Countries offering retirement visas

[ShokWaveRider]

Amazing on how many folks are considering leaving the US. We have 3 affluent neighbors that are waiting till 2024 to make the final decision, probably using the Golden Citizenship route. We have secured an EU country citizenship in case we decide to go too. After the UK left the EU my British passport by Birth became virtually useless for us as we do not want to live there. Mainly because of the weather. We have no family ties anywhere, just need good healthcare options as we get older.

 

[tulak]

I don’t know how they will handle it. She hasn’t told them yet, waiting for a promotion to be confirmed first. She is owed a 6 month paid sabbatical so that will be at US rates regardless.



After paying off the mortgage she expects to clear $1m on her house sale so will have no problem buying something here.

That’s awesome. Hope it all works out well for them.

 

[tulak]

It’s not easy to move to another country, even if you have the right paperwork.

I realized a few years ago that I’ll likely always maintain US residency, even though I could live anywhere in the EU. Too many relationships that I wouldn’t want to lose. Maybe that’ll change, but in the meantime, I’m content taking longer trips to Europe and living in the US.

 

[Alan]

It’s not easy to move to another country, even if you have the right paperwork.

And even going the "Golden Citizenship" route requires a significant investment in the country you are moving to. (For the UK it is £2m) As a US citizen you are still going to be taxed on worldwide income and any investments considered to be a PFIC is going to be punitively taxed by the IRS.

 

[explanade]

Amazing on how many folks are considering leaving the US. We have 3 affluent neighbors that are waiting till 2024 to make the final decision, probably using the Golden Citizenship route. We have secured an EU country citizenship in case we decide to go too. After the UK left the EU my British passport by Birth became virtually useless for us as we do not want to live there. Mainly because of the weather. We have no family ties anywhere, just need good healthcare options as we get older.

How did you acquire citizenship without living there already and without birthright?

 

[ShokWaveRider]

How did you acquire citizenship without living there already and without birthright?

My Mother was born there (Citizenship by Descent). That is how I got mine. DW will get hers by being married to a citizen.

 

[Alan]

How did you acquire citizenship without living there already and without birthright?

Various ways are possible including being born there before 1/1/1983

https://www.gov.uk/check-british-citizenship

Overview
If you or your parents were born in the UK, you might automatically be a British citizen.

Check if you’re a British citizen based on whether you were:

born in the UK or a British colony before 1 January 1983
born in the UK between 1 January 1983 and 1 October 2000
born in the UK between 2 October 2000 and 29 April 2006
born in the UK between 30 April 2006 and 30 June 2021
born in the UK from 1 July 2021 onwards
born outside the UK or are stateless
If you’re not a British citizen automatically, you may still be able to apply to become a British citizen.
.
.
.
.
You were born outside the UK
British citizenship is normally automatically passed down one generation to children born outside the UK.

For example, you might automatically become a citizen if you’re born outside the UK to a British parent. But your children will not automatically be citizens if they’re born outside the UK.

 

[explanade]

British colony?

They must mean former colony since Britain freed them a long time ago?

Looks like the Commonwealth citizens all are easily able to get work visas in other Commonwealth countries?

 

[Alan]

British colony?

They must mean former colony since Britain freed them a long time ago?

Looks like the Commonwealth citizens all are easily able to get work visas in other Commonwealth countries?

There are still people alive today who were born in a British colony. India for example gained independence in 1947.

Hong Kong was a colony until 1997.

 

[Aerides]

Falklands and several Caribbean island nations still are I think, though they don't call them colonies any more officially.

 

[Markola]

And even going the "Golden Citizenship" route requires a significant investment in the country you are moving to. (For the UK it is £2m) As a US citizen you are still going to be taxed on worldwide income and any investments considered to be a PFIC is going to be punitively taxed by the IRS.

I have an American friend who lives in Australia and he says he at least gets to deduct his Australian taxes from his US returns. Americans who choose to live abroad are still hosed, compared to citizens of other countries though.

 

[braumeister]

Falklands and several Caribbean island nations still are I think, though they don't call them colonies any more officially.

Good point. From Wikipedia:

All British colonies, whether Crown (such as Hong Kong and the Falkland Islands) or self-governing (such as Bermuda), were renamed "British Dependent Territories" from 1 January 1983 under the British Nationality Act 1981.

