings me to:
4) I'm not one for parties but I missed out on the company sponsored retirement party that they had for people. I went to a few for other people and the really nice thing about them was people who you used to work with (that you had forgotten about) showed up.
plus I didn't get any of the "fun" people had saying good-bye, knowing they were retiring and that great "I'm going on vacation forever" feeling.
Some of this might sound petty but until you actually go through it, you don't know how you will feel. I liked my job and the people who I worked with. Maybe that makes a difference.
Your boss knows by your age that you are probably a "short timer". My two cents would be go to him/her and explain that you like working there but you wouldn't mind a package. That way if they do need to downsize they will keep you in mind but they don't know when you plan to retire.
BigNick
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Having seen that article, particularly the second half, I now know what quite a few of my colleagues have been reading.
easysurfer
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
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Finances aside, in my opinion, I think there's some satisfaction in leaving on your own terms. I think if you are ready to FIRE, then if the megacorp just happens to offer a retirement package, then that's just icing on the cake. On the otherhand, if you can go "Read or Not, I'm FIRE'ing on my own terms..." that's rewarding too in itself.
ItDontMeanAThing
Full time employment: Posting here.
I don't understand the talk about getting fired. OP said people who were laid off got severance.
I agree with others who say if the company treated you well then don't try to get let go just for the severance.
You said ER in 2011. I have a suggestion, based only on my personal experience. When I knew my last job was in fact going to be my last job I adopted a 'don't worry, be happy' attitude. Ignored office politics and gossip. Focused on the parts of the job I enjoyed and put minimum effort and time into the rest of it. Ignored pressure to work harder (I was a computer programmer who knew many studies have shown that when programmers work more than they want to the bug rate skyrockets. On past jobs I usually ignored the pressure, but this time it didn't cause me stress). Turned out I liked the job and income enough to postpone ER. But, if I'd been offered a severance package during that period ....
I agree with others who say if the company treated you well then don't try to get let go just for the severance.
You said ER in 2011. I have a suggestion, based only on my personal experience. When I knew my last job was in fact going to be my last job I adopted a 'don't worry, be happy' attitude. Ignored office politics and gossip. Focused on the parts of the job I enjoyed and put minimum effort and time into the rest of it. Ignored pressure to work harder (I was a computer programmer who knew many studies have shown that when programmers work more than they want to the bug rate skyrockets. On past jobs I usually ignored the pressure, but this time it didn't cause me stress). Turned out I liked the job and income enough to postpone ER. But, if I'd been offered a severance package during that period ....
Take the high road and be patient if you can. Worked for MegaCorp 30 years age 56. Started telling upper management that I wanted to slow down and thought it would be good to help in some transition type projects to help in the case I was gone. In return I only asked if RIF was ever available, "Please feel free to pick me" They swore THAT would never happen!! Age 58 2009 the BIG RIFs came, and while they were apologizing I was smiling: Going on second year and life is so great. Freedom to do so many things while I am still young and health and the early pension checks just keep on coming. I felt like I left with dignity, pride and a lot of friends thankful that their new roles were easier to manage because I trained them to replace me for two years.
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