What is your free time worth?

[W2R]

For those of you already FIRED, think back to the last few months before you retired. Knowing what you know now, would you:

1. Accept a part time job with your employer continuing doing something you like 2 days a week for 48 wks per year - 1 day per week from home and 1 with 30 min commute to an office, at a pay rate starting approx 10% more than your rate when you retired, 401k but no other benefits. And do this under contract for 2-3 years?

Or,

2. Not accept the part time gig because 2 days a week of free time is worth more to you than the $ you would receive under scenario 1?

This is the decision i'm facing, and i'd like opinions from others- especially those that have been retired awhile. Another issue is that I still have 80k of company stock that the company would buy in 2012 if I agree to stay on part time. If I don't agree to the part time contract, I don't know when or to whom I would sell the stock.

Soon after I made my specific retirement intentions public, the topic of potential part time consulting after I retired came up during some serious talks with my supervisor. It also came up in casual discussions with middle management not in my chain of command, that were feeling me out for possible consulting work.

With a straight face and eye contact, I politely but firmly told my supervisor and the other middle management folks that my entire agency didn't have enough money to afford what I would cost.

That is still true! If anything, my desire to work has decreased even farther since the months before retirement. Possibly this is because I have found that my expenses in retirement are lower than I had planned for.

YMMV, but to me this video comes to mind when reading your post.

Johnny Paycheck - Take This Job and Shove It - YouTube

 

[Moemg]

I did return for an additional year after retirement .The pay was good but it just reinforced my decision to fully retire as soon as the year was up .Once You get a taste of freedom it is hard to return to the workaday world.

 

[pb4uski]

....The problem with my billing rate to govt agencies is that it is a set pct of my earnings, and any increase exceeding their allowable limit is denied. So I'd have to figure out a workaround.....

I guess the question becomes whether it is worthwhile for you to work for the rate that they will allow. Is there flexibility in the expenses that you can charge given the rules that they have in place that could be utilized to help the situation? If all you can charge for expenses are your direct, incremental costs then that is a wash and there isn't much more you can do.

 

[Animorph]

I worked a little 1/2 time for a few months at a time the first few years after I retired. I enjoyed the work and didn't resent the time spent too much. I think that would be different now, a couple of years later. I'd do it now, while you can.

One thing I think makes it work is having your DW still working. That makes the time more your own and lessens the impact on travel constraints due to your 48 month schedule, since she is already restricted. I'm sure she would appreciate the contribution.

 

[audreyh1]

A good point about the spouse working. I told my husband that if I retired, he needed to shut down his part-time consulting business as well, otherwise we wouldn't have the flexibility to travel together that we really wanted. If he had wanted to keep his business going, I might have waited to retire.

 

[Ronstar]

.....I do credit my 7 years of part-time work as enabling me to keep working long enough for the company stock to grow while establishing a personal life. Working part-time did not prevent a burnout but it did slow its pace so I could stick around to get to my ER.

Wow Scrabbler1 - a 7 year transition is a long time, but you did it incrementally over time and it worked. And a stock increase as well- I never considered a longer transition to let me stock value rise - maybe I shouldn't be so focused on selling my stock

It depends on your age and how financially prepared you are for FIRE.

If you're young and your FIRE stash is marginal, by all means stay on part time for a while.

If you're older (I didn't FIRE until 58) and your FIRE stash is very conservative (belt + suspenders + padded budget), don't tie yourself down. In this case, the grains of sand running through the hour glass are much, much more important than a few more bux you'll likely not spend anyway......

I'm 57, DW 58. FIRE stash is enough and DW gets a pension when she retires in 2013. I'm starting to heed the "sands of time" idea.

....If anything, my desire to work has decreased even farther since the months before retirement. Possibly this is because I have found that my expenses in retirement are lower than I had planned for.

YMMV, but to me this video comes to mind when reading your post.

Johnny Paycheck - Take This Job and Shove It - YouTube

Good to know that you were approached to stay on but refused. And that you spend less than you expected. Thanks for the great Video- I'll forward it to my boss.

I did return for an additional year after retirement .The pay was good but it just reinforced my decision to fully retire as soon as the year was up .Once You get a taste of freedom it is hard to return to the workaday world.

I know the taste of freedom thing - I worked about 3 days a week during 2010 and 2011, but now I'm back to 5 because of workload, and it has not been easy.

I guess the question becomes whether it is worthwhile for you to work for the rate that they will allow. Is there flexibility in the expenses that you can charge given the rules that they have in place that could be utilized to help the situation? If all you can charge for expenses are your direct, incremental costs then that is a wash and there isn't much more you can do.

I may be able to charge my time at the company principal rate instead of my project mgr rate, especially with the reduced hours. But then I'd have to find a project mgr. it's worth looking into.

.....One thing I think makes it work is having your DW still working. That makes the time more your own and lessens the impact on travel constraints due to your 48 month schedule, since she is already restricted. I'm sure she would appreciate the contribution.