Many British citizens in the colonies (with the exceptions of the Falkland Islanders and subsequently the Gibraltarians) found that their "Citizenship of the United Kingdom and Colonies" had changed overnight to British Dependent Territories Citizenship, a form of British citizenship that stripped them of some of their rights, including the right to reside and work in the United Kingdom.

From 2002 the colonies have been known officially as British Overseas Territories.

 

[Alan]

I have an American friend who lives in Australia and he says he at least gets to deduct his Australian taxes from his US returns. Americans who choose to live abroad are still hosed, compared to citizens of other countries though.

I do the same each year, deducting taxes I pay to the UK. A very common thing to do here is have an ISA (Individual Savings Account) which is a funded by after-tax money (like a Roth) and grows tax free, and withdrawals are tax free. Max amount you can contribute is £20k/year. However the IRS does not recognize the tax-free wrapper at all and all interest is taxed in a cash only ISA plus if you invest in stock and bond funds within the ISA then the IRS treats them as PFICs and taxes them punitively.

Vanguard.co.uk is the company with the lowest fees and similar range of funds to invest in, just like Vanguard.com, but US Citizens are not even allowed to be a customer.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

We have not found a country that we could not move to and live there, at least not one that we would consider. I have done a lot of research on the subject that led me to secure an EU country citizenship after my UK passport was not considered EU anymore.

What I found was, even without an EU Citizenship, it was not difficult even if one was not a gazillionaire.

Having and income on $5k - $8k a month from SS, Annuities, Pensions, RMDs etc. pretty much got you residency anywhere one would want to go and be. Some require even less regular income.

Having $1m - $2m - $3m in liquid Net worth would also do the trick.

A lot if us here fit this bill. I have 4 Citizenships and DW has 2, she is applying for an EU citizenship as I type based on being married to me for 35 years, a no brainer.

Getting Healthcare after 65 could be a challenge, but HC is so much cheaper overseas. Many people get basic coverage and keep Medicare in case the sh$t hits the fan.

We have considered, Mexico, Spain, Portugal, France (South), Colombia and others, but DW is a little skeptical, she wants to see what happens in 2024, me I am game for anywhere that has good weather and a relatively stable government, which is a big ask these days.

I should say we have no family ties anywhere other than Canada and it is simply too damn cold there for me.

 

[explanade]

Is it that you have income or assets or that you have to invest x amount in these countries, the so-called Golden Visas, to get either long-term residency or citizenship?

As previously discussed in this thread, it's one thing to buy a $500k condo in Spain, Portugal or Malta to get the Golden Visa but then you have to wonder if they will try to tax your wealth.

 

[Alan]

Is it that you have income or assets or that you have to invest x amount in these countries, the so-called Golden Visas, to get either long-term residency or citizenship?

As previously discussed in this thread, it's one thing to buy a $500k condo in Spain, Portugal or Malta to get the Golden Visa but then you have to wonder if they will try to tax your wealth.

I think you would have to look at it country by country. Investing only in property does not get you a “golden visa” in the UK for example, and as you point out, some countries have wealth taxes to watch out for.

https://visaguide.world/golden-visa/uk-tier-1-investor-visa/

The Tier 1 (Investment) Visa is the UK’s version of the Golden Visa, in the sense that it offers residency to individuals who make substantial investments in the British economy. However, the minimum qualifying investment for a Tier 1 visa is higher – starting from £2 million – and investment in real estate (i.e. buying a house) does not qualify.

 

[oiseux]

Is it that you have income or assets or that you have to invest x amount in these countries, the so-called Golden Visas, to get either long-term residency or citizenship?

As previously discussed in this thread, it's one thing to buy a $500k condo in Spain, Portugal or Malta to get the Golden Visa but then you have to wonder if they will try to tax your wealth.

As I'm sure is covered earlier in the thread, it is worth noting that a number of countries, including those offering Golden Visas, have other programs that do not require an investment. They are called inactive or nonlucrative visas, or as the thread is named, retirement visas. Typically they require sufficient income (or funds to live on), housing (rental or purchase), health care (or bridge to national care) and a promise not to seek work. There are renewable and then lead to residency, and eventually, a path to citizenship. These include Portugal, Spain, France, Greece and Italy (and more).

