Why is America not angry?

[Buckeye]

I will show my anger on election day.

 

[CCdaCE]

Well, they've got lots of tall blond women. And sausage is considered a quality vegetable.

I'll take those two attributes over stock market returns anyday. Whoops. My wife says I dont.

Never mind...

I know. I snagged one of those blonds myself. Then she goes and claims German heritage on me. Best of both worlds.

Tastes like more.

-CC

 

[2soon2tell]

We have seen the enemy and he is us. Well a lot of us anyway, of course not including the participants in this forumn.

I think instant gratification is so ingrained in our culture today that only a gut wrenching dperession will change our ways.

2soon2tell

 

[ERD50]

I will show my anger on election day.

What are you going to do? Boycott the election?

-ERD50

 

[Finance Dave]

Could someone please tell me why the average citizen is not angry about what is now taking place?

IMO there are at least two reasons:
1) Most people don't understand the complexity of what's going on. I'll admit I'm ignorant of many of the things that go on behind the scenes in our credit markets. I'd say less than 5% of Americans understand what a bank's reserve ratio is.

2) The bailout being offered is marketed at helping main street America. While I believe it's the wrong approach (and I've already written my Congressional members), you have Henry Paulson on TV this morning telling citizens that this is better than the alternative.

I say let the markets work. I agree that in the short term it would be very bad. Banks would fail, people would lose their homes, and so on. Our country needs a good dose of reality. Then maybe in 2-3 years we'll get our act together and all be smarter about our borrowing and spending habits.

Dave

 

[Finance Dave]

We have seen the enemy and he is us. Well a lot of us anyway, of course not including the participants in this forumn.

I think instant gratification is so ingrained in our culture today that only a gut wrenching dperession will change our ways.

2soon2tell

Well said...take a look at my post above and you'll see we think alike.

 

[cute fuzzy bunny]

They dont care:

Poll: Americans shrug off crisis - MSN Money

 

[Finance Dave]

They dont care:

Poll: Americans shrug off crisis - MSN Money

add the word "yet". Once this is all said and done I think many will care...I just don't think it's directly affecting them yet.

 

[ERD50]

add the word "yet". Once this is all said and done I think many will care...I just don't think it's directly affecting them yet.

I agree. For the average American, what has really changed? I woke up this morning, got my coffee, got the paper, had eggs for breakfast, etc.

Yes, My NW has dropped this year, but it has risen for each of the past 4 years (since FIRE). Not everyone on the planet maxed out their house equity, etc. Now, if unemployment hits really high levels, inflation goes crazy, etc, yep, they average person is going to be screaming. Geez, look at all the blabber we heard about $4 gas, you'd think it was the end of civilization. Well, gas is still that high, and people have settled into the idea, and made some adjustments. But the world didn't end.

So we will need to see what unfolds. I had some crazy 17% mortgage on my first single-family house. As scary as that sounds, I just got up in the morning, went to work, came home, got my paycheck, paid the bills. Life went on. So we will see.

-ERD50

 

[free4now]

Life does go on. California hasn't had a budget for months, but frankly it hasn't yet made any impact on my daily life as a Californian.

It's kind of insidious how many of our societal ills manifest as slowly creeping inflation. People are already noticing inflation, and as it gets worse it will be on everyone's minds. But everyone will just blame the inflation on Bush, who will be out of office, and they'll probably not make the connection to the bailout.

 

[Beryl]

I'm not angry because my needs are met -- thank God. I work out of my home and if I get laid off, I'll bridge to retirement and draw pension. All is not rosey though:
1. My 401K dropped 10% in 9 months. I moved everything to the sidelines for a while. I may go back in -- just a little -- when things settle down.
2. My first home (now a rental) per Zillow (I know, I know) dropped in value at 8.4%. Thankfully, the Boulder, Colorado housing market tends to be relatively stable. The rent yields a 500/month cash flow. I'm keeping the rent low to keep my good tenants.
3. The value of my current house (purchased 1 year ago) dropped 8.1%.
4. The foreclosure next door was purchased for a song and that will hit our home values. Thank God it is occupied though and there are not very many foreclosures in our subdivision.
5. My credit union checking (money market) isn't yielding much but it still there.

FIRE is not looking to good since I didn't anticipate this down-turn. I'll definitely continue working until 55 (another year) or until they offer me a package to leave. That package should compensate for this year's losses.

It is sad to see how it is affecting everyone else though. I volunteer at a women's shelter and hear a lot of stories. Many people are being wiped out by emergency health care costs.

 

[chinaco]

I think the middle-class with 401ks, IRAs, etc are angry.

There are so many americans that are in debt with no investments... that their only concern is their job.

They are angry about the economy. However, many cannot connect the dots to the financial crisis. But they get one loud and clear message.

The pig have been taking advantage and getting rich... Here I am worried about keeping my job and home.

We will be able to measure the anger in the election in about 6 weeks.

 

[Mysto]

I am not just angry - for the first time in my investing life I am truly scared. I have done all of the analysis to ensure my investments will perform during my retirement but none of those calculations figured in this kind of massive tampering by the government. This time it is different! No one knows what the results might be.

