Nanny state rant

Probably more to do with protecting companies from lawsuits.

I do not have one. When I tried to get a new home owners insurance through Geico last year, I was denied and was given that reason. Geico later found me another company, though more expensive.

I eventually may have to upgrade my breaker.

Yes, my thinking is that many such safety upgrades are driven more by the insurance industry than by the "nanny state."
 
Interesting, I wonder why electric fires are more common than gas? I wonder if part of it is that an electric stovetop is usually more conducive to people putting things on top of it that don't belong than a gas? For instance, I remember my grandparents use to have these round metal covers that you'd put on top of the burners. They rarely used the back burners, so they'd usually stay covered. Sometimes they'd have thing put on top of those covers as well. Unfortunately, as Grandmom got older, sometimes she'd go to cook something, but turn on one of the back burners by mistake, and they'd catch on fire. When Granddad was alive, he'd just take the burner cover, sand it off, and spray paint it. And when Grandmom did it again, lather, rinse, repeat.

Well, after Granddad died, I ended up taking the knobs off of the back burners, and boy was Grandmom pissed! When I told her that I was worried she'd burn down the house I remember her just saying "Well it's my own G D house, I'll burn it down if I want!" So, I gave her her knobs back.

And then there's those flat top electrics, where it just looks SOOO inviting to just set your groceries down or whatever on them, and forget about it.

At least with a gas stove, they have those big metal grates on top that just don't look all that inviting, to put something on that doesn't belong. Plus, I guess with a gas stove, when you turn one of the burners on, you actually see the flame, so if you did the wrong one by mistake, you're more likely to notice it.

At least, that's my thoughts on it...could be totally wrong.
 
This is interesting:

"Households that use electric ranges have a higher risk of cooking fires and associated losses than those using gas ranges."

"About 2.5x more fires occur in households with electric ranges compared to gas ranges. There are 1,165 fires per million households with electric ranges compared to 445 fires per million households with gas ranges."

https://www.nfpa.org/News-and-Research/Data-research-and-tools/US-Fire-Problem/Home-Cooking-Fires

That is surprising and counter to what I thought.

I'd be interested to see a study on the ratio of home explosions when comparing electric/heat pumps to gas furnaces.
 
Not to hi-jack this thread, but the house where we live now, has a number of GFCI outlets. They cover the baths, kitchen, and any circuit that includes an outdoor outlet. They have been routinely tripping. I finally figured out that one of the GFCI's includes an outdoor outlet on the other side of the house. When the weather gets warmer, I'll take that outlet apart and see if I can moisture proof it better. I suspect a number of the indoor GFCI's include an outdoor outlet in their circuits. Gues I'll have a lot of sleuthing to do this summer. Sure would be nice if we got a wiring diagram when we bought the house.
 
I mean, it would have to right? I never thought about it, but unlikely a gas dryer would use the low pressure gas to turn the drum lol

Oh.... that's what the black wire is for on our gas dryer. I knew it had a light bulb in there instead of a gas light, so yeah probably also turns the drum ;) :LOL:
 
Not to hi-jack this thread, but the house where we live now, has a number of GFCI outlets. They cover the baths, kitchen, and any circuit that includes an outdoor outlet. They have been routinely tripping. I finally figured out that one of the GFCI's includes an outdoor outlet on the other side of the house. When the weather gets warmer, I'll take that outlet apart and see if I can moisture proof it better. I suspect a number of the indoor GFCI's include an outdoor outlet in their circuits. Gues I'll have a lot of sleuthing to do this summer. Sure would be nice if we got a wiring diagram when we bought the house.

The outside one should have a cover with a foam/rubber gasket on it to seal.
 
This is interesting:

"Households that use electric ranges have a higher risk of cooking fires and associated losses than those using gas ranges."

"About 2.5x more fires occur in households with electric ranges compared to gas ranges. There are 1,165 fires per million households with electric ranges compared to 445 fires per million households with gas ranges."

https://www.nfpa.org/News-and-Research/Data-research-and-tools/US-Fire-Problem/Home-Cooking-Fires

This is surprising, although since electric stoves account for 60% of installed ones, that take a small slice of the in-equality.

As previously mentioned, it's likely due to the willingness to put stuff on top of electric stoves. I've had both and notice I very reluctantly put stuff on my gas stove.

Another reason I think, is with gas I remain in the house while cooking, maybe because fire is an instinctive danger ?. With electric I'm very happy to put a pot on low and leave the house for hours, after all it's safe :facepalm:
I won't do that with gas as what if a breeze blows out the very low flame :eek:
 
When we talk electric stoves vs gas stoves are we talking electric stoves traditional coils, the glass top with the infrared device underneath, or induction stoves that use magnetic energy? It makes a difference.
 
When we talk electric stoves vs gas stoves are we talking electric stoves traditional coils, the glass top with the infrared device underneath, or induction stoves that use magnetic energy? It makes a difference.

The infrared ones with a glass top, aren't they just a thin wire coil, very much like the very old wire coil electric stoves before coil stoves switched to the durable thick coils ?

But they are all electric, and different in how friendly they are to piling groceries, towels on top of.
 
This is interesting:

"Households that use electric ranges have a higher risk of cooking fires and associated losses than those using gas ranges."

