Another Lopsided Poll: AIG bonuses.

[Dog]

Goverment screwed up and didn't include language disallowing bonus payments for the corporations taking bail out $. Also, the bonus is contractual and was public knowledge before the bailout. Of course the politicians and media are leveraging this to demonstrate the evils of big business & capitalism.

 

[Notmuchlonger]

Goverment screwed up and didn't include language disallowing bonus payments for the corporations taking bail out $. Also, the bonus is contractual and was public knowledge before the bailout. Of course the politicians and media are leveraging this to demonstrate the evils of big business & capitalism.

Yep. I blame myself for help voting some of these guys into office. After all the people voted them in.

 

[jug]

Goverment screwed up and didn't include language disallowing bonus payments for the corporations taking bail out $. Also, the bonus is contractual and was public knowledge before the bailout. Of course the politicians and media are leveraging this to demonstrate the evils of big business & capitalism.

Actually, if one look at what is true, those at the helm of these failures for the past 10 set this disaster in motion but yet collected hundreds of millions, or billions in compensation.

Those are the culprits. Problem is,, they are entangled with Washington. If we were to take their compensation away, then the question of bonuses would be moot. Perhaps we should start with Paulson, who built up a fortune at the helm of Goldman S.

jug

 

[Running_Man]

And if you think the taking back of these bonuses will be the only contracts to not be honored here is the first court to allow a government to void a pension:
In a first, bankruptcy judge rules Calif. city can void union contracts

 

[ls99]

Seems the one to thank for the AIG bonuses is Sen. Chris Dodd.

As I said in an earlier post, there was not enough media info available at the time. Now there is.

From a Fox news article:

To Recover AIG Bonuses, Lawmakers Scramble to Undo Protections They Approved - Presidential Politics | Political News - FOXNews.com

Though Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., is among those leading the charge on retrieving the bonuses, an amendment he added to the $787 billion stimulus bill last month created a roadblock to getting that money back.
The amendment, meant to restrict executive pay for bailed-out banks, also included an exception for "contractually obligated bonuses agreed on before Feb. 11, 2009."
This would seem to exempt the AIG bonuses that lawmakers and President Obama are looking to recover. Incidentally, Dodd is the largest single recipient of 2008 campaign donations from AIG, with $103,100, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

 

[HFWR]

Term limits are looking better all the time...

 

[Westernskies]

73 of the bonuses were for $1,000,000+. This seems excessive for a bankrupt company.
These bonuses should have been based on the company's ability to pay them , not the US taxpayers.
Why would you want to reward and retain the folks who ran this train into the ditch?

 

[Notmuchlonger]

73 of the bonuses were for $1,000,000+. This seems excessive for a bankrupt company.
These bonuses should have been based on the company's ability to pay them , not the US taxpayers.
Why would you want to reward and retain the folks who ran this train into the ditch?

Beats me. I also ask why would Congress not have stipulations on money they were throwing to these companies. Beats me again..

 

[ERD50]

Why would you want to reward and retain the folks who ran this train into the ditch?

But were these the same people that ran it into the ground? That's the info I have not seen yet.

But, the one to ask does seem to be Senator Dobbs. And I wonder why Pres. Obama is not asking him?

Seems the one to thank for the AIG bonuses is Sen. Chris Dodd.


From a Fox news article:

To Recover AIG Bonuses, Lawmakers Scramble to Undo Protections They Approved - Presidential Politics | Political News - FOXNews.com

Though Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., is among those leading the charge on retrieving the bonuses, an amendment he added to the $787 billion stimulus bill last month created a roadblock to getting that money back.
The amendment, meant to restrict executive pay for bailed-out banks, also included an exception for "contractually obligated bonuses agreed on before Feb. 11, 2009."
This would seem to exempt the AIG bonuses that lawmakers and President Obama are looking to recover. Incidentally, Dodd is the largest single recipient of 2008 campaign donations from AIG, with $103,100, according to the Center for Responsive Politics.

-ERD50

 

[Gone4Good]

I voted for "Of course, they worked hard for the money" because if I've learned nothing else from this forum, I've learned that all rich people are the most highly productive members of society. After all, it is only through their Herculean efforts that wealth is created. For as sure as the sun rises, if millions are not paid to these indispensable pillars of our shared prosperity, even in their catastrophic failure, they will simply not show up for work and all wealth will vanish from the universe. To prevent this economic calamity, not only must their compensation contracts be honored, but we must immediately reduce their marginal taxation so that they are properly incentivized to keep producing the enormous societal benefits for which they are paid so highly.

