Reliance on Cell Phones

[Koolau]

It seems like everyone is commenting about how they like their phone and all the stuff they can do with it. That is missing the point. The original comment was less about what 'can' be done with the phone versus what 'cannot' be done without a phone.

A product should be able to work perfectly fine without a phone. I agree that it might be made to work better with a phone, but it should still work without it.

Why did the original user's "Mr Cool mini-split system" REQUIRE a phone to be setup?

Why does any product REQUIRE a phone to be setup? Especially if it is a product that has already existed for years or decades without the need of a phone.

When a company is using the 'phone' interface to replace instead of supplement the normal interface, then they are just being lazy or cheap to save themselves development or production costs.

Well stated IMHO.

 

[Qs Laptop]

i am in italy and greece this week and the entire european population is grafted to their phones. They are like one armed people. We were on a train today, and a millinium never got off facetime in the entire 2 hours. Very annoying in public.

Wot's the big deal?

 

[explanade]

It seems like everyone is commenting about how they like their phone and all the stuff they can do with it. That is missing the point. The original comment was less about what 'can' be done with the phone versus what 'cannot' be done without a phone.

A product should be able to work perfectly fine without a phone. I agree that it might be made to work better with a phone, but it should still work without it.

Why did the original user's "Mr Cool mini-split system" REQUIRE a phone to be setup?

Why does any product REQUIRE a phone to be setup? Especially if it is a product that has already existed for years or decades without the need of a phone.

When a company is using the 'phone' interface to replace instead of supplement the normal interface, then they are just being lazy or cheap to save themselves development or production costs.

Why did the OP select products which REQUIRE a phone app?

My guess is most home appliances will function WITHOUT a phone app but offers one for those who want to use an app.

There is a certain advantage. Do you want to juggle multiple controls for your speakers, mini-split AC, etc? Or do you want to be able to do it all in your phone so you don't have to keep track of all these dedicated remote controls?

The incentive for some companies is to have to register with an email so that they can spam you with ads for other products and possibly track your usage patterns.

But there should be appliances in every category which are NOT smart, that is can be operated without a phone app.

 

[explanade]

I am in Italy and Greece this week and the entire European population is grafted to their phones. They are like one armed people. We were on a train today, and a millinium never got off FaceTime in the entire 2 hours. Very annoying in public.

That reminds me, one trip I was in Switzerland, I used the excellent SBB app, which not only gave you schedules of trains, buses and ferries in real time, let you purchase tickets right in the app.

So it let me make some impromptu decisions on what to see at a given time.

Because if I could hop on a train or a boat that was departing soon, I chose to do that rather than wait longer for a train to a different destination.


I haven't looked at the TrenItalia app in awhile. I don't think it's as good for buying tickets, if it even does it.

The French SNCF app let you buy tickets but you had to store a credit card with an account rather than use Apple Pay which I already have in my iPhone. Plus you had to book way in advance to get better fares so it wasn't as good for real-time train rides.

 

[Walt34]

1 in 7! I thought I was the only person in the country that does not own a cell phone (smart or not)!

Well, now you know there are at least two of us. I did have an older TracFone but it broke and at this point I'm probably not going to replace it. I actually used it maybe once every two or three months and that was to call DW from the grocery store because she's prone to write something on the grocery list but doesn't say how many.

And I'm certainly not going to spend $300+ and then $10+ monthly on something I don't need and rarely use anyway. And there's a conundrum I don't see a solution to; I want a big screen so I can read it but I don't want to carry around a huge lump that is literally a PITA to sit on. So maybe when they come out with folding screens that really actually work I'll think about it.

 

[Sunset]

Sounds like an old phone, most new ones stopped supporting SD cards or removable storage a few years ago.

Maybe just Apple phones ?

Thankfully, the motorola Android phones still offer SD cards: "up to 1TB with microSD card" along with the internal 256GB.

1 TB ought to hold my vacation photos nicely

 

[jollystomper]

Sounds like an old phone, most new ones stopped supporting SD cards or removable storage a few years ago.

Not true, we upgraded our cell phones last year. Perhaps that is true of Apple phones (which we do not use), but not of Android phones.

 

[aja8888]

1 TB ought to hold my vacation photos nicely

OK you asked....


One terabyte gives you the option of storing roughly: 250,000 photos taken with a 12MP camera; 250 movies or 500 hours of HD video; or. 6.5 million document pages, commonly stored as Office files, PDFs, and presentations.

(I believe you can either store the above, or run General Motor's accounting system on the card.)

 

[finnski1]

I love the ability to change settings on my thermostat using my phone.

