Chasing retirement

[rayinpenn]

If your chasing retirement - it is very possible your have goals out of order. Funding retirement and building a 'pile' should be part of your safety net for change and the ultimate stress reducer and nothing more.

God I Hate my job.
I'm 63 and long past the time when the 'pile' was sufficient to retire; I've had more then one friend say why don't you just retire? The answer is I like my work -it is often diverse and challenging; I like the people I work with I find them interesting. I can't understand why anyone would work a job that they dislike for 35 years and live everyday for their retirement. If the job you are doing doesn't stimulate you then find your passion and build an execute an exit strategy. Ah you say that's easy for him say - the thing is I did it. I started my career as an accountant BS, MBA, MS and I worked for a huge company and life and the job was ok but I can't say I had a passion for the work. Thats when I read my first book on programming; it had an immediate impact on my work. I became the go to guy for automation; I took every computer course the company would pay for. I won a $5,000 recognition award for my work. My position changed with time and I'm now I am 'big data' guy. I took my work home gladly because I loved the challenge - if work is just a means to pay the bills - you might be wasting your life.

The pile as a means to deal with change
I've managed to save 20-30% of my salary for nearly 25 years. The Mrs and I both came from very humble beginnings - the truth is I was poorer then a church mouse. We were determined to change all that and quietly without discussing the budget we adopted a LBYM strategy.
1. We bought a small home and paid off the mortgage early.
2. Friday night pizza or Chinese and a $1 movie was our entertainment
3. I was the plumber, carpenter and mason
4. She was the painter, coupon clipper and sale shopper.
5. We bought simply reliable cars kept them for ever.
6. We saved wind falls like tax returns, bonuses etc
7. We kept our vacations modest.
8. We invested our savings.

The result of all this is that we are able to deal with most the curveballs life throws our way without stress. The dentist, tires for the jalopy, the roof, etc. That pile will also serve us in retirement. I never felt I was doing without and I never felt we were chasing a pile or retirement. It was simply incidental to living right and seeking a low stress life.

My unofficial not yet announced date is July I'll be 63. Things are still good at work ...I just think it is time to sit in the sun and toss a lure into the sea.

 

[donheff]

Funding retirement and building a 'pile' should be part of your safety net for change and the ultimate stress reducer and nothing more.

Doesn't make sense to project your job satisfaction and approach to life on everybody else as a should. Some people plan ER from the get go. As they age out they may like work and remain or they may be happy to find that they were right at the outset.

 

[Greencheese]

I'm with Don on this one, a non Spartan ER takes decades to build. Some people find passion in their work while others don't mind it but would rather do something else with their time.

 

[kcowan]

I think the younger you are when you make the transition, the better because you are more adaptable and resilient. I know 2 workmates who worked until 65 at the company that gave me a golden handshake at 49. They both died at 67. Another died of pancreatic cancer at 57.

Why take the chance?

 

[exnavynuke]

I can't think of any "job" someone would pay me to do that I'd be willing to do for free that would come close to affording me the ability to enjoy my life outside of work. If I wouldn't be willing to do it "for free", then it's not what I'd rather be doing imo. "Not detesting" work or finding "some" enjoyment in it doesn't mean it's better than "doing what you'd like to do" (i.e. being financially independent and not having to work at all).

I could go get a job that I'd probably enjoy more than my current job but it would pay probably 1/3rd of what I make now. Of course, "enjoy more" is the positive way of saying "dislike less". I don't "hate" my job but I sure wouldn't keep working it if I won the lottery next week.

There are very few people that can find a job they'd do for the rest of their lives if they had $100 million in the bank. To me, those are the only people who truly are working a job they love. Everyone else (myself included) is just working because they feel they must with varying levels of how much they'd rather be doing something else.

 

[RioIndy]

I can't think of any "job" someone would pay me to do that I'd be willing to do for free that would come close to affording me the ability to enjoy my life outside of work. If I wouldn't be willing to do it "for free", then it's not what I'd rather be doing imo. "Not detesting" work or finding "some" enjoyment in it doesn't mean it's better than "doing what you'd like to do" (i.e. being financially independent and not having to work at all).

