ltc insurance

[Foghorn Leghorn]

Trying to gauge the communities thoughts/opinions on long term care insurance.

Do you have it ? If yes, why ? If no, why not ?

 

[foxcreek9]

Yes, to protect each other in worse case. We have too much for state medicaid and too little to truly self-insure. Will drop after one us dies.

 

[Montecfo]

We self insure.

LTC is too expensive these days.

I think life insurance is a better alternative.

 

[pjm-7]

Yes. I have a small low cost policy that I got through a former employer. Benefit is $100/day, three year limit, premium $540 per year. I have it because I am single with very few options for someone to care for me. I look at LTC insurance like I look at social security, it is as a floor of protection.

 

[misanman]

Don't have it. We self insure.

 

[latexman]

Our home ($400k) is our LTC insurance policy.

 

[HarveyS]

Don't have LTC insurance. We were offered a policy about 10 yrs ago as part of an overall financial advisor review by Merrill Lynch. Premiums were, IMO, outrageous for the coverage provided. Like an earlier post, the coverage was capped per day and a fixed number of years. Wife and I opted to self insure.

 

[Canoesmith]

LTC isnt like our parents bought

LTC coverage. Expensive premiums that go up, while benefits stay the same or go down - as care costs rise. IMO.

We didn't buy a LTC coverage - but we earmarked our primary home (current value ~$600k) as our future self funded LTC piggybank. As we age it will/should go up in value keeping pace with actual LTC costs. If we sell it prior, we put it to work keeping it set aside and separate for that sole purpose.

Maybe not perfect, but gives us some peace of mind.

 

[Chuckanut]

No. I don't carry LTC insurance. It's to expensive.

The LTC policy I want would start after a year or two of confinement, and go on for life. Since the long wait would make is highly unlikely that I would collect a cent, the rate would be very low. That kind of policy does not exist.

 

[RunningBum]

Self insuring, at least at this point. I will look at it periodically in my 60s and 70s but don't really expect to do differently.

 

[RetiredAt55.5]

house as their ltc?

Two replies so far mentioning their house is their LTC insurance.

So, how would that work if one spouse needs ltc and the other spouse is still healthy and living in the house?

Forced to sell or reverse mortgage?

 

[Dash man]

We bought LTC through my employer in our 40s, we are now 64. It has an optional inflation adjustment every three years. For both of us this year we paid ~$6,000 for nearly $600/day that would last five years or so. It also covers assisted living and in home care. We’re happy we bought young and when it started it was about $2,000/year cost. Should we die our estate gets a good chunk of the premiums back.

 

[Montecfo]

We bought LTC through my employer in our 40s, we are now 64. It has an optional inflation adjustment every three years. For both of us this year we paid ~$6,000 for nearly $600/day that would last five years or so. It also covers assisted living and in home care. We’re happy we bought young and when it started it was about $2,000/year cost. Should we die our estate gets a good chunk of the premiums back.

I think if you can buy LTC as a group policy, either through work or through an association, it is a lot more affordable.

Usual caveats about what happens when you leave employment.

It is "term" insurance. So a large risk is dealing with the price increases which will inevitably come. MIL lived to 93, and every year was tempted to not pay the premium because it was so costly! We had to talk her into it.

Good news is she never needed it

 

[H2ODude]

Self insured. I've never understood buying insurance that the insurer can raise the price at will over the years. If I buy something I want a defined price and product. It seems you don't get either from some of the posts and articles I've read.

 

[Mark1]

Two replies so far mentioning their house is their LTC insurance.

So, how would that work if one spouse needs ltc and the other spouse is still healthy and living in the house?

Forced to sell or reverse mortgage?

Another self insure here with house as LTC. House is worth > $900K and our yearly spend is ~$180K and growing each year (VPW), so we can easily finance LTC out of portfolio, if necessary. Also, if LTC is necessary, then life ends as we know it anyway.

 

[CRLLS]

We self insure.

We are just now sorting out LTC benefits for DMIL. For homecare assistance it covers only $87 per day of her $324 daily bill. If she stays in home care for the next year, that amounts to ~$32,000 per year. She likely will not last that long. I don't know if that is more or less than the total of her insurance premiums. I also don't know if her deceased husband also had LTC. I suspect that he did. I do know that he never used LTC benefits at all. His wife was his caregiver. He passed <24 hours from being placed into hospice. We just don't see the payback of LTC. YMMV.