 

[Notmuchlonger]

I voted for "Of course, they worked hard for the money" because if I've learned nothing else from this forum, I've learned that all rich people are the most highly productive members of society. After all, it is only through their Herculean efforts that wealth is created. For as sure as the sun rises, if millions are not paid to these indispensable pillars of our shared prosperity, even in their catastrophic failure, they will simply not show up for work and all wealth will vanish from the universe. To prevent this economic calamity, not only must their compensation contracts be honored, but we must immediately reduce their marginal taxation so that they are properly incentivized to keep producing the enormous societal benefits for which they are paid so highly.

Wow you learned all that. Ive picked up quite a few tips on bacon here. But not all that! Course then again Im kinda slow.

 

[FUEGO]

I voted for "Of course, they worked hard for the money" because if I've learned nothing else from this forum, I've learned that all rich people are the most highly productive members of society. After all, it is only through their Herculean efforts that wealth is created. For as sure as the sun rises, if millions are not paid to these indispensable pillars of our shared prosperity, even in their catastrophic failure, they will simply not show up for work and all wealth will vanish from the universe. To prevent this economic calamity, not only must their compensation contracts be honored, but we must immediately reduce their marginal taxation so that they are properly incentivized to keep producing the enormous societal benefits for which they are paid so highly.

Does Obama know you might be up against him in 2012? Nice platform!

I wouldn't mind losing a few billion and getting paid a couple million to do so if I actually got to keep most of it.

 

[ERD50]

Beats me. I also ask why would Congress not have stipulations on money they were throwing to these companies. Beats me again..

Look back at the post from ls99. Congress *did* put stipulations on the money. And one of them was that AGI is required to pay these bonuses.

I guess it seemed like a good idea at the time

-ERD50

 

[ERD50]

Hmmmmm....

US Sen Dodd: Someone From Tsy Dept. Should Be At AIG Hearing - WSJ.com

WASHINGTON (Dow Jones)--The chairman of the U.S. Senate Banking Committee rebuked the Obama Administration's Treasury Department for failing to send any witnesses to a Thursday hearing on American International Group Inc. (AIG).WASHINGTON (Dow Jones)--The chairman of the U.S. Senate Banking Committee rebuked the Obama Administration's Treasury Department for failing to send any witnesses to a Thursday hearing on American International Group Inc. (AIG).

I guess it wasn't important. - ERD50

 

[FUEGO]

Hmmmmm....

US Sen Dodd: Someone From Tsy Dept. Should Be At AIG Hearing - WSJ.com


I guess it wasn't important. - ERD50

To be fair, there isn't hardly anyone staffing the Treasury Department. All the appointees seem to have had difficulty paying their taxes.

 

[harley]

Look back at the post from ls99. Congress *did* put stipulations on the money. And one of them was that AGI is required to pay these bonuses.

I guess it seemed like a good idea at the time

-ERD50

I don't think Congress put ANY stipulations into the bailout. They would have had to read it in order to do that. Some staffer whose brother works in Wall Street put in those stipulations. Dodd and the other doddering fools (both sides of the aisle) did soundbites, posed, tottered around to parties paid for by lobbyists, showed up to work for a couple hours, signed their names, and went to the next party. Now they are outraged, but can't get into details since it might show they didn't read the darn thing. So more soundbites, poses, etc.

 

[dex]

I don't think Congress put ANY stipulations into the bailout. They would have had to read it in order to do that. Some staffer whose brother works in Wall Street put in those stipulations. Dodd and the other doddering fools (both sides of the aisle) did soundbites, posed, tottered around to parties paid for by lobbyists, showed up to work for a couple hours, signed their names, and went to the next party. Now they are outraged, but can't get into details since it might show they didn't read the darn thing. So more soundbites, poses, etc.

You can do more research but there is info floating around about:

Political Yen/Yang: Lies, Subterfuge, and Illusions

Though Sen. Chris Dodd, D-Conn., is among those leading the charge on retrieving the bonuses, an amendment he added to the $787 billion stimulus bill last month created a roadblock to getting that money back.

