I think Vanguard Just Called Me Difficult and Expensive

I thought I saw somewhere that they ask for personal information like net worth and income when you switch. Is that true? Can you decline giving that kind of information and still make the switch?
Everybody does. Undoubtedly required. I doubt you are required to give honest answers although you might have a hard time challenging their advice if you lied about your assets.
 
From what I can see so far, the only information required by the know your client regulation is: name, date of birth, address, and identification number, which is understandable and not a problem. Income and net worth aren’t mentioned. I’ve got nothing to hide, but it makes me itchy providing that much detail. Who knows what they do with it and who has access to it. Other than my wife, my immediate family doesn’t even have that kind of information.
 
As much as we might like to think otherwise, the vast majority of mankind is entirely uninterested in anything about us, including how much money we make or have amassed. We and our affairs are, in fact, supremely unimportant.
 
As much as we might like to think otherwise, the vast majority of mankind is entirely uninterested in anything about us, including how much money we make or have amassed. We and our affairs are, in fact, supremely unimportant.

"They" are very interested in it because it's data that can be bought and sold. It rubs me the wrong way that my personal information is making other people money. But I answered Vanguard's questions because it's not a hill I'm going to die on.
 
It's only important to those guys that send you a mailing for a free dinner at the local steakhouse. I really want to go since it's a great restaurant. But I wonder how they know I'm worth a free meal. Because I'll go for the free meal.
 
Having worked in technology in the fund industry for three decades and seen the thousands of daily hacking attempts I'd suggest folks who don't convert are pretty loose with their money. That code base is nearly 40 years old. Things that are routinely done in modern technology aren't available in 1980s COBOLII. Good luck!
 
I thought I saw somewhere that they ask for personal information like net worth and income when you switch. Is that true? Can you decline giving that kind of information and still make the switch?

If you use a smart phone or computer you’re already giving away valuable information. What are the consequences if you don’t give them fully accurate information? They never asked me my income or net worth when I switched. Is that something new?
 
It's only important to those guys that send you a mailing for a free dinner at the local steakhouse. I really want to go since it's a great restaurant. But I wonder how they know I'm worth a free meal. Because I'll go for the free meal.

Got a friend with same motto “if it’s free it’s me”
 
Everybody does. Undoubtedly required. I doubt you are required to give honest answers although you might have a hard time challenging their advice if you lied about your assets.

I'm in the process of converting our retirement and joint accounts now. I posted my reason for converting our accounts in post #39 (Vanguard provides SIPC insurance coverage only on Brokerage accounts). I had been considering doing it for a while, but am in the process of doing Roth conversions this year, and originally wanted to hold off until completed.

I called and asked if conversion could be done individually on each account. They told me yes (three separate people in different conversations). You can't... When you click the "transition" button (located on the right, above each retirement account - Legacy view), it brings up all of your Retirement accounts (we have access to each other's accounts, along with joint account). The joint account did not come up. You must do all retirement accounts. The conversion for my wife's account did not take and was told to call. Turns out she must convert from her own sign in. Since she has access to my accounts, she had to process all mine as well. Hers went through and mine failed on her sign-in... Guess you might call this weak IT set up.

You have to answer the "(What's your Liquid Assets)", and "(What's your Net Worth)", for all accounts or it won't proceed. You are also asked what is your goal with your investments. These are Brokerage boilerplate type requirements according to Vanguard. I chose the first (lowest amounts) answer for assets and net worth (we are Flagship), and chose "preservation" for goals. I considered it to be the correct selection for ("prefer not to answer").

I called Vanguard about the Joint account (transition button inactive) and was sent a link to convert it to Brokerage. It's a manual process where I filled out the paperwork, and mailed it off to El Paso, TX for processing. It's done, but took awhile..

I am also converting our Joint Account into Individual accounts to split the amount to stay under the SIPC $500K max per each investment account. This was easy to do by setting up the Individual Accounts and waiting for them to do an in-kind split of Joint Acct (not a taxable event). I called them and they gave me instructions.

Will finish the Roth conversion when advantageous. It's a little different than the Legacy Account, as it transfers over "as it is" in the IRA now. If you don't have that fund in your Roth - it creates it for you. I was able to select where it went in Legacy...

You 1st get a confirmation of the Brokerage account set up, and then will get a notice of transaction when they move the funds from Legacy to Brokerage.

Hope this helps those asking about the process.
 
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Haven’t noticed anyone saying they wish they’d never switched. Seems like self imposed drama by VG.

No, it seems like self-imposed drama by the customers who have yet to switch.
 
I use to work in IT. I "owned" applications that were used globally across the MC, and was responsible to upgrade, add features, etc., with some frequency.

Despite communicating well in advance, and engaging users on changes needed, there was always some little group in the business who announced on launch day that they had issues. They were staying on outdated operating systems or browsers, or had built their own little plug ins to use in conjunction with my apps, that were totally non-standard and probably security risks, and now they wanted to make their lack of functionality my problem.

Many times we'd bend over backwards to try to accommodate, eventually I took a path not unlike Vanguard: I'm moving/changing to the future with my tools, you can come along with what we offer, or too bad so sad, not going to spend time and energy to fix a problem of 1% of my customers that are taking up 20% of my development and support costs.

"Difficult and expensive" - that sounds like me!
 
…..

You have to answer the "(What's your Liquid Assets)", and "(What's your Net Worth)", for all accounts or it won't proceed. You are also asked what is your goal with your investments. These are Brokerage boilerplate type requirements according to Vanguard. I chose the first (lowest amounts) answer for assets and net worth (we are Flagship), and chose "preservation" for goals. I considered it to be the correct selection for ("prefer not to answer").

...

Thanks for the detailed response. Regarding your paragraph above, am I understanding correctly, that you’re not required to provide income information, and you may choose from a range of assets and net worth that may not necessarily be accurate, or am I reading in too much?
 
