Disillusioned with HOA and thinking of moving

[pb4uski]

Having served on two HOA boards, here is the lesson I have learned: problems happen when people don’t read the rules or they feel the rules do not apply to them.

+1

 

[kongmen]

I loved the mix, wealth and poverty thrown together. Complexity and variety is my spice. Conformity is social death. I am fine with billybobs and old cars as well. An HOA in an income restricted color coordinated suburb is my perfect hell.[/QUOTE]


Absolutely love this!! ^^ in fact I'm going to add this to my personal file of admired saying/concepts

 

[Aerides]

I could only laugh at a recent newpaper story in Kona. An elderly woman who owned a condo that she legally rented to long term rentals had written into her lease agreement that the tenants were required to feed the feral cats. Now, I can understand why this could be a problem.

Hah, that's gonna be me one day. My feral's are 100% the reason I've not moved. If I won the lottery, then I'd move, but I'd only rent to folks who agreed to feed the cats, and I'd check up on them! (they are all over 10, and spayed/neutered, so I'll move either way, one day).

 

[googily]

Reading this thread with interest, because I just bought a second home in an HOA. But my primary home for 25 years is in a historic district, and it has plenty of rules about what can or can't be done to the front exterior of the townhouses that are all more than 100 years old, even down to the allowed types of doors (five panel yes, six panel no) and windows.

The backyards are private though, and lots of houses use them as a dumping grounds. The rats love that.

The HOA the new place is in seems at first glance very well run. Budget reports are sent monthly, etc. And I'm actually in two HOAs, the main one for the entire development and a second one for the group of homes where I am. The mini HOA is responsible for lawn care, snow and trash removal, and even the roofs, siding, and gutters of the semi detached homes, so it's as much a condo setup as anything. Some of the patio homes are in a rental program run by the development, but Air BnBs in this little section I think aren't allowed.

There are pretty strict rules about parking of vehicles, etc. I was given a copy of the bylaws and covenants when my offer on the place was accepted.

I know they are currently working through a lawsuit against someone in another part of the development who built a house too high.

What I don't get is people who move into an HOA who don't like anyone telling them what to do with their home. But then again, I'm pretty good at following rules.

The annual meeting of the sub HOA is next week, so I'll get my first chance to meet neighbors and hear what people are complaining about.

 

[d2reid]

Unfortunately the HOA has become a small dictatorship. Any thoughts?

I'm in the no to HOA group. While I am sure there are many that are well run, when you get one that has busy bodies on the board it gets to be a pain. If you are in the "club" you are left alone, if not, they hunt for stuff to nit pick at.

I truly get annoyed with entities telling me how to live.

 

[pb4uski]

... I truly get annoyed with entities telling me how to live.

Well that's the good thing about associations, if you do your homework then you know what the rules are before you buy and if you aren't willing to follow the rules then just don't buy there.

 

[W2R]

Well that's the good thing about associations, if you do your homework then you know what the rules are before you buy and if you aren't willing to follow the rules then just don't buy there.

Right! Don't buy there. Instead, just do your homework and find a very stable non-HOA neighborhood like ours, with like minded, considerate, congenial, long term residents, that has been well kept up for decades and decades. Then forget you ever heard of HOA's.

We've lived in such a neighborhood for years, and by now we can't even imagine having to deal with the terrible issues that people in this thread feel are so very commonly encountered. Maybe some day we'll learn the hard way, but so far our neighborhood has remained the same since the houses here were first built 57 years ago. At our age, all we need is another 10 years, or less if we decide to go for an assisted living facility.

 

[pb4uski]

^^^ But all you need is one jerk a$$hat to buy in your neighborhood and go against the grain and do bad things... as long as what they do are not illegal then there isn't much that you can do... see marco's post earlier in this thread.

 

[kongmen]

^^^ But all you need is one jerk a$$hat to buy in your neighborhood and go against the grain and do bad things... as long as what they do are not illegal then there isn't much that you can do... see marco's post earlier in this thread.

I find it difficult to look to HOA'S as the solution to this fear and yes I said fear because fear makes people do irrational things like give total strangers the power to dictate to them what they can and can't do in their own home environment.

 

[marko]

FWIW, you don't have to be in an HOA to be "told what you can or can't do".

Here in New England, there's lots of towns with "historic districts". Before you buy, you must agree to maintain the house a certain way. One town near me will not let you even plant flowers on your property that were not available in the 1800s.

But, like an HOA, you know the rules going in.

