My God, Your God, or No God...Oh, God...

[wabmester]

Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to everyone according to what he has done.

How could I forget the ultimate prize? OK, I need to amend the rules of my new religion:

1) This is the one true religion. All others are bogus.

2) Spread the word about (1).

3) If you don't believe me, fine. Burn in hell for all eternity.

4) But if you do as I say, you get to dance the polka for all eternity. With supermodels!

 

[Nords]

Yeah and I seem to recall a guy named Adolph something or other who was pretty confident also. JG

Whoops, there we go. 12 pages and the Nazis have come up.

This thread has officially sunk from a reasoned debate to a flame war...

 

[wabmester]

Whoops, there we go.  12 pages and the Nazis have come up. 

This thread has officially sunk from a reasoned debate to a flame war...

Itchy trigger finger, Nords? The poster merely suggested that "sticking to your guns" is both an admirable trait and one that can lead to fascism. You know, a sword that cuts both ways?

Hardly a reason to shut down discussion.

 

[SLC Tortfeasor]

Zipper, I agree with you.  I would seriously consider moving to Canada, because it seems that huge swaths of the USA are now dominated by very scary people.  (I could get a lot more detailed in describing exactly what I mean by "scary," but I don't want to offend people here.)  Do you happen to know how hard it is for professionals to emigrate from the USA to Canada?

The USA is a hegemon in decline.  It's like the fall of the Roman empire--as a nation we've become fat, decadent, ignorant, arrogant, and jingoistic.  Too many of us feel America is entitled to economic prosperity and geopolitical power, simply by virtue of the fact that it's America, divinely-inpired, and therefore inherently the greatest country on Earth!

Oh man.  It'll be hard for me to run for political office if this post gets traced back to me one day.

 

[moghopper]

Hardly a reason to shut down discussion.

I'm sorry, but it is in clear violation of Godwin's law.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

 

[greg]

I'm sorry, but it is in clear violation of Godwin's law.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

We could just change the name of the thread to "Nazis, Hitler, God, no God, Politics, Science, La La Land and other nasty things." That should leave no room for complaint--maybe.

We could approach an infinity of 1s. I like this thread most of all. And I'm thinking of a reasonable retort to all the dang atheists and agnostics out there in lala land.

--Greg

 

[sgeeeee]

I'm sorry, but it is in clear violation of Godwin's law.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin's_law

The problem with Godwin's law is that it automatically outlaws discussion of Nazi behavior. Doesn't that play into the hands of the Nazis?

What we need is a code phrase. A phrase that means Nazi to us but doesn't invoke the Godwin's law requirement to shut down the link. I suggest we use, "dryer sheet kayaker" in the place of "Nazi".

 

[REWahoo]

--as a nation we've become fat, decadent, ignorant, arrogant, and jingoistic. Too many of us feel America is entitled to economic prosperity and geopolitical power, simply by virtue of the fact that it's America, divinely-inpired, and therefore inherently the greatest country on Earth!

So, you got a problem with that? Just kidding.

I'm the optimistic type who thinks this current pendulum swing to the right is only temporary and will correct itself. Unfortunately, it will probably swing past any reasonable mid-point and not stop until we find ourselves far to the left at some point in the future. Then we will realize we've gone too far and start back the other way. We seem to be a country always in search of what we really want to be when we grow up, never finding a comfortable place somewhere in the middle ground. But at least we keep swingin'...

REW

(And if you don't agree with me, you're nothing but a dryer sheet kyakin' son of a gun.)

 

[brewer12345]

Zipper, I agree with you.  I would seriously consider moving to Canada, because it seems that huge swaths of the USA are now dominated by very scary people.  (I could get a lot more detailed in describing exactly what I mean by "scary," but I don't want to offend people here.)  Do you happen to know how hard it is for professionals to emigrate from the USA to Canada?

Poke around the Canadian gummint website. They have a screening test that boils down to a screen for:

- adults under 50
- fluency in English and/or French
- in reasonable health
- advanced degree
- at least 10 (?) years of work experience

If you meet all of the above, you'd have to substantiate all of this, jump through a few hoops and then find an employer in Canada. I think it is a lot easier than trying to enter the US legally.

