Wine - Discussion, Travel & More

[COcheesehead]

Let’s start a new thread on all things wine. Wine related travel, destinations, wines that are good values, best places to procure wines.

Share a little about your own wine journey.

For my wife and I our love of wine started with travel. We were casual wine drinkers and as we traveled more to Italy, France, Portugal, California, etc we were slowly introduced to better wines, how they fit local cuisine and what terroir really is - the uniqueness of origin.

When we retired we found ourselves next to a smallish wine region with about 36 wineries. I have now worked part time for the last four seasons at one of them. Learning production, farming and sales. It’s the best j*b I have ever had.

 

[pacergal]

Thank you for starting this. I am not a wine drinker and I think it is because I don't know much about wine or any good ones.
My folks served a very tasty one at their 50th anniversary, but I don't know anything except it was a merlot.

Thanks for starting this thread, I hope to learn from all of you!

 

[COcheesehead]

There are a number of resources online that can help with finding good wines. The one I use a lot is https://www.cellartracker.com/
It’s all crowd sourced reviews on thousands of wines.

 

[Sojourner]

Ooh, great idea @COcheesehead! DW and I are really into wine and have done lots of "wine tourism" vacationing over the years. We've spent lots of time in the Napa and Sonoma regions of California and have also visited Spain and France. For us, it doesn't get much better than a good bottle of Rioja Reserva or a rich, full-bodied Aglianico.


My wine journey started in earnest about 15 years ago when I joined an online "flash deal" site that could ship interesting wines directly to my doorstep. I started trying wines from all sorts of different regions and different styles/grapes/blends, eventually figuring out that I loved crisp, unoaked whites (e.g. Sauvignon Blanc) and bold, full-bodied, oaky reds.


I recently discovered the r/wine subreddit and have found it to be an interesting way to get ideas about anything and everything "vino". Looking forward to what folks around here have to say about one of life's greatest pleasures. ��

 

[audreyh1]

We’ve often visited wine regions when traveling, especially in Europe. Long ago we drank a lot of Central Spain and Northern Italy red wines finding them relatively easy to understand and select. French wines were always a mystery to us so we made sure to visit wine regions whenever we traveled in France, doing some mini-van tours. Now we know the wines where we have visited at least, and can choose with confidence. Last region was Bordeaux and we went on a couple of tours (left bank, right bank).

Our motorhome was built in Yakima WA and we spent a few years exploring the Columbia/Yakima River Valley area wines.

Have a EuroCave that is always overflowing.

Our local Costco carries a good European wine selection that has fairly rapid turnover. We find lots of great buys there. Thus the overflowing EuroCave.

We drink our wine with meals, and usually less than a full serving. We like it best with food.

 

[COcheesehead]

Wine labels themselves can be confusing. Here are a few pointers to help decipher wine labels. Sort of in order of what can help determine quality.

1. Does it list a vintage. If not, it could be a blend of multiple years. Not a bad thing, but generally not associated with better wines.
2. Does it list a region like Napa or does it just say California. The broader the source, the more likely it’s bulk wine.
3. Does it list a varietal or does it say table wine. There are some good proprietary blends or appellation control regions like Bordeaux, Chianti or Rhône as well that strictly govern production.
4. Does it show an AVA like Santa Barbara, Ballard Canyon or does it just say Santa Barbara County. The more precise the description, the more likely the wine will be unique. Some will go to the level of listing the vineyard or even the part of the vineyard like Santa Barbara, Bien Nacido vineyard, X block.

Hope this helps.

 

[Trailwalker]

My DW's journey started as a UC-Berkeley graduate student and trips to Napa, Sonoma, and surrounding counties back in the days when tasting was free. By the time I moved to the East Bay in my early 20's, she was already recognized by the wine pourers during my first trips to the area.

We take the opportunity to taste during our travels whenever the opportunity arises and have learned to try to find the best wines that each vineyard offers. Sometimes, that's a challenge in the Midwest. We live relatively close to an award-winning winery in Wisconsin, enjoy their outdoor space, and buy a case of Eagle White from Wollersheim every year.

Reds are our favorites. I'm partial to Zinfandel and Chianti, but we like a wide variety of wines. Our favorite way to procure wine is via Garagiste. Google it, and you will find their site and a NY Times article about their founder. I try to stay with value wines under $20 and often try their Mystery Wines. We get a case or two each spring or fall during shipping season.

