Covid will it ever end??

[HF63]

I had some ideas or plans on what my future was suppose to be. But Covid came along to really destroy my plans or ideas, I am left wondering weather it would ever go away or decrease to a very low level. I have some bad medical issues that getting Covid the out come might not be good for me.


If you think that we just need to learn to live with it, do you have a list of what you would consider acceptable to do under those circumstances


Yes, I am struggling with this and really fed up with Covid and everything else!

 

[Chuckanut]

Your concerns are valid and need to be addressed by our leaders. Quite simply, they know, or should know, that Covid will be with us for a long time. And we will have to manage the disease just as we manage things like the flu, measles, etc. We are on the way there with vaccines. We now need easy to use, inexpensive therapeutic medicines we can give to Covid sufferers that will help them heal faster and better. And we need to follow safe practices during seasonal outbreaks. IOW, do the basics right. We found out in 2020 and now again in 2021 that doing the basics right not only can prevent Covid, but also colds and flu.

The following article spells it out rather clearly. I guess I like it because the author's views agree with mine.

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/a...manageable-risk-dual-threat-influenza/620044/

Reducing these threats starts with more aggressive efforts to get people vaccinated for flu and COVID alike. Work-related vaccination mandates for both diseases will become more common. (By way of disclosure, I should note that I serve on Pfizer’s board of directors.) For people in industries where telecommuting is possible, the calculus around going to work in person could also change. During peak flu and COVID season, businesses could encourage telework to reduce density in their offices. Conferences may be shifted to months when respiratory pathogens are less prevalent. Businesses will make wider use of videoconferencing to avoid crowded conference rooms, even holding Zoom meetings inside the office while people stay at their own desk.

As with Tamiflu, an antiviral drug for influenza, drugs for COVID will reduce but not eliminate its risk. A key to controlling spread, and seeking timely care, will be prompt diagnosis. Home screening with tests that can differentiate flu from COVID will be routine. Regulators, who for years discouraged home diagnosis of infectious diseases with self-administered tests, now support this approach. Patients will self-diagnose at home and consult doctors through virtual visits. Personal hygiene will also change. During the winter months, when the spread of respiratory pathogens peaks, voluntary mask use inside public spaces will become more common—and, in some parts of the country, a cultural norm.

 

[Koolau]

Didn't the 1918 Pandemic eventually burn itself out after a couple of years of what we're seeing now with Covid 19 (ups and downs in infection/death rates)? And, of course, they didn't have vaccines available.

 

[ivinsfan]

Didn't the 1918 Pandemic eventually burn itself out after a couple of years of what we're seeing now with Covid 19 (ups and downs in infection/death rates)? And, of course, they didn't have vaccines available.

Well yes but the consensus is that between 25 and 50 million people worldwide died....so there's that.

 

[Koolau]

Well yes but the consensus is that between 25 and 50 million people worldwide died....so there's that.

Of course, that same result would likely have happened with Covid 19 except for 21st century medical supportive therapy, antivirals, monoclonal antibodies, ICUs, respirators out the kazoo, etc., etc., oh, and vaccines.

My point was that BAD as it was (and as you point out it was VERY bad) it burned itself out. Do we have any inkling that Covid 19 is so different that it will not also burn itself out? THAT was my question.

 

[audreyh1]

Many think COVID-19 will become endemic. It doesn’t help that animals get it too.

But that doesn’t mean that it might not go down to very low levels where it is less of an inconvenience, but it could still take a while to get there.

The article linked above by Gottlieb discusses some of these issues. Here is a recent article by Ed Yong that seemed like a balanced outlook:

HOW THE PANDEMIC NOW ENDS
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/08/delta-has-changed-pandemic-endgame/619726/

 

[RobbieB]

It will always be here in one mutation or another just like influenza and pneumonia.

But what doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

 

[MC Rider]

Well yes but the consensus is that between 25 and 50 million people worldwide died....so there's that.

Cue Ebenezer Scrooge, it will just reduce the surplus population then.

 

[RobbieB]

It does reduce the population who's genetics do not handle it well and they don't reproduce. Darwin again.

