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dory36
Early-Retirement.org Founder, Developer of FIRECal
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2002
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Hello Merlin, and welcome.
If you are hoping to hang on for 5 more years to reach your financial requirements, I understand, but if it's just to reach some magic age, then think about what you will get by another 5 years of high stress!
Be sure you listen to our theme song, announced a few months ago in the following post:
Good luck!
Dory36
If you are hoping to hang on for 5 more years to reach your financial requirements, I understand, but if it's just to reach some magic age, then think about what you will get by another 5 years of high stress!
Be sure you listen to our theme song, announced a few months ago in the following post:
Good luck!
Dory36
Hello all.....just joined this board......
Merlin, I too am sick and tired of being sick and tired of working. My wife and I both have high stress management positions that no longer make work fun.
We plan to go the ER route once our son is out of college in 5 years.
Merlin, I too am sick and tired of being sick and tired of working. My wife and I both have high stress management positions that no longer make work fun.
We plan to go the ER route once our son is out of college in 5 years.
E
eridanus2
Guest
Dory, I missed that post of yours and just listened to the song. Funny, funny, stuff.
thrumytree
Confused about dryer sheets
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2004
- Messages
- 6
Hi ERers,
I'm a Fool refugee from way back when they first started charging. I visited this site so I could intelligently answer the pressing question of whether the "intercst" board should merge with the "dory" board.
Currently, I'm a law student and should be graduating at the ripe old age of 32. At that time I will become "another scum-sucking lawyer." With any luck, after I gradge, I'll secure a position as a patent attorney. The salaries are pretty good in that area, so I'm hoping that after 15 years or so of full-time work, that I'll be able to cut the emplilical cord and mature into a fully self-actualized early retiree.
I look forward to sharing the experiences of early-retirees and wannabe-retirees.
I'm a Fool refugee from way back when they first started charging. I visited this site so I could intelligently answer the pressing question of whether the "intercst" board should merge with the "dory" board.
Currently, I'm a law student and should be graduating at the ripe old age of 32. At that time I will become "another scum-sucking lawyer." With any luck, after I gradge, I'll secure a position as a patent attorney. The salaries are pretty good in that area, so I'm hoping that after 15 years or so of full-time work, that I'll be able to cut the emplilical cord and mature into a fully self-actualized early retiree.
I look forward to sharing the experiences of early-retirees and wannabe-retirees.
Bayfield40
Dryer sheet wannabe
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2004
- Messages
- 21
I've been reading this board almost daily since I found it some time ago. Guess I'll finally come out from my "lurkdom" and participate.
My husband and I are almost there! Already gave notice that we're out of here at the end of the year. The boat will be paid for, a little money will be put aside and the warm waters are calling. We've both worked since we were old enough to and at 46 and 55 we think we've earned some R and R!
We sure wish we would have had our epiphany earlier in our lives and saved more! As it is, we're going to do our best to stretch it as far as we can, but have acknowledged that we may have to stop to replenish the cruising kitty from time to time. Hmmm.... does that disqualify us as ER's Still feels like retiring to me!
This board has been wonderful! So much info and support. I'm not sure if I would have been as comfortable about doing this if I hadn't read some of your stories - particularly yours, John Galt! You are my inspiration!
270 days and counting!
My husband and I are almost there! Already gave notice that we're out of here at the end of the year. The boat will be paid for, a little money will be put aside and the warm waters are calling. We've both worked since we were old enough to and at 46 and 55 we think we've earned some R and R!
We sure wish we would have had our epiphany earlier in our lives and saved more! As it is, we're going to do our best to stretch it as far as we can, but have acknowledged that we may have to stop to replenish the cruising kitty from time to time. Hmmm.... does that disqualify us as ER's
Still feels like retiring to me! This board has been wonderful! So much info and support. I'm not sure if I would have been as comfortable about doing this if I hadn't read some of your stories - particularly yours, John Galt! You are my inspiration!
270 days and counting!
Bayfield40
Dryer sheet wannabe
- Joined
- Feb 16, 2004
- Messages
- 21
I've been reading this board almost daily since I found it some time ago. Guess I'll finally come out from my "lurkdom" and participate.