 

[audreyh1]

Thank you for starting this. I am not a wine drinker and I think it is because I don't know much about wine or any good ones.
My folks served a very tasty one at their 50th anniversary, but I don't know anything except it was a merlot.

Thanks for starting this thread, I hope to learn from all of you!

Wine tastings, especially at wineries, is a good way to discover what you like. To visit several in a day I recommend a small group guided tour where someone else is driving. A good guide can answer lots of questions and make suggestions.

 

[OldShooter]

For learning, I would suggest seeking out a very small wine store with a knowledgeable staff.

We are very fortunate to have a one-man wine shop where the owner specializes in buying discounted closeouts and small lots from local wholesalers. The whole store is maybe 600 sf with decorating emphasizing exposed pipes on the ceiling, plain concrete for the floor and unfinished wooden shelves. None of the wines displayed have price tags. The way it works is you come in and tell Dave what you like and what your price range is. He then runs around picking bottles to suggest. If you don't know the grapes and the lingo, you just tell him what tastes you like and maybe some wind labels that you have liked. This is an ongoing process, honing in on your evolving taste. For me, I walk in and am greeted by name and ask for "the usual," which is a case of $10-15 reds with strong tannins and big flavors. No pinot noir, for example. Limited grenache and zin. The wines turn over fairly quickly, so if I find something in a mixed case that I particularly like, I email Dave immediately to hold a case for me. About half the time, the wine is already sold out, but I still end up with some favorite wines at good prices.

Dave runs free tastings on Friday evenings two or three times a month, sometimes with a guest winmaker/featured vineyard.

Dave is a rarity, I know, but the closer you can come to finding your own Dave, the more you will learn and the less you will spend. Good luck!

 

[swakyaby]

My wine explorations began with viewing the 2008 movie Bottle Shock, about how underrated California wines were until the 1976 Paris blind tasting judgement. I began tasting various wines after that.

 

[JackJester]

I'd like to hear about smaller town wine regions to visit. Basically the hidden gems ... good red wines, smaller crowds, good food. We are lucky to live in WA state with great wineries in the Columbia Valley. But our favorite place to visit is Walla Walla. Population around 34K with a moderate climate. Nice older downtown with good restaurants and views to the Blue Mountains. We avoid Woodinville (suburb of Seattle) with its Columbia Valley satellite tasting rooms (large crowds). We have been to Sonoma and Napa and probably will never return there. Waaay too busy and overpriced. OTOH, we enjoyed a stay in Murphys CA in Calaveras County. Not too busy and a much smaller town of 2K east of Sacramento. Had some great Zins IIRC. Our friends have recommended Paso Robles (population 32K). That's on our to do list. Finally, we have heard some good things about the wines coming out of Southern AZ (Wlicox and Sonoita) and plan to visit next spring. We are mostly red wine drinkers and club members at 5 wineries in WA and OR. Now that we have FIREd, Portugal and Spain are on our bucket list for international wine and food experiences.

 

[explanade]

I'm not a wine enthusiast at all but I enjoy the occasional wine. I'll take champagne on flights but don't buy it myself.

My first trip to a wine region was to Reims and Epernay. Was 30 years ago, wasn't even my idea, was convinced to do it and grateful that I went.

Even back then the big maisons de champagne had good free tours, with guides struggling a bit with English to explain.

Been to Chianti and meaning to go to Bordeaux, one of these days.

Never visited Napa, even though I'm two hours away. There are also some wine houses about an hour away to the south of the Bay Area, though they're less renowned.

Basically the appeal is more for how photogenic these vineyards are.

A couple of years ago, I went to Lavaux, about 30-60 minutes out of Geneva, on the eastern side of Lake Geneva.

Very scenic with terraced vineyards going down to the lake. The wine there isn't exported much but the prices are very high. I went for the views though, not tastings.

Same thing with some vineyards over Cinque Terre. Very steep vineyards and it all has to be harvested by hand but they call it heroic viticulture, though they have even more stunning views over the water and hills than Lavaux. I don't think wine there is exported much either.

But they have a little mechanical monorail system to move the harvested grapes from the vineyards to the wineries. The monorails are mechanical, not powered.

Lavaux also has monorails but I think their system is motorized.

 

[explanade]

My wine explorations began with viewing the 2008 movie Bottle Shock, about how underrated California wines were until the 1976 Paris blind tasting judgement. I began tasting various wines after that.