She would appreciate the contribution- right up to the day that she quits and wants to travel, etc.

A good point about the spouse working. I told my husband that if I retired, he needed to shut down his part-time consulting business as well, otherwise we wouldn't have the flexibility to travel together that we really wanted. If he had wanted to keep his business going, I might have waited to retire.

That's the way I see it- it seems to work better when spouses retire at roughly the same time. One of my friends retired last year, but his DW is planning to work for several more years. It's causing some strain in their relationship.

 

[Nords]

Soon after I made my specific retirement intentions public, the topic of potential part time consulting after I retired came up during some serious talks with my supervisor. It also came up in casual discussions with middle management not in my chain of command, that were feeling me out for possible consulting work.
With a straight face and eye contact, I politely but firmly told my supervisor and the other middle management folks that my entire agency didn't have enough money to afford what I would cost.

When I put in my retirement request, my XO called me to "check on a few details".

During the conversation he mentioned that BUPERS had been persuading Congress to approve an occasional waiver for O-4s to stay a few months beyond their 20 years in "critical billets" to allow for continuity. Since my billet supervised the training of nuclear submariners, it was judged to be critical. He offered to submit the waiver paperwork. He probably thought he was doing me a favor because I was being "forced" into retirement during my prime earning years.

He caught me by surprise, and I couldn't help myself. I burst into laughter just thinking about the scene of going home to announce "Hey, honey, guess what! I'll be working for another six months!!"

He felt that I thought he was joking, and he was a tad miffed. But at least he gleaned my true sentiments on the subject...

My "relief" didn't show up for over six months after I left.

 

[FUEGO]

I think I would be tempted to choose the 2 days a week option. But maybe ask for more than 10% over my full time rate to compensate for loss of vacation days, sick days, holidays, etc. And work out that they pay for professional development time for licensure, and paid time to complete it.

This would allow a smooth transition to ER and if you find you get bored on your 5 day weekends, you could probably renegotiate more hours or reinstatement to your old gig. As long as the work is there.

 

[Ronstar]

I think I would be tempted to choose the 2 days a week option. But maybe ask for more than 10% over my full time rate to compensate for loss of vacation days, sick days, holidays, etc. And work out that they pay for professional development time for licensure, and paid time to complete it.

This would allow a smooth transition to ER and if you find you get bored on your 5 day weekends, you could probably renegotiate more hours or reinstatement to your old gig. As long as the work is there.

I sent an email to the boss yesterday stating my terms for 2 days a week, 1 year, roughly 15% increase, 401k, stock buyout, and duties. And I had license fees and pay for req'd continuing education in there. We're meeting Weds.

 

[Rambler]

I think if my DW was still at the grindstone, I wouldn't mind putting in a couple more years with 1 day in the office, and another day's worth equivalent of being on call. But, she has been a SAHM/SAHW for the past 20+ years, and now it is my turn to pull the plug.

BTW, I would not at all mind an occasional consulting, advisory, or board role, for a week or two at a time, once or twice a quarter, but with DW out of the workforce, I'm not too keen on being tethered to a job with a weekly schedule.

Good luck with the decision.

R

 

[martyp]

I've been ER'd for about 2 yrs now. I would not go back, even part time. You really need to know how comfortable you are about being active and happy in retirement. I have a friend who retired who then went back 1/2 time but worked full time (at 1/2 pay) because he didn't know what to do with his time. He is now fully retired but bored. However, transitioning to retirement with part time work is common option for many people.

 

[Lazarus]

Dilbert on Part Time.
Dilbert comic strip for 08/24/2000 from the official Dilbert comic strips archive.

 

[Ronstar]

I think if my DW was still at the grindstone, I wouldn't mind putting in a couple more years with 1 day in the office, and another day's worth equivalent of being on call. But, she has been a SAHM/SAHW for the past 20+ years, and now it is my turn to pull the plug.

BTW, I would not at all mind an occasional consulting, advisory, or board role, for a week or two at a time, once or twice a quarter, but with DW out of the workforce, I'm not too keen on being tethered to a job with a weekly schedule.

Good luck with the decision.

R

Thanks Rambler - part of reason I'm considering this is that DW will be working long into 2013. So I can wrap things up though a 1 year gig at 2 days a week, and finish up a little after she retires.

I've been ER'd for about 2 yrs now. I would not go back, even part time. You really need to know how comfortable you are about being active and happy in retirement. I have a friend who retired who then went back 1/2 time but worked full time (at 1/2 pay) because he didn't know what to do with his time. He is now fully retired but bored. However, transitioning to retirement with part time work is common option for many people.

Dilbert on Part Time.
Dilbert comic strip for 08/24/2000 from the official Dilbert comic strips archive.

I won't be doing the full time work at 1/2 pay deal - I have more than enough hobbies to keep me busy, and I think I have my replacement lined up.

Met with the 2nd in command today - looks like we may have a deal on the 2 day a week gig for 1 year, beginning April 1 when my current contract expires. 2 days a week in the office if I'm in Illinois, but 2 days a week remote if I'm out of state.