My husband and I are almost there! Already gave notice that we're out of here at the end of the year. The boat will be paid for, a little money will be put aside and the warm waters are calling. We've both worked since we were old enough to and at 46 and 55 we think we've earned some R and R!
We sure wish we would have had our epiphany earlier in our lives and saved more! As it is, we're going to do our best to stretch it as far as we can, but have acknowledged that we may have to stop to replenish the cruising kitty from time to time. Hmmm.... does that disqualify us as ER's Still feels like retiring to me!
This board has been wonderful! So much info and support. I'm not sure if I would have been as comfortable about doing this if I hadn't read some of your stories - particularly yours, John Galt! You are my inspiration!
270 days and counting!
My husband and I are almost there! Already gave notice that we're out of here at the end of the year. The boat will be paid for, a little money will be put aside and the warm waters are calling. We've both worked since we were old enough to and at 46 and 55 we think we've earned some R and R!
We sure wish we would have had our epiphany earlier in our lives and saved more! As it is, we're going to do our best to stretch it as far as we can, but have acknowledged that we may have to stop to replenish the cruising kitty from time to time. Hmmm.... does that disqualify us as ER's
Still feels like retiring to me! This board has been wonderful! So much info and support. I'm not sure if I would have been as comfortable about doing this if I hadn't read some of your stories - particularly yours, John Galt! You are my inspiration!
270 days and counting!
P
Paul
Guest
Hi Trummy Tree,
I thought about going to law school for intellectual property law and decided the financial payoff was not adequate to give up my engineering salary for 3 years. The break-even point takes about 10 years. Further, engineering is more interesting than practicing patent law, even though the salary is significantly lower.
Paul
thrumytree
Confused about dryer sheets
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2004
- Messages
- 6
It's definitely a tough call. I will probably end up retiring at about the same time as if I had just stayed in engineering. However, school is like retirement for me (no boss), so I am counting my three years in school as three additional years of freedom.
In fact, after I retire for good, I will probably go back to school to pursue some other degree. However, it may not be justifiable if you just look at the dollars and sense.
In fact, after I retire for good, I will probably go back to school to pursue some other degree. However, it may not be justifiable if you just look at the dollars and sense.
thrumytree
Confused about dryer sheets
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2004
- Messages
- 6
It's definitely a tough call. I will probably end up retiring at about the same time as if I had just stayed in engineering. However, school is like retirement for me (no boss), so I am counting my three years in school as three additional years of freedom.
In fact, after I retire for good, I will probably go back to school to pursue some other degree. However, it may not be justifiable to trade in an engineering career for law school on a strictly dollars and sense basis.
In fact, after I retire for good, I will probably go back to school to pursue some other degree. However, it may not be justifiable to trade in an engineering career for law school on a strictly dollars and sense basis.
thrumytree
Confused about dryer sheets
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2004
- Messages
- 6
It's definitely a tough call. I will probably end up retiring at about the same time as if I had just stayed in engineering. However, school is like retirement for me (no boss), so I am counting my three years in school as three additional years of freedom.
In fact, after I retire for good, I will probably go back to school to pursue some other degree. However, it may not be justifiable to trade in an engineering career for law school on a strictly dollars and sense basis.
In fact, after I retire for good, I will probably go back to school to pursue some other degree. However, it may not be justifiable to trade in an engineering career for law school on a strictly dollars and sense basis.
MattInAustin
Dryer sheet aficionado
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2004
- Messages
- 26
Let me first say that this board is one of the best things I have stumbled on while aimlessly wandering the web looking for happiness (ok, maybe I am not that aimless). You guys are the most well mannered forum members I have ever seen and you have wonderful comments and helpful information to share. The best thing is that its all backed up with great experience. From asset allocation and SWR to FIRE lifestyles and places to live, the information is a gold mine for me.
I have been lurking for a while, but just couldn't hold my gratitude in for much longer. I just had to say thank you for all the information and take a minute to introduce myself.
I am not so sure about RE, but I am sure about wanting FI. My plan is to have enough in investments in the next 2-4 years to be able to say goodbye to the grind if I am so inclined. I have to say that I dislike the corporate world, but I get to work out of my house and have lots of freedom in my current job and bring in way more than I am worth every pay check. The point being, I would almost be crazy to give it up. However, in the meantime I feel like I am not doing what I should be doing. I don't have any sense of passion for my current job. Its very unfullfilling. I struggle with how much I need to have in the reserves before I can let that cash flow go. 1M after taxes seems like a minimum. 2M seems like way more than enough. When do you give up the gravy train of a big salary and in my case vesting stock options?