3 years ago. Honey it's really cold and I can't sleep. Please go downstairs and change the thermostat. Honey, pull the blanket up from the foot of the bed

2 years ago. Honey too cold. Grab phone on night table and change temp. Honey pull the blanket up from the foot of the bed

1 year ago. Honey too cold. I say hey Google, increase temp by 2 degrees. Honey , pull the blanket up from the foot of the bed.

Today. No need to tell honey too cold. She talks to Google herself. She finally pulls the blanket up by herself.

[emoji16]

or as above.

 

[Katsmeow]

It seems like everyone is commenting about how they like their phone and all the stuff they can do with it. That is missing the point. The original comment was less about what 'can' be done with the phone versus what 'cannot' be done without a phone.

A product should be able to work perfectly fine without a phone. I agree that it might be made to work better with a phone, but it should still work without it.

In general, I think it is fine if a product can be used without a phone but you get added functionality with a phone.

And I confess that it is nice that I can control a lot of different devices using one phone rather than having to have a separate remote for each item.

But I take issue with saying the product "should" be able to work fine without a phone. Isn't that up to the manufacturer? I do think they should disclose very clearly that the product requires a phone of X type to function. But, if the manufacturer is willing to give up business from those people who don't have that kind of phone, isn't that their choice? If I don't have that phone, then I won't buy that product. I mean there are people who write apps that only work on iOS and not Android or vice versa. There was an iOS app I used that had no desktop computer functionality at all. I hated it as it required a lot of typing and I wanted to do that on my computer. So I quit using the app. I wanted them to have browser access on the computer but that was there choice.

 

[mpeirce]

Maybe just Apple phones ?

Apple iPhones have never supported internal SD cards. You can get a "Lightning to USB Camera Adapter” to read photos from a camera, it's not for general storage.

 

[mpeirce]

Going way back is not only no fun for the programmer, but takes an inordinate amount of time and effort

Today, for example, Apple kicked off its developer conference. They announced that the upcoming watchOS 9 will no longer support the Watch Series 3.

There was much rejoicing (literally) from watch developers. The older watch was missing a number of features of current phones, has more limited memory and slower processor speed. It’s been a pain to support it.

Of course it’s sad for people who own a Series 3 watch...

 

[homestead]

Why did the original user's "Mr Cool mini-split system" REQUIRE a phone to be setup?

Why does any product REQUIRE a phone to be setup? Especially if it is a product that has already existed for years or decades without the need of a phone.

I have a couple Mr Cool mini-split systems. A phone is not required if you want to just use the supplied remote control to control the systems. If you want to be able to control the units via your phone or computer from anywhere on the internet then you need a phone/computer to set it up and use it.
Wi-Fi is also required for phone/computer control.
I use both the remote and my phone to control the units, they work great!

 

[JoeWras]

My recently replaced HVAC comes with an Ecobee thermostat.

You can run as much or little with a phone. It is fully functional without Wifi, completely disconnected if you want. You can also do initial configuration without a phone or WiFi, although they discourage that.

It's ultimately your choice. I like that.

 

[sengsational]

I bought a Viseo TV and although it's possible to use it without giving it WiFi and using their phone app, they make it pretty painful. Let me explain. Every so often the TV decides to switch inputs to the one that requires WiFi. There's nothing you can do but wait for the minute or two until it times-out. The remote they provide has on/off, volume (don't use because the TV is being used as a monitor only), and input select.

On the subject of controlling household items, I have a 1995 laptop with some X-10 PC software which was probably written in the 1980's. So for timer function, that, paired with the X-10 console, which gets the program over RS-232, solves that automation. There are X-10 battery operated remote controls, but I don't really need that. None of this requires data leaving my house. I probably could rig-up an app that connected to a local machine on my WiFi to manage X-10 if I wanted to. The point is, unless you want to control something from your phone when you are on cell data, you could have a local controller running and that would not need to have any open ports to the Internet. I have a BP meter that has a Bluetooth connection and I've prohibited the app from data access and it still works, but my bathroom scale, nope...the quickest way from the scale to the phone is through The Netherlands, apparently, LOL!

I've written a few mobile
apps over the years (one of the first iPhone apps even) and it’s very rare that new apps reach back more than a bare minimum amount of OS releases.

Newer OSes have new APIs that either allow new functionality or make it much easier to build parts of an app. Going way back is not only no fun for the programmer, but takes an inordinate amount of time and effort - often you have to duplicate functionality that comes for free in the newer OS.

It’s just not cost effective to do so. Yes, you lose a few customers, but not many.