 

[disneysteve]

As a healthcare professional, I really fear where this is going. Many experts believe it will remain endemic, like the seasonal flu. The problem, of course, is it is far more contagious, dangerous, and deadly than the flu, and there is far more push back to vaccination. Add in that fact that periodic boosters will likely be needed and we're really heading into an ongoing problem. I know Moderna is working on a flu/COVID combo vaccine. Hopefully that comes soon to make keeping people current easier.


The question is how to handle infected individuals going forward. Can we realistically continue to quarantine every case for 10 days, shutting down classrooms or even entire schools, offices, and businesses every time one or two people get diagnosed with COVID? It's certainly the right thing to do, but it wreaks havoc on everyone involved.


And what about vaccine/testing requirements? We're seeing them now for restaurants, concerts, sporting events, theaters, travel, and more. Is that going to become the norm indefinitely? Again, I agree that it's the right thing to do right now but is it sustainable long term?


I wish I had the answers.

 

[Car-Guy]

I had some ideas or plans on what my future was suppose to be. But Covid came along to really destroy my plans or ideas, I am left wondering weather it would ever go away or decrease to a very low level.

IMO, it will.. (But I'm not a doctor so my opinion is close to worthless...) It may be another year or two but I suspect it will subsided and become "just another bug" that's pretty much below the radar. (and maybe included in the annual flu vaccine?)

If you think that we just need to learn to live with it, do you have a list of what you would consider acceptable to do under those circumstances

Yes, I got vaccinated, and now I am going on with life "almost" the same as pre-pandemic... I'll probably get a booster at some point but that's it. I'm done..... No more masks, no more avoiding "anything".

Yes, I am struggling with this and really fed up with Covid and everything else!

Well, join the club....

 

[HF63]

As of today, New York is requiring proof of vaccination for congregate settings like restaurants, etc. Italy has done the same and it seems folks feel much better or safer going out.

 

[JT90505]

HF63 asked a very good question which has not really been addressed..."do you have a list of what you would consider acceptable to do"

The short answer is no and its a question I've been thinking about. After the entire family was vaccinated I really thought we were well down the path of living a 'normal' life. We started, then came Delta.

At this point, as much as I hope to see the number of cases go down close to zero, I've pretty much accepted that Covid has not and will not disappear like a miracle. And we need to begin evolving to life that better balances the risks with the desire to 'do stuff'.

What are we doing now...pretty much anything outdoors that does not involve large crowds. Indoors, we shop, masked (fortunately even the ideologs in the area I live have the sense to wear masks). We have gone to museums midweek, and very rarely have eaten indoors when there are few other diners.

What we still are not doing? Travel, although I think some road trips are in our future. Large crowds outdoors, and crowded spaces indoors (no concerts, movies, etc.) Although there have been rare exceptions, indoor dining is out.

What do we really want to do that we are not: Live music, air travel, a nice indoor sit down restaurant.

What would restore some confidence? Case rates and hospitalizations going down? Workers returning to offices? A booster shot? Accepting the risks and not worrying? Again, I don't know.

Others?

 

[Winemaker]

Total deaths, 656k. 40.1 million positive tests. 330 million folks in USA. Almost .02% of population dead, over 12% of population testing positive, sometimes counted twice. Every life is precious, but shows how unhealthy some of the afflicted were in terms of obesity and other ailments, and some were considered healthy. My county of 220,000 has 325 dead , 20,500 tests positive, some maybe twice. We are almost 70% vaccinated.

Yes, this will be very much like the flu, and will never end.

 

[audreyh1]

As of today, New York is requiring proof of vaccination for congregate settings like restaurants, etc. Italy has done the same and it seems folks feel much better or safer going out.

Some countries like Spain and France have seen big recoveries from the delta variant and are back close to baseline. I know France is quite strict now about their health pass. Not sure if Spain has the same thing - looks like parts of it do.

 

[disneysteve]

HF63 asked a very good question which has not really been addressed..."do you have a list of what you would consider acceptable to do"

Get booster shots at whatever frequency is advised.

Continue to wear a mask indoors in public.

Limit indoor dining though we have not been totally avoiding it.

 

[audreyh1]

We are going to travel at some point. If Europe keeps improving, we’ll be very motivated to go over there. Fortunately some countries accept vaccinated Americans and don’t require quarantines. Pretty much no longer accept unvaccinated visitors with very few exceptions.