I could go get a job that I'd probably enjoy more than my current job but it would pay probably 1/3rd of what I make now. Of course, "enjoy more" is the positive way of saying "dislike less". I don't "hate" my job but I sure wouldn't keep working it if I won the lottery next week.

There are very few people that can find a job they'd do for the rest of their lives if they had $100 million in the bank. To me, those are the only people who truly are working a job they love. Everyone else (myself included) is just working because they feel they must with varying levels of how much they'd rather be doing something else.

Very well put

 

[Big_Hitter]

Doesn't make sense to project your job satisfaction and approach to life on everybody else as a should. Some people plan ER from the get go. As they age out they may like work and remain or they may be happy to find that they were right at the outset.

maybe OP is stuck in lifestyle lock?

 

[nativenewenglander]

My dad told me several times, when he and my mother married he made his mind up then to retire at 62. He was nine years younger than her and said he knew he needed to quit earlier so they could plan some retired years together. They always lived some of their life along the way. Both came from very poor families, so they saved money. My mom was very frugal with the household finances. They made their goal and were retired together twenty years when my mom passed, dad died last year. Personally, I like working and will work my small business I run from home as long as I'm able to. It gives me great tax advantages and it keeps me engaged. I always joke with my wife that commerce is my hobby, but to each his own. I love the outdoors too as well as working in the garden or on the house. Everyone has to find their own path in retirement. Most of my friends that are retired are still tinkering with some kind of hobby job. You'll find your path too, good luck.

 

[Teacher Terry]

I teach an online college class by choice and would do it for free. Many people end up working a job they dislike because it supports their family and they don't have the skills to seek other options. I think this was especially true for the depression generation.

 

[Floridatennisplayer]

Well, I turn 62 in a few weeks. Been in sales since college. Loved it......back then. However in the past 10 years I have become burned out after many years of "beat your quota or you are out" pressure.

Financially we are in great shape, no debt, both houses paid off, etc. I expect to stop next March at 63. My concern is health insurance for the 2 year gap before Medicare at 65.

Unlike the OP, I grew to hate the pressure of my job, but continued due to the money it paid and the lifestyle it afforded us. I'm ready to retire!!!!!!!!!

Any health insurance ideas? Perhaps work part time at Costco....

 

[RobbieB]

I didn't hate my job but I didn't love it either. I liked it mostly, but I like doing whatever I want to do more.

When you decide you have enough dough you go -

 

[Walt34]

Any health insurance ideas? Perhaps work part time at Costco....

A few years ago we were chatting with a lady at Home Depot while mixing paint and said she got health insurance there by working 20 hours a week or more. She was a single mom and seemed very happy to have the job. I suppose it varies from store manager to store manager but she didn't seem to be under any great stress.

 

[rayinpenn]

Doesn't make sense to project your job satisfaction and approach to life on everybody else as a should. Some people plan ER from the get go. As they age out they may like work and remain or they may be happy to find that they were right at the outset.

You missed my point entirely - didn't I say you may?? Meaning not for everyone. I read time and time again I am unhappy with my work...

 

[Scuba]

I can't think of any "job" someone would pay me to do that I'd be willing to do for free that would come close to affording me the ability to enjoy my life outside of work. If I wouldn't be willing to do it "for free", then it's not what I'd rather be doing imo. "Not detesting" work or finding "some" enjoyment in it doesn't mean it's better than "doing what you'd like to do" (i.e. being financially independent and not having to work at all).

I could go get a job that I'd probably enjoy more than my current job but it would pay probably 1/3rd of what I make now. Of course, "enjoy more" is the positive way of saying "dislike less". I don't "hate" my job but I sure wouldn't keep working it if I won the lottery next week.

There are very few people that can find a job they'd do for the rest of their lives if they had $100 million in the bank. To me, those are the only people who truly are working a job they love. Everyone else (myself included) is just working because they feel they must with varying levels of how much they'd rather be doing something else.

+1

 

[Scuba]

Well, I turn 62 in a few weeks. Been in sales since college. Loved it......back then. However in the past 10 years I have become burned out after many years of "beat your quota or you are out" pressure.