I've written and maintained apps on the Apple and Android stores and I agree that it's a pain to support old hardware, but the reason it's a pain is because they keep changing the requirements. The Apple example: Only apps built with the latest IDE are allowed on the store. The latest IDE only runs on new OS. New OS won't run on older, but perfectly functional hardware >> new development machine must be purchased. Android isn't as bad with development machines, but they keep knotching up the oldest OS version they support on the store; you can require newer, but can't go below their minimum.

If both people in the conversation have HD voice quality it is stunningly good. Sounds like you are in the same room but with no background noise. Sounds so good it sounds fake.

It's the lag, which depends on your latency, that's the problem. Back in the wired phone days, you could talk much more naturally on the phone. Nowadays, I find myself needing to fall back on my radio conversation technique... saying "over", when I'm done with a thought.

 

[sengsational]

No More Sam's Card?

DW just walked in after going to Sam's Club. She lost her card, and went to the desk to get a replacement card after loosing hers. Nope. No cards are being issued. You MUST have a phone with their app running to shop there. What?

 

[REWahoo]

DW just walked in after going to Sam's Club. She lost her card, and went to the desk to get a replacement card after loosing hers. Nope. No cards are being issued. You MUST have a phone with their app running to shop there. What?

The anti-Luddite movement is gaining ground.

 

[Koolau]

I bought a Viseo TV and although it's possible to use it without giving it WiFi and using their phone app, they make it pretty painful. Let me explain. Every so often the TV decides to switch inputs to the one that requires WiFi. There's nothing you can do but wait for the minute or two until it times-out. The remote they provide has on/off, volume (don't use because the TV is being used as a monitor only), and input select.

I wonder why they offer WiFi control and then make it inconvenient to use the system without WiFi? Could it just be that they wish to monitor your viewing habits in order to sell you stuff - maybe piggyback off commercials that are already on TV or more likely market products to you that fit with your viewing. I watch PBS Motor Week. I could imagine that info could be used to market cars or car products to me.

Now, invoking my tag line, the sky is the limit on how such info could be (at best) commercialized (selling to other companies, for instance) or even worse - I'll let you speculate as there isn't a conspiratorial bone in my body.

 

[ERObjd]

though it is getting better there are still many web pages that are not very friendly for a small cell phone screen, though they work fine on a large PC screen. Getting better but very slowly. For that reason i never do banking on my cell, other than maybe check a balance.

 

[ERObjd]

that sounds like a good way to alienate the customer base. Not every one with a cell is interested in having an app. Sam's already keeps a record of everything one buys linked to the membership #. At what point does this big brother overwatch become so repulsive that people do not renew their membership? Sams is about to find out

 

[sengsational]

I wonder why they offer WiFi control and then make it inconvenient to use the system without WiFi? Could it just be that they wish to monitor your viewing habits in order to sell you stuff - maybe piggyback off commercials that are already on TV or more likely market products to you that fit with your viewing. I watch PBS Motor Week. I could imagine that info could be used to market cars or car products to me.

Now, invoking my tag line, the sky is the limit on how such info could be (at best) commercialized (selling to other companies, for instance) or even worse - I'll let you speculate as there isn't a conspiratorial bone in my body.

They have tech that matches a pixel fingerprint, so they know what you watch, even if it's coming in on an HDMI input. So yes, they want to snoop on you. The other thing is they have various over the internet streaming options, and I'm pretty sure they make a bunch of money on that. It's the old "give the shaver away and make it up on the blades" model.

 

[Koolau]

that sounds like a good way to alienate the customer base. Not every one with a cell is interested in having an app. Sam's already keeps a record of everything one buys linked to the membership #. At what point does this big brother overwatch become so repulsive that people do not renew their membership? Sams is about to find out

After 30 years as a member, I don't see any abuse of the data (targeted adds, etc.) but marketers are getting sneakier all the time so who knows. I'd feel less upset if Sam's (or Costco) used the data themselves than if they sold it. That would potentially be the end for me. YMMV

 

[ls99]

DW just walked in after going to Sam's Club. She lost her card, and went to the desk to get a replacement card after loosing hers. Nope. No cards are being issued. You MUST have a phone with their app running to shop there. What?

I had considered re joining. Now, I will not. My over 14 yo flip phone would not handle the graphics. It does not really worth my while to drive 70 miles round trip to shop there. They can stuff their app.

 

[mpeirce]

that sounds like a good way to alienate the customer base.

Not all customers are created equal.

Many businesses make more money by getting rid of, ahem, low profit customers.

 

[Koolau]

I had considered re joining. Now, I will not. My over 14 yo flip phone would not handle the graphics. It does not really worth my while to drive 70 miles round trip to shop there. They can stuff their app.

Anyone know if they are infecting the phone app on old members that still have their cards. That would end our relationship. Stuff it would be kind verbiage if I were speaking with them. YMMV