 

[USGrant1962]

IMO, it will certainly become endemic, it is too contagious even with vax to be totally quashed. The SARS-CoV-2 virus exists, it will be with us.

I think your question is the same as one I posted way, way back in a now closed thread - what is the "exit strategy" for the shutdowns/authoritarianism/economic damage/mental health damage/deferred health damage/education loss/job losses/etc. caused by the mitigation measures?

 

[retire-early]

acceptable to do list following full vaccination:
============================
1. doctors' office visits or anything medical
2. wearing N95 masks for shopping
3. outdoor dining; our local Panera has tables outside


Not much of moviegoer so not going to a movie theater is not a big deal.

I miss going to see a Broadway show or a concert. I do not plan on attending until next year.

Planning on buying a house in a 55+ community and moving next spring.
I hope that cases remain "reasonable" then.

 

[retire-early]

IMO, it will certainly become endemic, it is too contagious even with vax to be totally quashed. The SARS-CoV-2 virus exists, it will be with us.

I think your question is the same as one I posted way, way back in a now closed thread - what is the "exit strategy" for the shutdowns/authoritarianism/economic damage/mental health damage/deferred health damage/education loss/job losses/etc. caused by the mitigation measures?

If the hospitals aren't overwhelmed then you can say it is endemic and not pandemic.

Fortunately for me, knock wood, I live in an area where the hospitals are not overwhelmed.

I remember the one time we had to call 911 when my father fell down a flight of stairs. I can't imagine having to wait hours to get entry into a hospital.

.

 

[Koolau]

Many think COVID-19 will become endemic. It doesn’t help that animals get it too.

But that doesn’t mean that it might not go down to very low levels where it is less of an inconvenience, but it could still take a while to get there.

The article linked above by Gottlieb discusses some of these issues. Here is a recent article by Ed Yong that seemed like a balanced outlook:

HOW THE PANDEMIC NOW ENDS
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2021/08/delta-has-changed-pandemic-endgame/619726/

Interesting article. There are some rays of hope in it, but my pessimistic take-away is that at best, we're stuck with the virus and will need to add it to our list of things which are trying to kill us - and will continue to do so. It's not likely we'll back to our old FIRE lifestyles for quite some time - if ever.

I think what bothers me most is we've allowed the virus to divide us politically. That didn't happen with polio as far as I know. The country united around a prevention and, difficult and expensive as it was, we got it done. Now, we're divided into camps around masks, vaccines, social distancing, etc. Not how I envisioned spending my retirement years. Still life goes on (until it doesn't) so YMMV.

 

[MichaelB]

<mod note> This is not the thread to engage in a public policy debate. Let’s please keep the discussion focused on the OP’s questions.

 

[sengsational]

As of today, New York is requiring proof of vaccination for congregate settings like restaurants, etc. Italy has done the same and it seems folks feel much better or safer going out.

And I heard that some European countries just threw in the towel on strict proof of vaccination, lol! If this wasn't so serious, some of these moves seem comical. But really, who would implement a vaccine proof movement limitation when it's clear that vaccinated people spread as much as non-vaccinated?

I think it ends in a surprising way. We "all" get it. Most of us (vaccinated) don't go to the doctor. Then one day we wake up and the hospital numbers are way down. That might not happen for a year or two, but my unscientific gut feel suggests that's how it will peter out.

In the meantime, I'm keeping my vitamin D level up, as well as zinc, and going about my business as normally as possible. If I get it, that's good...if we're all going to get it, might as well get it over with. I'd rather get it when the hospital was less full. Maybe after a booster, since that takes the edge off the symptoms even more than just being vaccinated.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

Hasn't Amsterdam lifted all restrictions? What did they do right (Rhetorical)?

So it should end at some point, or at least become endemic. I think if I remember correctly, they said they would implement restrictions again if needed.

 

[easysurfer]

I'm doubtful that it will end one day. 40 years ago when I was young and an optimist, would have said I believe in people power, putting our hearts and souls together to end this thing. But not so optimistic anymore.

As long as we can stay at the level of me able to go out and get a haircut I can live with the requirements. Not getting a cut for about 14 months was brutal.

Oh yeah, and keep those toilet paper supplies going .