Financially we are in great shape, no debt, both houses paid off, etc. I expect to stop next March at 63. My concern is health insurance for the 2 year gap before Medicare at 65.



Unlike the OP, I grew to hate the pressure of my job, but continued due to the money it paid and the lifestyle it afforded us. I'm ready to retire!!!!!!!!!



Any health insurance ideas? Perhaps work part time at Costco....

DH and I retired at 57 and 56. We buy our own insurance. Luckily he has been buying his own insurance for several years so we have a grandfathered pre-ACA plan. Even if we hadn't had this, buying insurance is very doable given your financial situation as described.

 

[euro]

I think the younger you are when you make the transition, the better because you are more adaptable and resilient. I know 2 workmates who worked until 65 at the company that gave me a golden handshake at 49. They both died at 67. Another died of pancreatic cancer at 57.

Why take the chance?

That!

 

[brucethebroker]

DH and I retired at 57 and 56. We buy our own insurance. Luckily he has been buying his own insurance for several years so we have a grandfathered pre-ACA plan. Even if we hadn't had this, buying insurance is very doable given your financial situation as described.

Health insurance accessibility is no longer a problem. Affordability may be. If affordability is, there are subsidies (or tax credits, in the new plan). If you have too much income for the credits, deductions are available for self employed-start a small business.

Or, just bite the bullet until Medicare at 65. If you have too much income to get the subsidies, having to pay "full price" for health care for 2 years seems to be a small price to retire early.

 

[brucethebroker]

Sorry Scuba, comment was a piggy back to your comment on Floridatennisplayer. Not a response to you personally.

 

[Maenad]

OP, it's great that you were able to find a well-compensated job that you enjoyed, but it's highly patronizing to tell a group of adults that they don't know what they're doing.

 

[scrabbler1]

For me it was the positive aspects of my job versus the negative aspects of the commute I despised so much. Early on, when I was in my 20s, I could tolerate the commute and was enjoying my job. I had some problems with the job but by 1993, my 8th year of work, they had been resolved. In that year alone, I go promoted to supervisor, was able to shed a lot of work I disliked, and 3 coworkers I disliked all quit. All was well.


But in the next 5 years, the commute began wearing me down more and more. The gap between my job enjoyment and commute annoyance was closing quickly, to the point that it was taking a physical toll on me by the late 1990s. It was ten that the seeds of an ER were being planted.


In 2001, I was able to reduce my weekly hours worked and reduce my awful commute. I had stopped the bleeding but the annoyance of the commute returned in 2003 when the mostly telecommuting gig had ended. Similarly, my goal of ER was on the rise. My job enjoyment was pretty much unchanged otherwise.


By 2007, my ER chase was in full speed. I had again reduced my weekly hours worked and lessened the commute. But again, this had only stopped the bleeding. My ER chase was still in full speed. I knew by the end of 2008 something big was going to happen. And it did, when I ended my chase and retired at age 45.

 

[exnavynuke]

For me it was the positive aspects of my job versus the negative aspects of the commute I despised so much. Early on, when I was in my 20s, I could tolerate the commute and was enjoying my job. I had some problems with the job but by 1993, my 8th year of work, they had been resolved. In that year alone, I go promoted to supervisor, was able to shed a lot of work I disliked, and 3 coworkers I disliked all quit. All was well.


But in the next 5 years, the commute began wearing me down more and more. The gap between my job enjoyment and commute annoyance was closing quickly, to the point that it was taking a physical toll on me by the late 1990s. It was ten that the seeds of an ER were being planted.


In 2001, I was able to reduce my weekly hours worked and reduce my awful commute. I had stopped the bleeding but the annoyance of the commute returned in 2003 when the mostly telecommuting gig had ended. Similarly, my goal of ER was on the rise. My job enjoyment was pretty much unchanged otherwise.


By 2007, my ER chase was in full speed. I had again reduced my weekly hours worked and lessened the commute. But again, this had only stopped the bleeding. My ER chase was still in full speed. I knew by the end of 2008 something big was going to happen. And it did, when I ended my chase and retired at age 45.

This sounds quite similar to how my story has been playing out the past few years. The commute being 60% of the things I dislike about my job; to the point that now I get to work at 6am to avoid traffic when I originally came in around 9.