You have to answer the "(What's your Liquid Assets)", and "(What's your Net Worth)", for all accounts or it won't proceed. You are also asked what is your goal with your investments. These are Brokerage boilerplate type requirements according to Vanguard. I chose the first (lowest amounts) answer for assets and net worth (we are Flagship), and chose "preservation" for goals. I considered it to be the correct selection for ("prefer not to answer").

Thanks for the detailed response. Regarding your paragraph above, am I understanding correctly, that you’re not required to provide income information, and you may choose from a range of assets and net worth that may not necessarily be accurate, or am I reading in too much?

I put the original Vanguard questions in parenthesis as I don't recall the exact wording. You must select from a multiple choice for Annual Income (I chose less than $20K), and Liquid Net Worth (again I chose less than $20K). These were the (lowest) 1st choices. You must select for each account type - Individual, Joint, IRA, and Roth, or it won't let you move forward. They also ask about your goals.

This is a copy of the information as shown on my Brokerage Acct set-up confirmation.

Financial profile

Annual income Less than $20,000
Liquid net worth Less than $20,000

Investment objective

Primary investment objective Capital preservation
Secondary investment objective–

Source of funds Retirement/General savings
 
We've been with Vanguard for at least 25 to 30 years and refused to do the transition. Me and my wife held several legacy mutual fund accounts plus I had a SEP/IRA brokerage account. This year we are actively trying to simplify and consolidate our finances. We wanted to rollover a 403b from my wifes former employer into Vanguard. To do so Vanguard required us to open a brokerage account in her name. We decided to go ahead and transfer all of our accounts into the new brokerage based platform. They were very helpful and it was a lot easier than I expected.
 
Remember that Twilight Zone episode with Robert Redford where he is "Mr. Death" and tricks the old lady to cross over. Guess I'm like that old lady :angel:.
 
For what it's worth, I have been with Vanguard since 1984. I have never been disappointed with that choice.
 
I've also been holding off on the account transition to brokerage. Mostly because I haven't been forced or taken the time to read about it more thoroughly.

One key question/concern I had is if it would change my account numbers or do anything that might require more work for automatic investments already setup from other sources? i.e. We are still in accumulation mode and I have bi-weekly paycheck investments into 529s and a taxable account. I don't want to move if it means I have to adjust that on my employer's side.

Anyone know by chance?
 
I've also been holding off on the account transition to brokerage. Mostly because I haven't been forced or taken the time to read about it more thoroughly.

One key question/concern I had is if it would change my account numbers or do anything that might require more work for automatic investments already setup from other sources? i.e. We are still in accumulation mode and I have bi-weekly paycheck investments into 529s and a taxable account. I don't want to move if it means I have to adjust that on my employer's side.

Anyone know by chance?
I'd call Vanguard to be sure.

What I can tell you from other providers is that account numbers are assigned sequentially with a check digit at the end. Vanguard has two different systems of record, each with its own database. I would assume they won't carry forward as the population of new account numbers are duplicates to some of the legacy numbers. It is possible that they decided to decorate one set of account numbers to avoid this.
 
I logged back on this morning to see if I could figure out how to convert. Between traditional IRAs, Roths, taxables, and joint accounts with my kids I have 10 accounts. There was no indication on the initial "balances" screen which account(s) needed converted. As I mentioned earlier, I would routinely click the "convert" button when they started prompting me after login a few years ago. Never any indication what account was being converted, no indication of which accounts had already converted, and no message once a conversion had completed. Eventually the site quit asking me to convert every time I logged in so I figured I'd gotten them all.

9 of my 10 accounts had the word "brokerage" in their name so I clicked down through the one that didn't and found a "convert" button. I had to read carefully to spot the button because it was lost in their Fisher Price UI design where everything is in a huge font and nothing is highlighted or made distinct. When I clicked it and started the conversion process it wanted to convert 5 of my 10 accounts. So it wants to convert accounts that are already listed a brokerage. 4 of those 5 are IRAs from 401k rollovers I've done within the last year so I have no idea why they would be in the old system. The system said the conversions will take a couple days. Based on past experience I don't expect any notification of when, or if, any of these are converted. I also have zero confidence they actually will all be converted or that I'll have any way to know which ones are still on the old platform.

I called them and did it on the phone. Sounds time consuming but it wasn't. YMMV
 
I thought I saw somewhere that they ask for personal information like net worth and income when you switch. Is that true? Can you decline giving that kind of information and still make the switch?

I don't recall such a request - maybe they did.
 
Everybody does. Undoubtedly required. I doubt you are required to give honest answers although you might have a hard time challenging their advice if you lied about your assets.

But I don't want any advice.
 
As much as we might like to think otherwise, the vast majority of mankind is entirely uninterested in anything about us, including how much money we make or have amassed. We and our affairs are, in fact, supremely unimportant.

Heh, heh, it's not mankind I'm concerned about. It's individual criminals (and other gummint agencies.):LOL:
 
One key question/concern I had is if it would change my account numbers or do anything that might require more work for automatic investments already setup from other sources?

When I converted my 3 accounts, each was assigned a new account number. That was probably a decade or longer but I suspect that is still the case.
 
One key question/concern I had is if it would change my account numbers or do anything that might require more work for automatic investments already setup from other sources?

Anyone know by chance?

When I converted my 3 accounts, each was assigned a new account number. That was probably a decade or longer but I suspect that is still the case.

I'm ashamed to say, I never even looked to see if the acct. numbers had changed. Didn't occur to me. Everything else look pretty much the same. I pay attention to results when I get paper in the mail. I rarely visit the site unless I want to DO something. SO, for me, nothing really changed, though maybe the acct. numbers?? YMMV
 
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