 

[Danny]

Don't know why I threw in the smiley face because I wasn't kidding.
I have all kinds of issues with both of these guys, but that truly (courage of your convictions) is a trait
I admire, even when I disagree.
JG

Mr. G - Here's another issue you can have with him.

Evangelist Robertson Says Chavez Comments Were Misinterpreted

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000086&sid=aSW6_pgFqoyM&refer=latin_america

Couple hours later - WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Conservative U.S. evangelist Pat Robertson apologized on Wednesday for calling for the assassination of Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, saying he spoke in frustration earlier in the week.

"Is it right to call for assassination? No, and I apologize for that statement. I spoke in frustration that we should accommodate the man who thinks the U.S. is out to kill him."

The leftist Chavez, one of President George W. Bush's harshest critics, has often accused the United States of plotting his overthrow or assassination. U.S. officials said this week the idea of hostile action against him was "without fact and baseless."

Robertson, the founder of the Christian Coalition and a leader of the Christian right that has provided strong support for Bush, said on Monday of Chavez's fears: "If he thinks we're trying to assassinate him, I think that we really ought to go ahead and do it."

"We have the ability to take him out, and I think the time has come that we exercise that ability," he said on his "The 700 Club" television program.

His earlier remarks, said the leader of the world's fifth largest oil exporter was a "terrific danger" to the United States and Chavez intended to become "the launching pad for communist infiltration and Muslim extremism."

Robertson said that while he was criticized by U.S. political and religious leaders, he found the attention he wanted for what he said was "a growing problem which has largely been ignored." Earlier in the day he said his remarks had been misinterpreted and "take him out" could refer to kidnapping.

VENEZUELA SEEKS LEGAL ACTION

Venezuela has had strained relations with the United States since accusing Washington of backing a failed 2002 coup against Chavez. Washington has denied involvement. The Venezuelan foreign ministry said it was not satisfied with U.S. officials' dismissal of Robertson's remarks and wanted the White House to take legal action.

"This public call to assassinate a head of state, considered a crime by all modern legislation, is prosecutable by its very nature. That is what the civilized world is expecting of U.S. authorities," the Venezuelan government said on Wednesday.

 

[Danny]

Poke around the Canadian gummint website. They have a screening test that boils down to a screen for:

- adults under 50
- fluency in English and/or French
- in reasonable health
- advanced degree
- at least 10 (?) years of work experience

If you meet all of the above, you'd have to substantiate all of this, jump through a few hoops and then find an employer in Canada. I think it is a lot easier than trying to enter the US legally.

After the 2004 election wife and I took the points test and we came up short - too old. We're thinking that when the draft is reinstated the kids could get accepted for citizenship and then they can sponsor us...

 

[Nords]

I'm sorry, but it is in clear violation of Godwin's law.

Thanks, Mog, I was looking for that.

I guess it's not funny if it's too subtle...

 

[HFWR]

The problem with Godwin's law is that it automatically outlaws discussion of Nazi behavior.  Doesn't that play into the hands of the Nazis?   

What we need is a code phrase.  A phrase that means Nazi to us but doesn't invoke the Godwin's law requirement to shut down the link.  I suggest we use, "dryer sheet kayaker" in the place of "Nazi".   

Or, in the immortal words of Frank Zappa: "a bitch, a whore, a slut, a Republican..." 8)

 

[Danny]

Or, in the immortal words of Frank Zappa:..."

Leave Frank out of this...also there is nothing immortal about Frank...his lyrics are almost as dead as he is... ...and don't start quoting me My Love* is a Harley, you kick it to start...see what I mean about dead?

* My version

 

[rapoole]

"the immortal words of Frank Zappa"

Wow, this thread is really starting to show promise! Quotations of Frank Zappa always enhance the poster's stature in my booK!

rapoole

 

[bpp]

I guess it's not funny if it's too subtle...

Don't feel bad, Nords. It's always September somewhere on the net.

Bpp

 

[sgeeeee]

http://www.davemcnally.com/Lyrics/FrankZappa/

 

[Danny]

http://www.celebritypicturesarchive.com/pictures/f/frank-zappa/frank-zappa-003.jpg

http://imagecache2.allposters.com/images/pic/2/Posters/PR3058.JPG

 

[Michael]

OK, I need to amend the rules...