 

[Aerides]

^

I often wonder what the "my freedom! No hoa!" crowd wants to do, that a most counties country or city would also let them do, which would also then not be a stick-in-the-eye to their neighbors.

Paint your house a (by all reasonable accounts) alarming color
Keep 3 to 7 cars in various states of disrepair jacked up in your driveway
Let your lawn turn to dust or yard-high weeds
Put up a 10 foot chain fence all around
Turn your home into a weekend party rental

I know these are extremes, but I think the fear of HOAs in a SFH area are more based on myth than fact. It's almost entirely about maintaining property values and not being "that guy" to your neighbors.

 

[yhoomajor]

I find it difficult to look to HOA'S as the solution to this fear and yes I said fear because fear makes people do irrational things like give total strangers the power to dictate to them what they can and can't do in their own home environment.

Agree. As I can see in my own neighborhood. My house is in HOA. Some take pride in their home ownership. Others don't. Many are rentals. Par for course (in terms of neighborhood). Overall.. not happy with HOA idea. Above average turnover in home owners.. and all the chaos that comes with it.

A Subdivision south of ours (borders my house boundary).. has no HOA. Pretty stable. Low turnover. Don't see people opening car-mechanic shops in their garage. Homes have higher value in that neighborhood, than ours.

I would love a place where people paint their houses in different colors. This cookie cutter layout in Arizona is very mono-tone. People who complain about homes painted in different colors, should visit northern Europe. And see if those people are miserable.

https://www.loveproperty.com/galleries/74994/50-of-the-worlds-most-colourful-homes?page=1

 

[Chuckanut]

Hah, that's gonna be me one day. My feral's are 100% the reason I've not moved. If I won the lottery, then I'd move, but I'd only rent to folks who agreed to feed the cats, and I'd check up on them! (they are all over 10, and spayed/neutered, so I'll move either way, one day).

Speaking of feeding the feral animals, I have a neighbor who does that. She likes to feed whole peanuts to the squirrels. Unfortunately, the rats like the peanuts also. And the squirrels like to shell the peanuts near my front door.
I could like with the peanut shells near my front door. They can add some organic matter to the planter beds as they decompose. But, the rats!!!

 

[Scuba]

I’m guessing the people who object to HOA’s live in areas with no common amenities. Our HOA maintains our golf course, swimming pools, tennis and pickleball courts, gym, Clubhouse, and many acres of common area landscaping and grounds. I can’t imagine how these amenities could be managed without an HOA overseeing it all.

The HOA also plans and holds social activities for the community, as well as maintaining the appearance of the neighborhood by regulating the freedom of homeowners to modify their homes or grounds.

 

[marko]

^

I often wonder what the "my freedom! No hoa!" crowd wants to do, that a most counties country or city would also let them do, which would also then not be a stick-in-the-eye to their neighbors.

Paint your house a (by all reasonable accounts) alarming color
Keep 3 to 7 cars in various states of disrepair jacked up in your driveway
Let your lawn turn to dust or yard-high weeds
Put up a 10 foot chain fence all around
Turn your home into a weekend party rental

I know these are extremes, but I think the fear of HOAs in a SFH area are more based on myth than fact. It's almost entirely about maintaining property values and not being "that guy" to your neighbors.

+1
As noted earlier, we experienced the extremes from our dining room window. After the 4th police raid--five cruisers closing the street for 2 hours, eleven cops, two police dogs, weapons being seized, five led out of the house in handcuffs--we knew it was time to go.

Note, this had been a quiet, ocean front cul-de-sac with million dollar houses occupied by third and fourth generation families. Until.....

Gimmie an HOA any day of the week!

 

[punkinhead]

Any new neighborhood in my town pretty much has to have an HOA to maintain the green space required by the local planning commission. We're lucky to be in an older neighborhood that doesn't have one. The city has general rules against junk cars, out of control lawns, etc and non-HOA neighborhoods can be established with covenants to limit things not covered by the city. Typical covenants could be no trailers in driveways, fence type/height, max shed size, etc. Covenants are enforced by a city Code Enforcement department but they don't go out looking for things - they'll only step in if someone complains. What's nice about this model is the rules can't change over time. I've noticed that people don't tend to call Code Enforcement unless there's an egregious issue. Instead it's live and let live for the most part.

 

[Trailwalker]

I’m guessing the people who object to HOA’s live in areas with no common amenities. Our HOA maintains our golf course, swimming pools, tennis and pickleball courts, gym, Clubhouse, and many acres of common area landscaping and grounds. I can’t imagine how these amenities could be managed without an HOA overseeing it all.