 

[GreenEggs]

Panama's retirement visa, called the Pensionado Visa, is super easy and affordable. To get the pernsionado Visa you'll need to prove $1000 a month in lifetime income for one person or $1250 a month for a couple. It cost less than $1500 to get the Visa and it is good forever. The Pensionado Visa also entitles you to these perks:

• 50% off on recreation and entertainment such as movies, theaters, sports, etc.
• 50% off hotels Monday through Thursday (30% off on weekends)
• 50% off passports
• 30% off public transportation like buses, trains, and boats
• 25% off airfare
• 25% off restaurants (15% off fast food)
• 25% off electrical, telephone, and water service
• 20% off doctors and specialists
• 20% off prosthetics and other personal assistance devices
• 15% off hospitals and private clinics
• 15% off dental and optometry services
• 10% off prescription medications
• tax-free importation of household goods, up to $10,000
• tax-free importation of a vehicle, or tax-free purchase of a local vehicle

That's an amazing list of perks for retiring in Panama. We visited a few months ago and really enjoyed it. If I only had a pension...

 

[jim584672]

And even going the "Golden Citizenship" route requires a significant investment in the country you are moving to. (For the UK it is £2m) As a US citizen you are still going to be taxed on worldwide income and any investments considered to be a PFIC is going to be punitively taxed by the IRS.

The UK got rid of the £2m pathway years ago.

Strange nationality law in the UK. First gen births to British fathers have always been automatically British at birth. Decent nationality by the mother wasn't a thing. They realized this was wrong and births to British mothers pre 1983 can apply for citizenship by Registration, post 1983 births are now automatically British at birth.

 

[oiseux]

New Long Term Visa Types for Thailand

FYI, I don't know if this has been posted yet, but Thailand has announced a slew of new long term visas, and has cut the fees. The gotcha is they are limited to 10 years.

They is a "golden" type path but also just an income qualification

Retirees
Over 50, income of 80K
OR, over 40K income and investment of 250K

Remote workers
Income over 80K, five years of work experience, for a public traded company or a private company of a certain size (>150M the past 3 years).
OR over 40K income and advanced degree or IP or be receiving Series A funding of over $1M.

There are also an investment type available.

Health insurance (50K) or sufficient resources are required. In and out privileges. Can apply for a work permit.

https://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand-visa/thailand-long-term-resident-ltr-visa


Second link to the Board of INvestment --- applications open on 9/1/22

https://www.boi.go.th/upload/content/LTR.pdf

 

[tenant13]

This thread has 20 pages now so it's possible the link I'm posting is buried somewhere in the middle but for whoever is interested:

https://www.businessinsider.com/cou...ident-status-golden-visa-list-portugal-2022-8

 

[ShokWaveRider]

After the UK left the EU, I got my Maltese Citizenship by Maternal History. We are now applying for my DW based on my Citizenship and then we will have no issues visiting for long periods or living in an EU country. We still have to go to the Maltese Consulate in DC to finalize it for her. We are planning a trip for later this year to do so.

Although the EU is becoming less enticing with all the current issues, water issues etc. Even Portugal has its own issues. Malta itself is way too crowded, I think it may even be the most densely populated country in the Region or even maybe the world.

 

[braumeister]

This thread has 20 pages now so it's possible the link I'm posting is buried somewhere in the middle

Good point. This was always a thread looking for a list, so the title should have been changed long ago. Now it has been.

 

[Alan]

This thread has 20 pages now so it's possible the link I'm posting is buried somewhere in the middle but for whoever is interested:

https://www.businessinsider.com/cou...ident-status-golden-visa-list-portugal-2022-8

FYI

These are 20 countries that offer 'golden visas' to wealthy immigrants — with costs ranging from $19,000 in Thailand to $2.5 million in Australia

 

[explanade]

After the UK left the EU, I got my Maltese Citizenship by Maternal History. We are now applying for my DW based on my Citizenship and then we will have no issues visiting for long periods or living in an EU country. We still have to go to the Maltese Consulate in DC to finalize it for her. We are planning a trip for later this year to do so.

Although the EU is becoming less enticing with all the current issues, water issues etc. Even Portugal has its own issues. Malta itself is way too crowded, I think it may even be the most densely populated country in the Region or even maybe the world.

Yet doesn't Malta aggressively offer Golden Visas and also digital nomad visas?

Fuel and electricity must be expensive though they get a lot of sun so solar should be widely used.

Where do they get potable water? Island must be too small for water sheds, reservoirs. No snowpack either.