My current dream is to get to a point where I can live without a job, but still pursue creating a business that I really enjoy. A business that brings in anywhere from 10K to 30K a year profit to help supplement my investment income would be great. I have some ideas, but time will tell if I can make a go of it...
Anyway, thanks for creating this forum and sharing all of your information. I will be coming back and probably mainly lurking every week.
Here is a little more about me and my financial status...
- 35 years old
- I have 265K in a very balanced brokerage account, mix of index and individual stocks along with a bond fund, 50K in a European brokerage, 600K in vested options if sold today (still lots vesting). 130K equity in my home. 80K in 401K. 70K in company stock purchase plan (waiting on qualifying disposition). 25K in cash. About 40K investing in a Venture Capital partnership which I assume will give me my money back, but it could go belly up or do much better. Plus some privately held stock in a company getting ready to IPO.
- I am debt free except for 90K on my mortgage.
- single (for now)
- salary around $190K depending on bonus (very hard to give up even though I live on about 35K a year).
Thats me in a nutshell. Any advice, commiseration, or admonishment is welcome. In the mean time, I am going to continue to explore the forum and play with FIRECalc!!!
Biker
I have been lurking for a while, but just couldn't hold my gratitude in for much longer. I just had to say thank you for all the information and take a minute to introduce myself.
I am not so sure about RE, but I am sure about wanting FI. My plan is to have enough in investments in the next 2-4 years to be able to say goodbye to the grind if I am so inclined. I have to say that I dislike the corporate world, but I get to work out of my house and have lots of freedom in my current job and bring in way more than I am worth every pay check. The point being, I would almost be crazy to give it up. However, in the meantime I feel like I am not doing what I should be doing. I don't have any sense of passion for my current job. Its very unfullfilling. I struggle with how much I need to have in the reserves before I can let that cash flow go. 1M after taxes seems like a minimum. 2M seems like way more than enough. When do you give up the gravy train of a big salary and in my case vesting stock options?
My current dream is to get to a point where I can live without a job, but still pursue creating a business that I really enjoy. A business that brings in anywhere from 10K to 30K a year profit to help supplement my investment income would be great. I have some ideas, but time will tell if I can make a go of it...
Anyway, thanks for creating this forum and sharing all of your information. I will be coming back and probably mainly lurking every week.
Here is a little more about me and my financial status...
- 35 years old
- I have 265K in a very balanced brokerage account, mix of index and individual stocks along with a bond fund, 50K in a European brokerage, 600K in vested options if sold today (still lots vesting). 130K equity in my home. 80K in 401K. 70K in company stock purchase plan (waiting on qualifying disposition). 25K in cash. About 40K investing in a Venture Capital partnership which I assume will give me my money back, but it could go belly up or do much better. Plus some privately held stock in a company getting ready to IPO.
- I am debt free except for 90K on my mortgage.
- single (for now)
- salary around $190K depending on bonus (very hard to give up even though I live on about 35K a year).
Thats me in a nutshell. Any advice, commiseration, or admonishment is welcome. In the mean time, I am going to continue to explore the forum and play with FIRECalc!!!
Biker
haha
Give me a museum and I'll fill it. (Picasso) Give me a forum ...
Welcome, Biker. I have begun to think that the answers one gets to questions here depend an awful lot on the attitudes of the answering person. Although I retured early, more or less cheaply, and without a lot of reserve, I have done very well and I am much more secure now. Nevertheless, I think a lot of that is luck.
I don't think $2mm is "way too much". I think that since you are getting paid as well as you are, you aren't in agony going to work, and you have options in the pipeline, HANG ON! Nobody is likely to grant you options ever again.
Anyway, if having $2mm feels good, having $4mm must feel better. Wouldn't you rather drive a Boxster than a Corolla?
Also, uless you are truly rich, it is easier to find a woman when you have a job, should that interest you. Like I told one of my sons, you can always find a woman when you have a job. However, nobody gets a job because he has a woman.