The HOA also plans and holds social activities for the community, as well as maintaining the appearance of the neighborhood by regulating the freedom of homeowners to modify their homes or grounds.

All of those amenities exist in the small municipality that I live near, except that the clubhouse is called a community center. They are managed by the parks department and paid for with taxes. The regulations of the small city don't prevent purple houses, granny's underwear on the clothesline or an rv in the driveway.

I live outside that small city where taxes are lower and my neighbor has a broken down hay bailer or tractor in the field that he usually gets up and running again when he needs it. One or two of his steers sometimes escape into my yard, and I help him get them back inside the electric fence after calling on the phone (he is in his mid-70's). No cease and desist letter necessary.

There's a happy place for everybody. I wouldn't be happy in an HOA, but I don't begrudge folks who are. I hope that the OP finds his happy place. I like having my wife's family close but not too close.

 

[kongmen]

^

I often wonder what the "my freedom! No hoa!" crowd wants to do, that a most counties country or city would also let them do, which would also then not be a stick-in-the-eye to their neighbors.

Paint your house a (by all reasonable accounts) alarming color
Keep 3 to 7 cars in various states of disrepair jacked up in your driveway
Let your lawn turn to dust or yard-high weeds
Put up a 10 foot chain fence all around
Turn your home into a weekend party rental

I know these are extremes, but I think the fear of HOAs in a SFH area are more based on myth than fact. It's almost entirely about maintaining property values and not being "that guy" to your neighbors.

For me It's not so much about doing what I want It's about not voluntarily giving other people the right to get into my business.



Example: my wife and I built a lake house in a Florida community and put many thousands of dollars into mature royal and coconut palms (25 feet tall) around the house alone with succulents/bushes (around the entire house). The HOA representative gave us a visit stating that someone complained that the bushes were not tall enough. We bought larger bushes to appease these commies.

 

[kongmen]

Any new neighborhood in my town pretty much has to have an HOA to maintain the green space required by the local planning commission. We're lucky to be in an older neighborhood that doesn't have one. The city has general rules against junk cars, out of control lawns, etc and non-HOA neighborhoods can be established with covenants to limit things not covered by the city. Typical covenants could be no trailers in driveways, fence type/height, max shed size, etc. Covenants are enforced by a city Code Enforcement department but they don't go out looking for things - they'll only step in if someone complains. What's nice about this model is the rules can't change over time. I've noticed that people don't tend to call Code Enforcement unless there's an egregious issue. Instead it's live and let live for the most part.

This sounds like a better approach.

 

[PatrickA5]

We went to our first HOA meeting this year. It was comical. It appeared it was the "young" vs the "old". Quite entertaining. Some yelling. Some heckling.

Having said that, we LOVE our Restrictive Covenants in our current neighborhood. There are maybe 5 or 10 rules that are easy to follow, but help keep the values up.

Our first house didn't have an HOA and no restrictive covenants. It was fine at first, but over the years it slowly turned into a rental neighborhood. The last 5 or so years we lived there, it really went downhill. Every other house had multiple dead cars in the driveway or street or yard. You were a nobody unless you had a wreck of a boat sitting in the driveway. Mowing was clearly optional. My next door neighbor had 3 cars that didn't run and 2 more that did. He'd always tell me he was going to get rid of a couple, but never did. These were small lots, so you couldn't "hide" anything. I drove through a few days ago and what was once a nice upper middle class neighborhood looks like a slum.

Count me on the side of strong restrictive covenants and a strong HOA that will enforce them.

 

[Markola]

One idea:

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Our HOA is worth it, if only for the fact they Mow our lawn, Trim our trees & shrubs, irrigate everything front and back, apply pest control when needed, and maintain the irrigation system. AND, if our lawn develops dead spots, they replace the sod.

 

[Ian S]

The HOA representative gave us a visit stating that someone complained that the bushes were not tall enough. We bought larger bushes to appease these commies.

Assuming your landscaping plans were approved by the HOA, I don't understand how they can make you change them at your expense. If the HOA erred in approving them, changing the bushes should be on the HOA's dime.

 

[kongmen]

Assuming your landscaping plans were approved by the HOA, I don't understand how they can make you change them at your expense. If the HOA erred in approving them, changing the bushes should be on the HOA's dime.

We submitted everything they wanted including an illustration showing placement of all required landscaping and additional landscaping that we wanted. I'm sure there was an obscure hight requirement buried somewhere in the documentation...it's been a while. Petty nonsense!

 

[kongmen]

Nice!