 

[H2ODude]

Prescribing finding enjoyable lucrative employment is like saying everyone can become financially independent and should, and they all will if they try. The fact is employment, enjoyability, and even wealth are all like a pyramid in distribution. SOMEBODY has to fill the ranks of megacorps, someone has to go out and pick up the garbage, someone has to in general be the grunt. And there are FAR more cases of that than the enjoyable professional high paid careers that many here were lucky enough to secure (please, no retorts about how luck had nothing to do with how you wrangled your way to enjoyable employment). I know mine was high enough paid but it took some major turns to get to a good deal of enjoyment. But the fact is that even as a multi degreed engineer there were only so many opportunities to do what I ended up doing, and the luck of being in the right place at the right time benefited me greatly. I'm very grateful. I also know there were others doing exactly my job who were made miserable by the particular employer and circumstances.

 

[ER Eddie]

OP comes across too self-congratulatory to me. And a bit condescending, as others have said.

I have to ask also, if you've found your "passion," why would you give that up? Why would you retire at all? Seems to me that people who find their passion in life (I think of the great artists here) never stop doing it. It's what makes them go. Without it, they would feel hollow.

I was influenced early on by something Joseph Campbell said: "There's something inside you that knows when you're on the beam, and it knows when you're off the beam. If you get off the beam to earn money, you've lost your life." He's the guy who talks about "following your bliss."

I love Joseph Campbell, but over time, I've found that sort of phrasing/formula (bliss/passion) simplistic and unrealistic. It is also a setup for disappointed expectations and frustration. I think most people are fortunate to find a job that they find interesting and engaging (most don't!), and which provides psychological and social benefits as well as money.

 

[Scuba]

Sorry Scuba, comment was a piggy back to your comment on Floridatennisplayer. Not a response to you personally.

No worries!

 

[Mdlerth]

Am I chasing retirement? You bet!

But instead of apologizing, I will suggest that some of us develop paradigms as a consequence of the data we collect throughout our lives. I know I do.

I related the following anecdote in my introductory post, but it might be helpful to some who did not read it. When I started my career, my boss was a guy in his mid-60s. I'll call him "Bill" (not his real name). Bill had spent most of his career at a Megacorp factory in a different city, but when they closed it he had taken a transfer rather than the golden boot they offered. He could easily have taken the severance and retired. He was fully pension and SS eligible, debt-free and had a mattress full of cash...

...but Bill had grown up during the Depression. People from that era had a paradigm that the cushion can never be too thick. Even if they didn't lose their house, they watched neighbors who did. Debt was a four-letter word. You had to pile up dough endlessly because if you didn't you were vulnerable.

So Bill sold his house in Chicago, where his kids and grandkids and all his friends lived, gave up his season tickets to the Bears and his boat on Lake Michigan, and moved hundreds of miles away for a less desirable job in a less desirable town just to pad the stack some more.

He talked all the time about his retirement plans. It was gonna be three or four more years, when he had "more" saved up, and then he'd go. But a year after I met him, he was diagnosed with liver cancer and within three months he was dead. No retirement at all.

The Depression had left Bill with a paradigm about financial security never being secure enough. Watching from very close range as his life played out left me with a paradigm that w*rking past FI is to risk no RE.

That paradigm has shaped my thinking for my whole career. (To be completely truthful, for the first 20 years I did a lot more thinking than doing. I didn't actually DO squat about it until ~15 years ago.) The only thing still keeping me at the sweatshop today is wanting to go out simultaneously with DW.

Now, you might say "But Mdlerth, from listening to your story one might conclude that following paradigms leads us to wrong decisions. It certainly did in Bill's case. So maybe by retiring ASAP instead of staying to bank a few extra Benjamins, you are just setting yourself up for the Purina Cat Chow Diet in your golden years."

Maybe so, although karma seldom sends us a clear choice between extreme cases. But if it should come to that, when I'm lying in my deathbed, in the extreme case would I rather have ten million in the bank and my employee pass still valid or memories of several happy years with an EBT card and a belly full of Little Friskies? Meow.