Saw a movie called Mundo Vino, about a French wine consultant who goes around the world -- all the way down to the southern part of South America -- and basically teaches them the French wine way.

While he's raised standards, they criticize him for making wines from different regions homogenized.

Then they show the Mondavis from CA going to Europe and buying old wineries in France and even Tuscany, getting access to some of the most prestigious vineyards in the world but they can just outspend anyone. Their crappy boxed wines made them so much money that they can buy prestige.

 

[audreyh1]

The French drink boxed wines at home. It’s not looked down on.

 

[explanade]

Oh I'm sure Mondavi made a lot of money exporting cheap wines to Europe too.

I see that they sell "premium" boxed wine, not just Mondavi but other vintners.

OK, if you're paying premium prices, why would you pay for boxes instead of bottles?

 

[audreyh1]

Oh I'm sure Mondavi made a lot of money exporting cheap wines to Europe too.

I see that they sell "premium" boxed wine, not just Mondavi but other vintners.

OK, if you're paying premium prices, why would you pay for boxes instead of bottles?

France also produces boxed wines.

Boxed wines are popular at home in France because apparently they stay fresh longer once opened. 3L instead of 750ml so there must be some cost savings.

 

[freedom2022]

My wine "journey" started when I responded to my former boss that all wines tasted the same to me. He said that you have to learn. Since then, I know about cabernet sauvignon, pinot noir, chardonnay, Bordeaux, burgundy, etc.

As I typed this post, I am seeping NZ Marlborough's Burgundy style Pinot noir.
I hope one glass a day will not kill me.

 

[oiseux]

We are located in Northern California, within easy reach of numerous wine regions, so it really permeates the local cultures (a former neighbor was a sommelier, another a restaurant owner with an extensive cellar). We have extensively visited Europe (we have a place in France and have lived in Switzerland and England), and have visited many great (and lesser known regions) in France, Italy, Spain and Portugal (and Greece and Switzerland). Plus we've been wine tasting in New Zealand and Australia.

When you travel these regions (including California) you can often find great wines on the moderately priced restaurant menus, often good values from local producers and offered by the glass. I find high end restaurants tend to stock and feature big names (although parings on a prix fixe menu are well thought out). Last fall we were in Chateauneuf-du-Pape and had a great CdP at a local bistrot -- found it back home at wine.com and bought a bunch and gifted a bunch away. Done similar things many times.

We also belong to wine clubs at some favorite wineries. We also like to go to co-operative tasting rooms, where you can taste wines from multiple vintners --- these are more common in Europe but exist in California as well. We also have some decent wine bars, with plenty of nice flights and by the glass options. We've gone to a few tasting events at local restaurants -- with guest vintners, and tasting seminars and fairs.

 

[W2R]

Wine - Discussion

I used to drink wine now and then when I was in my teens. The taste is fine (but then so is the taste of diet Coke, IMO, love that stuff!). I don't like the way that alcoholic beverages fog up my thinking and consciousness, though, not one bit. So I cut back to almost none back in the 1970's, and haven't had even a sip for the past 20 years.

This is just a matter of personal choice. For the same reasons, I don't take recreational drugs - - anything clouding my consciousness is taking the fun out of daily life, for me. YMMV and that is perfectly fine with me! You be you and I'll be me.

Frank is one of those rare guys who doesn't drink either, and never has. How lucky can I be? People sometimes assume that we are reformed alcoholics, or religious zealots, but really we're just a scientist and an engineer who happen to prefer sobriety.

 

[oiseux]

snip

A couple of years ago, I went to Lavaux, about 30-60 minutes out of Geneva, on the eastern side of Lake Geneva.

Very scenic with terraced vineyards going down to the lake. The wine there isn't exported much but the prices are very high. I went for the views though, not tastings.

I lived on that side of the lake for a couple of years. There are less expensive vineyards --- under 15CHF --- and the owners are quite nice. It is not my favorite but pairs great with the typical Swiss dishes. A small portion does get exported, and you can sometimes find it at K&L and other fine wine importers. The views are wonderful and walking in the vineyards are great.