You should also help them a bit down here:

Is any one of you sick? He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective. James 5:14-16 NIV

 

[sgeeeee]

May a goat poop in your kayak.

 

[wabmester]

Is any one of you sick? He should call the elders of the church to pray over him and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer offered in faith will make the sick person well; the Lord will raise him up. If he has sinned, he will be forgiven. Therefore confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The prayer of a righteous man is powerful and effective.  James 5:14-16 NIV

Michael, just tell me to shut-up if this is too personal. You seem like a rational guy. I can understand a rational person seeking answers to the unknown, seeking a moral foundation, and even seeking purpose in life. But the healing stuff and miracles? I just can't reconcile that with rationality. I know you're a believer in modern medicine (such as it is), so obviously you don't take the bible so literally that you choose prayer over medicine. Are you just trying to save our souls, or do you really believe all of the dogma?

Is there anything that would shake your faith? For me, it would basically take a burning bush giving me a stern lecture before I even considered religion. But if I were religious, I think I would have a very hard time reconciling my experience with my faith.

 

[haha]

I have been away from this thread. Too bad! It's the funniest thing I've read since I came here over 2 years ago.

I have an observation to make. All the practical threads are very interesting when you have a question in mind. Newbies have many questions, so they love the nuts and bolts threads. Later questions arise on occasion, and it is wonderful to have the help of so many intelligent people in working out an answer.

For some who have broad knowledge there is satisfaction in helping others answer their questions.

For the rest of us barnyard fowl, thank God for threads like this. 

Haha

 

[Michael]

But the healing stuff and miracles?

I've seen enough to convice me they are real. You do have to spend time with true believers to see them though.

But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord;
James 1:6-7 NIV

 

[azanon]

You do have to spend time with true believers to see them though.

I was a christain for 20 years until through advanced education was I able to rid myself of my child-reared brainwashing (I grew up in the deep south, my family almost saturated with God-fearing southern baptists).

You tell me anything God has done for a "true believer" and i'll match and beat that with something i've done for myself.  When i actually even need your God, i'll let you know.  But i wouldn't go holding my breathe, cause i'm doing pretty damn well for myself under my own strength.

I chuckle at the level of arrogance that much be required to think God is doing things for you or anyone else; to think that puts you in a position of greater power.   Trust me, real power comes from making decisions yourself and not having predefined, arbitrary limits to what you can and cannot do. 

I remember the day I admitted to my wife i effectively committed/am committing apostasy.   I recall that made her both sad, and scared/nervous.    That latter feeling of hers was probably not all that misplaced.   I would be a little nervous too of knowing i'm now living with someone who now no longer has any predefined rules; apart from the law, of course.    That kind of power is enough to make anyone tremble.

This actually makes me think of Star Wars and lucas' viewpoints towards good and evil and pros and cons of it.  I personally dont think Lucas is/was entirely fair to the "dark side" suggesting the cons far outweight the pros.  I think its a much tougher choice to make, and in many ways, the arbitrary dark side is a particulariy compelling approach for a way to live one's life.

Althought i am an agnostic personally, i love this guy's website (he's an atheist).  He was also a former christain;  http://home.earthlink.net/~jehdjh/Relpg.html

 

[greg]

You tell me anything God has done for a "true believer" and i'll match and beat that with something i've done for myself. When i actually even need your God, i'll let you know. But i wouldn't go holding my breathe, cause i'm doing pretty damn well for myself under my own strength.

I chuckle at the level of arrogance that much be required to think God is doing things for you or anyone else; to think that puts you in a position of greater power. Trust me, real power comes from making decisions yourself and not having predefined, arbitrary limits to what you can and cannot do.

OK. God has provided me and everyone with an intelligible world. He provides me with what I need when I need it, even if I don't realize it at the time. As a true believer and a knower that there IS a greater power, he provides a balance for me. When I get lost in my own ego and arrogance and get smacked by someone in the world, I realize I am not as smart as I thought. God provides this service to me--free of charge. Why would I possibly imagine I'm the center of my Universe when such good things lessons come to me on a daily basis?

--Greg