 

[Chuckanut]

For me it goes beyond the dollar cost per hour. The cost of my time also includes flexibility. Next week I will spend 3 days at a mountain cabin thanks to a friend, and the fact that I have no commitments that keep me from accepting his generous offer.

 

[Ronstar]

For me it goes beyond the dollar cost per hour. The cost of my time also includes flexibility. Next week I will spend 3 days at a mountain cabin thanks to a friend, and the fact that I have no commitments that keep me from accepting his generous offer.

I'm like you - flexibility is the key. I gave a list of my priorities. 1 was term length, 2 flexibility, 3 benefits, 4 pay, 5 stock buyout and 6 duties. Once I got the 1 year term, and the flexibility to work remotely if I'm out of state, then the rest fell into place.

 

[Mulligan]

I think I would be tempted to choose the 2 days a week option. But maybe ask for more than 10% over my full time rate to compensate for loss of vacation days, sick days, holidays, etc. And work out that they pay for professional development time for licensure, and paid time to complete it.

This would allow a smooth transition to ER and if you find you get bored on your 5 day weekends, you could probably renegotiate more hours or reinstatement to your old gig. As long as the work is there.

I have held part time jobs the past 3 years ( with summers off). First 2 years was 3 hours a day, 5 days a week. This year it's 5 hours a day, 3 days a week. I much prefer the bunching of hours in 3 days instead of 5. Two days would be even better in my mind.

 

[deserat]

..........
This part-time offer seems like such a good deal now, but the terms won't last on either side of the negotiating surface. Your employer will start making subtle (or not-so-subtle) additional demands like a "special meeting" during your time off, or staying a little later to finish a team project, or expecting you to support the culture with your participation in "mandatory" training/social events. If you're getting a 401(k) then I don't think you can plead that you're "just a contractor", and there's still the whole unsavory hostage factor of the $80K.

You'll change too. Two days per week doesn't seem so bad now from your current 5+ days/week perspective, and heck-- it's just a few years. Easy money! But after a few months your part-time working lifestyle will start interfering with your full-time retiree lifestyle. You'll resent having to show up for the two days you've agreed to, let alone the extra requests. You'll have absolutely no patience for the usual workplace BS or the rush-hour commute that you're tolerating now, let alone for anything "extra" that someone thinks up over the next few years.

I suspect that about eight months into it you'll find yourself having a family conversation along the lines of "WTF am I doing this?!? It's only $80K, and we don't need the money..."

+100000 - my husband is living it now.....it's even worse than when he was on active duty...and it's not necessary...be very careful of being manipulated regarding "duty" or anything like that. You've already shown you are capable and successful and willing to do what it takes -people can prey on that. I like the quote by Heinlein (did someone already post that here earlier?):

Do not confuse "duty" with what other people expect of you; they are utterly different. Duty is a debt you owe to yourself to fulfill obligations you have assumed voluntarily. Paying that debt can entail anything from years of patient work to instant willingness to die. Difficult it may be, but the reward is self-respect. But there is no reward at all for doing what other people expect of you, and to do so is not merely difficult, but impossible. It is easier to deal with a footpad than it is with the leech who wants "just a few minutes of your time, please — this won't take long." Time is your total capital, and the minutes of your life are painfully few. If you allow yourself to fall into the vice of agreeing to such requests, they quickly snowball to the point where these parasites will use up 100 percent of your time — and squawk for more! So learn to say No — and to be rude about it when necessary. Otherwise you will not have time to carry out your duty, or to do your own work, and certainly no time for love and happiness. The termites will nibble away your life and leave none of it for you.

Heinlein

 

[obgyn65]

I am not FIRE'd yet, but if I were, I would choose option 1. Do you like what you do, does this job keep you challenged ?

1. Accept a part time job with your employer continuing doing something you like 2 days a week for 48 wks per year - 1 day per week from home and 1 with 30 min commute to an office, at a pay rate starting approx 10% more than your rate when you retired, 401k but no other benefits. And do this under contract for 2-3 years?

 

[HFWR]

At this point in my life, I'd rather front load any w*rk commitments. I was off for several months after being "right-sized" about five years ago, and it was damned hard to go back. When I finally get to stop for good, I don't want to ever go back...

 

[rescueme]

"What is your free time worth?"

Much more than my former employer (with close to 30 years of service) was willing to pay.

That's why I retired ...

Didn't want any part time j*b after I left. Regardless of the hours, a j*b is still a j*b, with required hours and expectation of results.

No thanks.

Life (retirement) is great...

 

[Ronstar]

I am not FIRE'd yet, but if I were, I would choose option 1. Do you like what you do, does this job keep you challenged ?

Yes I like what I do. I'm in the middle of some challenging roadway projects that will last past 2017. But there is no way that I'll stay that long. Today we finished the paperwork for a 1 year contract at 2 days per week. It should work fine as long as I can mentally ignore work for the other 5 days.