I'd like to hear about smaller town wine regions to visit. Basically the hidden gems ... good red wines, smaller crowds, good food. We are lucky to live in WA state with great wineries in the Columbia Valley. But our favorite place to visit is Walla Walla. Population around 34K with a moderate climate. Nice older downtown with good restaurants and views to the Blue Mountains. We avoid Woodinville (suburb of Seattle) with its Columbia Valley satellite tasting rooms (large crowds). We have been to Sonoma and Napa and probably will never return there. Waaay too busy and overpriced. OTOH, we enjoyed a stay in Murphys CA in Calaveras County. Not too busy and a much smaller town of 2K east of Sacramento. Had some great Zins IIRC. Our friends have recommended Paso Robles (population 32K). That's on our to do list. Finally, we have heard some good things about the wines coming out of Southern AZ (Wlicox and Sonoita) and plan to visit next spring. We are mostly red wine drinkers and club members at 5 wineries in WA and OR. Now that we have FIREd, Portugal and Spain are on our bucket list for international wine and food experiences.

Napa has become so commercialized and Sonoma has rapidly caught up. Healdsburg and points north used to be lower key but things continue to advance. If you enjoyed Murphys you should head to Plymouth (Shenandoah ValleyAmador County) and into El Dorado County (e.g. Fairplay AVA). The wine is even better than in Murphys/Calavaras as the vintners are more experienced and more established. Also good is the Carmel Valley and for reds, the hotter regions east into the Santa Lucia Highlands and Arroyo Seco.

 

[explanade]

I'd like to hear about smaller town wine regions to visit. Basically the hidden gems ... good red wines, smaller crowds, good food. We are lucky to live in WA state with great wineries in the Columbia Valley. But our favorite place to visit is Walla Walla. Population around 34K with a moderate climate. Nice older downtown with good restaurants and views to the Blue Mountains. We avoid Woodinville (suburb of Seattle) with its Columbia Valley satellite tasting rooms (large crowds). We have been to Sonoma and Napa and probably will never return there. Waaay too busy and overpriced. OTOH, we enjoyed a stay in Murphys CA in Calaveras County. Not too busy and a much smaller town of 2K east of Sacramento. Had some great Zins IIRC. Our friends have recommended Paso Robles (population 32K). That's on our to do list. Finally, we have heard some good things about the wines coming out of Southern AZ (Wlicox and Sonoita) and plan to visit next spring. We are mostly red wine drinkers and club members at 5 wineries in WA and OR. Now that we have FIREd, Portugal and Spain are on our bucket list for international wine and food experiences.

Is there anything out around the Palouse area? The Palouse is on my bucket list and if I were to go out there, it would be nice to have other places to check out.

I guess it's near Spokane and maybe not too much further to Montana.

 

[COcheesehead]

For smaller wine regions central California has some of our favorites. We recently based ourselves in San Luis Opispo which is a little gem in and of itself.
There are some superb wines that come from Santa Ynez, Arroyo Grande, Santa Maria, Edna Valley just to name a few.

 

[JackJester]

If you enjoyed Murphys you should head to Plymouth (Shenandoah ValleyAmador County) and into El Dorado County (e.g. Fairplay AVA). The wine is even better than in Murphys/Calavaras as the vintners are more experienced and more established. Also good is the Carmel Valley and for reds, the hotter regions east into the Santa Lucia Highlands and Arroyo Seco.

Thanks! that's some good info. I need to map out a long road trip for next March/April that takes me to Carmel Valley/Paso Robles and over to Plymouth/San Andreas. Then maybe down through Death Valley on the way to South AZ.

 

[JackJester]

Is there anything out around the Palouse area?

Palouse Falls is worth seeing: https://stateparks.com/palouse_falls_state_park_in_washington.html
Instead of heading up north to Spokane, I'd do a southern loop through Walla Walla and then into Oregon (Pendelton/La Grange/Baker City). Then east across the southern parts of the Eagle Cap mountain range (very scenic), and then up north along the OR/ID border along Hells Canyon Scenic by-way:
https://traveloregon.com/things-to-...XXiRemyx6p304WLS4HEeIqvTEt_dQedkaAuf0EALw_wcB
That is some beautiful country if you haven't been through there.

 

[explanade]

Palouse Falls is worth seeing: https://stateparks.com/palouse_falls_state_park_in_washington.html
Instead of heading up north to Spokane, I'd do a southern loop through Walla Walla and then into Oregon (Pendelton/La Grange/Baker City). Then east across the southern parts of the Eagle Cap mountain range (very scenic), and then up north along the OR/ID border along Hells Canyon Scenic by-way:
https://traveloregon.com/things-to-...XXiRemyx6p304WLS4HEeIqvTEt_dQedkaAuf0EALw_wcB
That is some beautiful country if you haven't been through there.

Thanks for the tip!