The amendment, meant to restrict executive pay for bailed-out banks, also included an exception for "contractually obligated bonuses agreed on or before Feb. 11, 2009."

 

[FIRE'd@51]

I finally voted today in favor of the employees receiving the bonuses. I believe that these employees are contractually entitled to this money. I also believe they were offered these retention bonuses for valid reasons, prior to the bailout of AIG. They were familiar with AIG's trading book, and in better position to wind it down. Had they not been guaranteed these retention bonuses, they could have gone to work for a competitor or a hedge fund, and with the knowledge of AIG's trading book, been in a position to exploit its unwinding, ultimately to the detriment of US taxpayers. The $ involved in these "bonuses" are miniscule compared to the additional losses that could be realized in a less efficient unwinding of these positions.

 

[Brat]

There is merit in Fire'd@51 position. Those persons paid a retention bonus who are no longer working for AIG were paid to stay and wind down their book of business. They evidently did that and left. No different that what is offered employees who may loose their job as a result of a merger and whose continued employment through the merger is critical to operations.

What I think the public is angry about is the AMOUNT of bonuses paid in some of the financial sector, result of their actions on the economy such that they needed taxpayer support.

 

[ls99]

Since in the late night maneuverings the congress took out language to prohibit bonuses, and inserted Dodd's language, enshrining them in law.

I voted for the bonuses. Congressional blowhards can't have it both ways. Perhaps it is time to get the tar bucket ready and the feathers. Maybe the pitch forks too.

 

[73ss454]

There is merit in Fire'd@51 position. Those persons paid a retention bonus who are no longer working for AIG were paid to stay and wind down their book of business. They evidently did that and left. No different that what is offered employees who may loose their job as a result of a merger and whose continued employment through the merger is critical to operations.

What I think the public is angry about is the AMOUNT of bonuses paid in some of the financial sector, result of their actions on the economy such that they needed taxpayer support.

I don't think the public is angry about the amount of any bonus received on wall street. What we are mad about is rewarding someone who drove the business into the ground and once we use the publics money to rescue them then we give them a bonus.

If the company was making money and they want to reward the people who made the money, well that's great. But I don't want them to have a dime of my money for running the business into the ground.

 

[Westernskies]

I voted for "Of course, they worked hard for the money" because if I've learned nothing else from this forum, I've learned that all rich people are the most highly productive members of society. After all, it is only through their Herculean efforts that wealth is created. For as sure as the sun rises, if millions are not paid to these indispensable pillars of our shared prosperity, even in their catastrophic failure, they will simply not show up for work and all wealth will vanish from the universe. To prevent this economic calamity, not only must their compensation contracts be honored, but we must immediately reduce their marginal taxation so that they are properly incentivized to keep producing the enormous societal benefits for which they are paid so highly.

As one prone to occasional sarcasm, it is always gratifying to see a professional at work.

 

[HornedToad10]

A deal is a deal, if they truely were promised it for performance, they should get it as long as the company is still in business, not in banckruptcy.

The only reason the company is not in bankruptcy is due to the Billions given by the American people's tax dollars....

 

[Dennis]

Well, me thinks alot of the Noise on CNBC with Libbly Grandstanding .. I love how many on the panel fail to point out the $ is a LOAN to AIG and as long as it stays in business , it remains viable.. and the Interest rate is a bonus... payable back to The taxpayer.. Thus when they said that Ourselves, Children and Grandchildren will be paying for this, is Not excactly true.. not yet anyway.

We can either Forget wasting time on a Minute amt. of $ in those Bonus's , Keep AIG Alive and our Loans Vialble or Force it into Bankruptcy and Loose the whole works..
Out of the est total of $170 Billion? That Bonus $ is Spare change in the over-all scheme of things.. and like has been said.. Until Bankruptcy is declared, those Bonus Agreements have to be honored.. Right, wrong or Indifferent to what the General Public Thinks.. and 'Barney Phife' and his gang of amatures running that Witch Hunt and dog and pony show just makes them look enven worse with more egg on their faces..and how incompetent they are at handling Business matters..

Let's see how the UAW feels By forcing them to Give back all their outrageouse Bonus's and Benefits they got Still Comming , that the AIG bonus's Pale In comparision..