There will be a lot of money being made in this bailout but it won't be the average American. The corruption in this program will make the Katrina thing look lily white.
In the mean time the average saver and investor may be looking at a long period of no returns - this money has to come from somewhere.

 

[Retire Soon]

Now the arsonists who initially started the fire are masquerading as firefighters pretending to help extinguish the now raging inferno.

Banks Rush to Shape Rescue Plan - WSJ.com

"The nations financial and political leaders are working around the clock to repair the shattered markets and no one, from the White House on down, has spent more than a few minutes explaining to the American people why they're being asked to assume hundreds of billions of dollars in liabilities."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/21/AR2008092102534.html?hpid=topnews

 

[ladelfina]

shock doctrine

 

[FinanceDude]

I can't figure out what I'm more mad about, that greedy CEOs fleeced everyone or that the Fed has become the new "Paycheck Advance Loan" bank.........

 

[al_bundy]

quick summary, Obama, Clinton and other democrats took money from Fannie and Freddie and defeated a proposed bill that would have saved them. McCain was one of the co-sponsors of this bill that would have put some regulatory controls on Fannie

Bloomberg.com: News#

 

[Beryl]

quick summary, Obama, Clinton and other democrats took money from Fannie and Freddie and defeated a proposed bill that would have saved them. McCain was one of the co-sponsors of this bill that would have put some regulatory controls on Fannie

And McCain also has not less than FIFTY-NINE (59) lobbyists on staff including Aquiles Suarez, listed as an economic adviser to the McCain campaign in a July 2007 McCain press release, was formerly the director of government and industry relations for Fannie Mae. The Senate Lobbying Database says Suarez oversaw the lending giant's $47,510,000 lobbying campaign from 2003 to 2006.

I guess the way to regulate Fannie/Freddie is to hire their people.

 

[FinanceDude]

And McCain also has not less than FIFTY-NINE (59) lobbyists on staff including Aquiles Suarez, listed as an economic adviser to the McCain campaign in a July 2007 McCain press release, was formerly the director of government and industry relations for Fannie Mae. The Senate Lobbying Database says Suarez oversaw the lending giant's $47,510,000 lobbying campaign from 2003 to 2006.

I guess the way to regulate Fannie/Freddie is to hire their people.

How many lobbyists on staff does Obama have? Just wanting clarification.........

 

[Beryl]

How many lobbyists on staff does Obama have? Just wanting clarification.........

Last count from this AM - ZERO (0). That is why the Obama line was so funny:

Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he's president that he'll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys network in Washington.'
Now I'm not making this up. This is somebody who's been in Congress for twenty-six years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign.
And now he tells us that he's the one who's gonna' to take on the old boys network. The old boys network? In the McCain campaign that's called a staff meeting. Come, on!

YouTube - Obama: Old Boys Network = McCain Campaign Staff Meeting
​

 

[al_bundy]

Obama co-chair a state lobbyist - First Read - msnbc.com

did he get fired?

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/lobbyists-on-obamas-08-payroll-2007-12-20.html

 

[armor99]

Good post.
The Roman Emperors gave out free bread and held gladiatorial games.
Maybe people think laughing at Stephen Colbert and making jokes about Bush is showing their intelligence and a valid way to participate.

Excellent post Dex... I think this is by and large correct. The govt has worked so hard at making our lives... "easier", that I think the reaction of most people is just "well I do not understand any of this, but I am sure the govt will fix it all."

 

[Gardnr]

I think it's one part - they don't really understand what's going on
and one part - the majority of Americans are complicit in the greedy debt orgy that's been going on, and it's a little hard to be righteously outraged when you've been part of the problem. Rampant greed, envy, and the resultant debt-driven consumerism is one leg of the underpinnings of this whole fiasco. Another leg, of course, is the creation of the exotic derivatives, etc. on Wall St, and the huge leveraging.

Everybody from the borrowers to the realtors, to the mortgage brokers, to the lenders to Wall Street, to the yield-hungry investors, is guilty in this.

Mass greed driven delusion.

And although I don't take them off the hook, I also think that if our government (congress, executive branch, both) had reached out and taken away the punch bowl the public would have been up in arms, accusing them of "ruining the economy." Therefore I don't know if there were any congressmen sounding the alarm on this other than Ron Paul. And look at how he's regarded. Just a nut who didn't understand the "modern economy" and wanted to ruin the party.

 

[ER_Hopeful]

I'm not angry because I don't know how the numbers apply to me personally. I see the phase "gov. bailout is going to cause taxpayers xxx" but I don't understand what it really means. I'm guessing it means they'll cut funding for xyz and use that for bailout, so if they can break it down to something like, they'll cut your mom's social security by $500/month, your future medicare by $xxx and your kids' whatever by $xxxxxxx and use those $ to $ave the bastards, then I'll be angry.

If it means just printing more IOU's, then I'll probably just shrug my shoulders.

 

[Zoocat]

Every greedy little fist on wall street is reaching for the bailout pie. There's no shame left.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/22/business/22lobby.html?th&emc=th