My rather predictable 2 cents!
Mikey
wabmester
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
- Joined
- Dec 6, 2003
- Messages
- 4,459
Biker, it looks like 1/2 your net worth is in unexercised options. I'm sure I don't have to tell you what that does to your risk profile. All I can say is don't get greedy. Take some money off the table and let your unvested options carry your risk.
I've known some people who were multi-multi-millionaires one day and in debt up to their eyeballs several days later. They tell me it felt worse going down than it felt good going up.
I've known some people who were multi-multi-millionaires one day and in debt up to their eyeballs several days later. They tell me it felt worse going down than it felt good going up.
P
Paul
Guest
Biker,
Wow, that is a great situation. You should be able to retire soon for sure. What type of work that pays that well while you can do at home? Is it consulting?
Paul
thrumytree
Confused about dryer sheets
- Joined
- Feb 20, 2004
- Messages
- 6
I bet he's a salesman. One of my friends was a salesman for Redback during the bubble. He worked from home and had $1.5 million in options at the age of 34. Unfortunately he didn't exercise until after the bubble deflated, and by that time the value of his options were down to $200,000. Today, that money is in bonds.
P
Paul
Guest
What a bummer! From millionaire in paper to "reality".
AltaRed
Full time employment: Posting here.
Biker, I agree with Wabmaster. Don't get greedy with your vested options. The risk profile can be severe.
I've seen executives in the company I work for having to exercise options in 2001, 2002 and 2003 that were worth at least a third less than the stock was worth in 1999 and 2000. They got greedy thinking the stock would continue to grow and they could flip the stock at increasing value.
I, fortunately, exercised all my available vested options in 2000 at about the peak in stock value and re-distributed proceeds into diversified investments. The stock still has not returned to that peak.
I've seen executives in the company I work for having to exercise options in 2001, 2002 and 2003 that were worth at least a third less than the stock was worth in 1999 and 2000. They got greedy thinking the stock would continue to grow and they could flip the stock at increasing value.
I, fortunately, exercised all my available vested options in 2000 at about the peak in stock value and re-distributed proceeds into diversified investments. The stock still has not returned to that peak.
MattInAustin
Dryer sheet aficionado
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2004
- Messages
- 26
Thanks for all the great advice. I think I should probably ride the wave of good cash flow and option vesting for as long as I can. I think my main target is to build a good cushion and reserve that is in med to low risk investment so that if I do get to fed up with the job, or if I get laid off, I will not panic and eat through my savings, but have a nice investement income to hold me.
I think its also a great opportunity to start tinkering with some ideas that I am more passionate about and would like to create into some sort of business. The money I bring in now can help finance a lot of experimintation and product validation. However, the primary purpose of my money is to create FI.
<snip>
Wow, that is a great situation. You should be able to retire soon for sure. What type of work that pays that well while you can do at home? Is it consulting?
I am not a consultant. I do a variety of projects that are primarily focused on strategic direction of our company as it impacts the sales force. My background is in sales and engineering though. We have an excellent bonus program that accounts for about 35% of my pay.
As far as getting out of the stock options, I hear you loud and clear. I have been slowly diversifying and still have plenty more to go. Its an incredibly difficult psychological barrier to just let it all go at once. Exercising everything at once and then paying regular income tax on it makes a huge impact on its future growth. Paying taxes later always works out so much better. However, fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice....I definately am on a sale plan. I don't like bubbles.
I am also struggling with what to do with my European brokerage account. I only hold one stock in it and I am getting ready to sell my position there and put into my diversified account. I can see some value in having money in a different country, but its also kind of unnerving having it so far away. Anybody have any comments?
Thanks...
Biker
I think its also a great opportunity to start tinkering with some ideas that I am more passionate about and would like to create into some sort of business. The money I bring in now can help finance a lot of experimintation and product validation. However, the primary purpose of my money is to create FI.
<snip>
Wow, that is a great situation. You should be able to retire soon for sure. What type of work that pays that well while you can do at home? Is it consulting?
I am not a consultant. I do a variety of projects that are primarily focused on strategic direction of our company as it impacts the sales force. My background is in sales and engineering though. We have an excellent bonus program that accounts for about 35% of my pay.