As H20Dude mentioned, getting into a life long contract where the premiums and/or benefits are not fixed at the front end was a non-starter for us.

 

[razztazz]

Self-insuring for the first 2 to 3 years. Then I either die or it's Medicaid or they accept my pension + Social Security, together less than the retail rate, as payment in full and hope I don't live too long.

 

[Golden sunsets]

We purchased LTC policies through Prudential at ages 61/63. We are now 72/74. Premiuns have increased from $4,800/yr(for 2 people) to $8,000/yr. Those premiums will increase further no doubt. The coverage at this point is $320/day for 4 years for each of us and the coverage increases at the rate of 5%/yr. The coverage also can be used for in home care.

Here's the thing. We could easily self insure.........now. Our investment portfolio is mid 7 figures. When we purchased the policies 11 years ago, we had a NW of just under 2 million, a NW that most FA's say warrants purchasing coverage. Now we are outside that window of need, but the premium is not a significant cost to us, so we keep it to preserve the legacy we hope to leave to our children.

 

[Dash man]

We purchased LTC policies through Prudential at ages 61/63. We are now 72/74. Premiuns have increased from $4,800/yr(for 2 people) to $8,000/yr. Those premiums will increase further no doubt. The coverage at this point is $320/day for 4 years for each of us and the coverage increases at the rate of 5%/yr. The coverage also can be used for in home care.

Here's the thing. We could easily self insure.........now. Our investment portfolio is mid 7 figures. When we purchased the policies 11 years ago, we had a NW of just under 2 million, a NW that most FA's say warrants purchasing coverage. Now we are outside that window of need, but the premium is not a significant cost to us, so we keep it to preserve the legacy we hope to leave to our children.

That’s how we think. We can easily afford the premiums and want to leave something for the kids and grandkids.

 

[latexman]

So, how would that work if one spouse needs ltc and the other spouse is still healthy and living in the house? Forced to sell or reverse mortgage?

My FIL and MIL's exact situation. Both are in a full service retirement community. FIL is in independent living apartment, and MIL is in memory care unit. They had no LTC policy. They used their home's equity to help get into a nice place.

 

[Focus]

I got it in my 40s. Premiums, despite major increases along the way, remained comparatively low. However, after a divorce and the latest premium increase, I opted to let it go. I did a lot of research and decided that it was unlikely the policy would end up being all that helpful to me.

Let's face it: Few got this coverage when it was more widely available and affordable, so the problem has not been addressed for society as a whole. I think the government will have to provide a solution of some sort in the future.

 

[rk911]

got it when i turned 60. why? the purpose of insurance is to transfer risk.

 

[athena53]

Let's face it: Few got this coverage when it was more widely available and affordable, so the problem has not been addressed for society as a whole. I think the government will have to provide a solution of some sort in the future.

There is already. It's called Medicaid. Depending on the quality and availability of Medicaid beds in your area, it may not be pretty.

I'm self-insuring. Monte Carlo simulations by my advisor confirm that this is realistic. It's an easier decision as a single person- no scary scenario of one person in the house, the other in LTC. My son, my only heir, knows that my top priority is not outliving my savings.

 

[rk911]

There is already. It's called Medicaid. Depending on the quality and availability of Medicaid beds in your area, it may not be pretty..

several years ago my late mom-in-law had to spend about a month in a nursing home recovering from a fall. my wife and i inspected about a dozen. one, which seemed to cater to medicaid patients, was a hellhole. we never went past the front desk. my late father-in-law set up a substantial trust for MIL so she was able to pay-out-of-pocket.

 

[GravitySucks]

Self insured. It's only me so if it happens after I'm 70, between SS and selling the house I get 3 years or so in a decent nursing home or 8 years in an assisted living apartment.
The better nursing home in my county takes you if you can give 2 years cost up front and will keep you if you end up on Medicaid. Not sure if you go to a double room at that point though.
That's assuming I went through the whole IRA before having to go into the system.
DD2 worked at the most expensive assisted living apartments in the area at the same time an acquaintance was living at another place that was slightly more than 1/2 the cost. The food and common area furniture was a bit better at the expensive one but the assistance was no better.
You could have a small dog at both places so it's something I could make work.