Vanguard Transition is too much trouble

[GrayHare]

Quote:

Originally Posted by pb4uski ^^^^ I have done a couple transitions from mutual fund to brokerage and have never been asked any such questions. Also, each transition has been quick and easy.

VG might already have had that info from you when you opened a different account. If regulators really want that personal data to be meaningful and useful, it should be re-gathered periodically. I'm happy that's not done though.

[Paulz]

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Originally Posted by gwraigty So you had a rollover mutual fund IRA with Vanguard that you converted to a rollover brokerage IRA, that you then rolled back into a 401k. You should have been able to open up the proper IRA type at Fidelity/Schwab/any brokerage of your choosing, fill out the proper transfer forms, and then the assets from the rollover brokerage IRA at Vanguard would have been transferred to the new brokerage IRA. Otherwise, that's like saying that once you rollover employer plan assets to a firm, you're stuck with that firm for life. It's just not true. [/URL]

You nailed it! I don't want a brokerage IRA and that is my only option now that my IRA is in a Vanguard brokerage IRA! I tried to move from a Vanguard Brokerage IRA to a Fidelity and Schwab IRA and both refused to do it since my Vanguard was a brokerage account. They both told me I had to open a brokerage account with them if I wanted to do a rollover. They would not allow me just to open a rollover IRA and move the funds over.

[gwraigty]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulz You nailed it! I don't want a brokerage IRA and that is my only option now that my IRA is in a Vanguard brokerage IRA! I tried to move from a Vanguard Brokerage IRA to a Fidelity and Schwab IRA and both refused to do it since my Vanguard was a brokerage account. They both told me I had to open a brokerage account with them if I wanted to do a rollover. They would not allow me just to open a rollover IRA and move the funds over.

The above still doesn't make sense to me. Fidelity and Schwab (and other firms) offer taxable brokerage accounts, IRAs/Roth IRAs, and rollover IRAs. In effect, they're all brokerage accounts that allow the purchase and sales of stocks, bonds, mutual funds, ETFs, etc.

In an earlier post, you said you solved it by rolling over your IRA back into a 401k. Above, you make no mention of that. It's not clear to me whether you're trying to rollover 401k assets or transfer assets from a Vanguard IRA to another firm. Maybe it's not clear to them either.

[donheff]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulz You nailed it! I don't want a brokerage IRA and that is my only option now that my IRA is in a Vanguard brokerage IRA! I tried to move from a Vanguard Brokerage IRA to a Fidelity and Schwab IRA and both refused to do it since my Vanguard was a brokerage account. They both told me I had to open a brokerage account with them if I wanted to do a rollover. They would not allow me just to open a rollover IRA and move the funds over.

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwraigty The above still doesn't make sense to me. Fidelity and Schwab (and other firms) offer taxable brokerage accounts, IRAs/Roth IRAs, and rollover IRAs. In effect, they're all brokerage accounts that allow the purchase and sales of stocks, bonds, mutual funds, ETFs, etc. In an earlier post, you said you solved it by rolling over your IRA back into a 401k. Above, you make no mention of that. It's not clear to me whether you're trying to rollover 401k assets or transfer assets from a Vanguard IRA to another firm. Maybe it's not clear to them either.

I don't understand the dispute here. I just opened a rollover IRA at Schwab and rolled over a chunk of a TSP account into it so I can do CQDs by check. They never raised the subject of establishing a brokerage account. When I log in the account shows up as a "rollover IRA" not as some sort of subset of a taxable brokerage account.

[Chuckanut]

Vanguard converted me to a brokerage account a while back. I can't see a meaningful difference between the brokerage account and what I used to have.

Is there a difference?

[MRG]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuckanut Vanguard converted me to a brokerage account a while back. I can't see a meaningful difference between the brokerage account and what I used to have. Is there a difference?

I believe the only difference is you can purchase equities and ETF types of investments. Probably do options too.

I'm not sure what all the concern is about. Vendor says this is my stated direction. Let's get on the train or get outa dodge.

[gwraigty]

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Originally Posted by donheff I don't understand the dispute here. I just opened a rollover IRA at Schwab and rolled over a chunk of a TSP account into it so I can do CQDs by check. They never raised the subject of establishing a brokerage account. When I log in the account shows up as a "rollover IRA" not as some sort of subset of a taxable brokerage account.

Agree. I can't figure out what Paulz issue is, going back and forth on this, so I'm bowing out of that issue. I cannot imagine any brokerage firm refusing to accept assets rolled over from an IRA or 401k held at a different firm. Yes, a rollover IRA has to be opened first at the receiving firm so the funds/assets have an account to go into. That is all. A Google search of "Fidelity rollover IRA" or "Schwab rollover IRA" brings up links to their website that neatly explains the steps to take.

I think this topic has morphed into at least 3 separate discussions by now.

[googily]

My guess is that paulz equates brokerage with stocks, and doesn't understand that a brokerage account at Vanguard can be an IRA that holds a single mutual fund.

[Paulz]

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Originally Posted by googily My guess is that paulz equates brokerage with stocks, and doesn't understand that a brokerage account at Vanguard can be an IRA that holds a single mutual fund.

LOL. I do understand that. No need to guess.....

I have several IRAs that I would love to consolidate into one. All are just plain regular IRAs except for Vanguards, which is in a brokerage account. Because of that, no one will allow me to consolidate since that one IRA is in a brokerage account and the other two are not. All have told me that if consolidation is my end goal, then I need to make the other accounts brokerage accounts and then they can be combined.