As far as getting out of the stock options, I hear you loud and clear. I have been slowly diversifying and still have plenty more to go. Its an incredibly difficult psychological barrier to just let it all go at once. Exercising everything at once and then paying regular income tax on it makes a huge impact on its future growth. Paying taxes later always works out so much better. However, fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice....I definately am on a sale plan. I don't like bubbles.
I am also struggling with what to do with my European brokerage account. I only hold one stock in it and I am getting ready to sell my position there and put into my diversified account. I can see some value in having money in a different country, but its also kind of unnerving having it so far away. Anybody have any comments?
Thanks...
Biker
Peter
Full time employment: Posting here.
With the dollar close to its all-time lows against most major European currencies, I would be selling out! You can always buy back in again when exchange rates drift back to something more normal.
Regarding options -- yes, it's a hard decision. But I know several people who held on because of tax advantages and expected future growth, only to find that their stock price collapsed. A good part of my net worth is from options that I exercised as soon as they vested. If I had held on, I would have made much more money (as it turns out), but I don't regret the decision.
I suppose it all comes down to risk tolerance. It also helps to sell your retrospectoscope on e-bay, and forget you ever had one!
Peter
T
TMT
Guest
Hey Biker,
I'm not sure if this would work, but you might be able to avoid taxes, but still lock in your options gains, by shorting your company's stock on the open market. I think Mark Cuban did something like this after Yahoo! bought out his company.
It might be worth it to talk to an accountant about this. There may also be ethical and legal considerations.
I'm not sure if this would work, but you might be able to avoid taxes, but still lock in your options gains, by shorting your company's stock on the open market. I think Mark Cuban did something like this after Yahoo! bought out his company.
It might be worth it to talk to an accountant about this. There may also be ethical and legal considerations.
E
eridanus2
Guest
Hmm, shorting and not exercising would lock in gains and defer taxes. You'd have to carry a margin but you'd never have to worry about a margin call (assuming the options were vested). You could also buy OTM puts and do the same.
Anyway, Biker, I think you should increase your cash reserves. You have less than a year's worth in cash. if you quit, or things go poorly, you'll need more to avoid drawing on your investments in a downturn. I like I-bonds, which can be liquidated quickly after a year.
Anyway, Biker, I think you should increase your cash reserves. You have less than a year's worth in cash. if you quit, or things go poorly, you'll need more to avoid drawing on your investments in a downturn. I like I-bonds, which can be liquidated quickly after a year.
wabmester
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
- Joined
- Dec 6, 2003
- Messages
- 4,459
It's called shorting against the box, and it's such a good idea that the IRS has ruled on it. But I can't remember if they disallow it against unexercised options -- ask your tax guy.
I've been lurking the board for a little while now and thought I'd finally register (Okay, actually I finally posted something as a guest and GDER was kind enough to encourage me to register).
My wife and I are mid-30's and have two cute little children (3 and 1). We are both actively saving toward what we hope is an early FI/RE lifestyle (military retirement with maybe a few years work beyond, augmented by investments). I am most interested in learning the lifestyles and costs of retirement for all those that dove in the RE waters ahead of us.
Thank you all for everything I've absorbed to date.
Spark
My wife and I are mid-30's and have two cute little children (3 and 1). We are both actively saving toward what we hope is an early FI/RE lifestyle (military retirement with maybe a few years work beyond, augmented by investments). I am most interested in learning the lifestyles and costs of retirement for all those that dove in the RE waters ahead of us.
Thank you all for everything I've absorbed to date.
Spark
BUM
Thinks s/he gets paid by the post
Spark,
You are singing my song...I think. Hate to say it but I believe most things I'm interested in have already been done by someone else....likely zillions of other people, esp. R/E... This board is not an arena for leadership, quite the reverse. To me, the original thinking here, its in the realm of "how" to retire early not "if" or even "when".
I'm soaking it up like a sponge. Welcome aboard!
BUM
You are singing my song...I think. Hate to say it but I believe most things I'm interested in have already been done by someone else....likely zillions of other people, esp. R/E... This board is not an arena for leadership, quite the reverse. To me, the original thinking here, its in the realm of "how" to retire early not "if" or even "when".
I'm soaking it up like a sponge. Welcome aboard!
BUM
- Status