"About 2.5x more fires occur in households with electric ranges compared to gas ranges. There are 1,165 fires per million households with electric ranges compared to 445 fires per million households with gas ranges."

https://www.nfpa.org/News-and-Research/Data-research-and-tools/US-Fire-Problem/Home-Cooking-Fires

My wife sometimes forgets to turn off the burner and leaves a pot on the stove. The last time was when she was boiling eggs. She left to play tennis and when I came home the house was filled with smoke, there were eggs splattered everywhere, and the house smelled of rotten eggs for a few days. :sick: I didn't say anything. :angel:

Cheers!
 
My wife sometimes forgets to turn off the burner and leaves a pot on the stove. The last time was when she was boiling eggs. She left to play tennis and when I came home the house was filled with smoke, there were eggs splattered everywhere, and the house smelled of rotten eggs for a few days. :sick: I didn't say anything. :angel:

Cheers!

My mom did this while reading an unusually thick newspaper, which was her timing method for cooking supper :facepalm:

It was an aluminum pot, so it melted on the electric stove. No smoke detectors and the kitchen window was open, so it was not noticed at first.

Amazing how the smell stayed in the house for days :popcorn:
 
Then there's this infamous image of electrical safety:
 

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This thread reminds me of when I had a corporate move from CA to TX back in 1998. Megacorp gave me 10% of salary for incidentals (utilities hookups, relocation hotels, meals, etc.). I was always pleasant with my relocation agent and she told me one day to make sure I submit my hotel/meals and temporary housing for reimbursement. I pointed out that I thought the 10% bonus was to cover that stuff. She indicated "Yes, that was true, but she had some latitude". In the end, the only expense I had for my entire move out of my 10% bonus was a $35 charge to switch my dryer for a 3 to 4 prong, by the washer/dryer installer. I was mad for 30 seconds when he indicated that Megacorp didn't cover the new plug until I came to my senses.:facepalm:
 
This thread reminds me of when I had a corporate move from CA to TX back in 1998. Megacorp gave me 10% of salary for incidentals (utilities hookups, relocation hotels, meals, etc.). I was always pleasant with my relocation agent and she told me one day to make sure I submit my hotel/meals and temporary housing for reimbursement. I pointed out that I thought the 10% bonus was to cover that stuff. She indicated "Yes, that was true, but she had some latitude". In the end, the only expense I had for my entire move out of my 10% bonus was a $35 charge to switch my dryer for a 3 to 4 prong, by the washer/dryer installer. I was mad for 30 seconds when he indicated that Megacorp didn't cover the new plug until I came to my senses.:facepalm:

And he probably didn't do it right. The old 3 prong had the 2 power leads and the ground/neutral attached to the three studs on the back of the stove. The neutral and the frame ground have a small metal strap connecting the two. When one converts to a 4 prong, the small metal strap should be severed and the "extra" 4th wire gets attached to the frame. Three different times, I have seen that strap still intact, negating the intent of having a separate wire for the neutral, and frame ground. (Even though their still connected at the neutral/ground buss bar in the breaker box.
 
This research was supported in part by internal funds of RMI...


From their webpage,

"Our Work

We identify the interventions and work to scale transformative change in the global energy system to cut greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions by at least 50% by 2030."


https://rmi.org/

Well, it's good to know that at least they are a neutral observer and have no biases against FFs.
 
This is interesting:

"Households that use electric ranges have a higher risk of cooking fires and associated losses than those using gas ranges."

"About 2.5x more fires occur in households with electric ranges compared to gas ranges. There are 1,165 fires per million households with electric ranges compared to 445 fires per million households with gas ranges."

https://www.nfpa.org/News-and-Research/Data-research-and-tools/US-Fire-Problem/Home-Cooking-Fires

I'm guessing this is as simple as: Gas stoves have an open (visible) flame while electric stoves may or may not have any obvious indication that they are "on." I've never been burned by a gas stove, but have learned by sad accident not to lean on the electric stove when getting into a cabinet above it. :blush:
 
There is also this one about why you need to be careful there are no electrical cords around when you cut the cheese...

When I was a teenager, I used my handy pocket knife to pry apart the stuck extension cord.
The Bright flash sure made me jump, and melted a notch out of my knife !

Then I unplugged it and pried it apart :LOL:
 
Gas stoves are also a heck of a lot better for cooking with a wok!
 
I've mentioned it before, but switching from gas stoves to electric ones will actually cause the emission of more greenhouse gases, unless and until we have sufficient renewables to carry the full electric load. Why, you ask? Because right now, I use the natural gas flame on my stove to provide X amount of heat to boil my pot of spaghetti. If I switch to an electric stove, that additional electric load will almost certainly be supplied by a natural gas burning electric power plant (here in New England) since the only other alternatives are the nuclear plants, which are generally running at 100% capacity as base load suppliers. Natural gas plants are no more than about 30% efficient. There are also line losses of about 6-7% in transmitting electricity from the plant to my house. Which means that the power plant will need to burn roughly three to four times the amount of natural gas to generate electricity, transmit it to my house and provide X amount of heat to my spaghetti pot than would be burned if I simply use my gas stove. Three times as much natural gas burned equals three times as much greenhouse gas emissions. It actually makes the problem worse.
 
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I'm guessing this is as simple as: Gas stoves have an open (visible) flame while electric stoves may or may not have any obvious indication that they are "on." I've never been burned by a gas stove, but have learned by sad accident not to lean on the electric stove when getting into a cabinet above it. :blush:



With an induction stove, the pot gets hot. The “burner” is only heated by the pot. It heats faster than a gas stove as well. Our induction stove has a little light indicating that the burner is hot. And no open flame so much less fire risk.
 
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