My resolution was just to transfer the Vanguard IRA back into my 401k and be done with it. I still have the brokerage account with my Roth IRA (yes a single mutual fund!), but this was the only way to combine the IRAs.

Sorry this has been so confusing, but am I really the only one that has tried to do something like this before? I would have thought someone would have tried rolling over a IRA in a brokerage account to a IRA in a non-brokerage account. Well, if you try then at least you'll know my experience.

[MRG]

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Originally Posted by Paulz Sorry this has been so confusing, but am I really the only one that has tried to do something like this before? I would have thought someone would have tried rolling over a IRA in a brokerage account to a IRA in a non-brokerage account. Well, if you try then at least you'll know my experience.

Yes people tried to do that. That's why they give you a roadmap of how it has to be done.

The reason nobody's going to allow it to back to a MF account from a brokerage account makes sense. It's a one way trip, no way back. I believe that is by design. Who is going to validate the brokerage account only has mutual funds in it? The customer isn't capable. Seriously, the customer can't be trusted!

The target system? Who is going to look at an individual's account and guarantee there's no equitys? Guarantee there's no outstanding orders? No options contracts? Think a large provider has people looking at that detail? No way. I spent decades of my life in developing solutions for this kind of business and it's all automated. Has to be, you can't scale such actions.

[pb4uski]

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Originally Posted by Paulz .... I have several IRAs that I would love to consolidate into one. All are just plain regular IRAs except for Vanguards, which is in a brokerage account. Because of that, no one will allow me to consolidate since that one IRA is in a brokerage account and the other two are not. All have told me that if consolidation is my end goal, then I need to make the other accounts brokerage accounts and then they can be combined. ...

There is something getting lost in the translation because what you describe is all wrong and not the way it works.

Typically when IRA are "consolidated" as you use the term what really happens is that the investments in the sending IRA are sold and the proceeds are rolled over to the receiving IRA.... cash is cash so whether the sending or receiving IRA are brokerage accounts or mutual fund accounts or bank CDs doesn't matter.

A mutual fund company cannot refuse to do a rollover. Even if they did you could then say "Ok, send me a check for my balance" and then you just deposit the check in the brokerage IRA as a rollover (but you can only do that once a year).

Did you talk with Vanguard on this?

[BeanCounter62]

Seems like a good day to do the Vanguard Transition.
Anyone else starting the year with the transition?

I waited to the start of the year to avoid having to report on taxes for the 2 types of accounts.

Transition was quick and easy (officially complete after 1-2 business days).

[pb4uski]

I'm thinking about it. My retirement accounts were done last year. We have 3 taxable counts that coul be done as well as DW's Roth and DS' tTRA and Roth.

The three taxable accounts have no trading at all and dividends are not reinvested. DW's Roth has no activity other than reinvested dividends. DS' Roth and tIRA has no activity other than a contribution once a year and reinvested dividends. So given how "simple" these accounts are, I'm not sure it is worth the effort to convert them.

[boog]

Considering transitioning too. Looking at my accounts, my taxable account does not offer the prompt to “transition this account” as do my IRAs. As far as I can tell, my taxable account is a mutual fund only account. It’s also my oldest - had it about 20 years. What’s up with this?

[teejayevans]

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Originally Posted by boog Considering transitioning too. Looking at my accounts, my taxable account does not offer the prompt to “transition this account” as do my IRAs. As far as I can tell, my taxable account is a mutual fund only account. It’s also my oldest - had it about 20 years. What’s up with this?

Could it be it has a fund of some type that can’t be transition over?
I would call them and ask.

[boog]

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Originally Posted by teejayevans Could it be it has a fund of some type that can’t be transition over? I would call them and ask.

After wasting some time poking around their site's search function, I just sent an email to the flagship rep. asking for more info. Thanks

[harllee]

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Originally Posted by boog Considering transitioning too. Looking at my accounts, my taxable account does not offer the prompt to “transition this account” as do my IRAs. As far as I can tell, my taxable account is a mutual fund only account. It’s also my oldest - had it about 20 years. What’s up with this?

OP here, this is one of the problems I had with the transition--I was asked by Vanguard to transition but could not find the way to do it. I searched the website, but could not find it. I contacted my Vanguard rep, he sent me a link, still could not figure it out. Finally when I allowed pop ups on my computer I found the link. Why would the link for this be a pop up? Irritating.

[boog]

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Originally Posted by harllee OP here, this is one of the problems I had with the transition--I was asked by Vanguard to transition but could not find the way to do it. I searched the website, but could not find it. I contacted my Vanguard rep, he sent me a link, still could not figure it out. Finally when I allowed pop ups on my computer I found the link. Why would the link for this be a pop up? Irritating.

following up: received email from VG stating "There is currently a restriction on your individual taxable account which is preventing you from transitioning the account online. To remove the restriction, we need to speak with you on the phone. At that time, a Flagship representative can remove the restriction and assist you with completing the process."
I called and was told there was a "funding restriction" on my account which was an internal issue - nothing I had done - and it would be removed today allowing me to do the online transition. I'll log back on in a few hours and see how it goes.

[stephenson]

Yeah - had same thing happen between the online-human interface components.

Frankly, I would have expected them to research it, first, then contact you and say - "our bad and we fixed it" - all they did was push you off to another level and they then found the issue.

[gauss]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boog Considering transitioning too. Looking at my accounts, my taxable account does not offer the prompt to “transition this account” as do my IRAs. As far as I can tell, my taxable account is a mutual fund only account. It’s also my oldest - had it about 20 years. What’s up with this?

Are there any joint owners on the account, if so who's SSN is on the tax reporting documents?