Housing prices down

[dumpster56]

Dex

#3 the terrorist attack ..

I have to say that the american people are really clueless here. Bin Laden declared war against the united states. We are at war with these animals. An attack on our soil or our interests around the world in my eyes is to be expected.

The american people are still sleepwalking in this war. A true disconnect. Now both political parties are in my eyes held to blame here.

Yes the Iraq mess is a real issue here bad mistakes are and continue to be made. The problem I see is if there is an attack again on an american city the media will go bananas and the stock market will tank and then who knows what BECAUSE the american people are NOT ON A WAR FOOTING!

It is time to be there.

 

[dex]

Dex

#3 the terrorist attack ..

I have to say that the american people are really clueless here. Bin Laden declared war against the united states. We are at war with these animals. An attack on our soil or our interests around the world in my eyes is to be expected.

The american people are still sleepwalking in this war. A true disconnect. Now both political parties are in my eyes held to blame here.

Yes the Iraq mess is a real issue here bad mistakes are and continue to be made. The problem I see is if there is an attack again on an american city the media will go bananas and the stock market will tank and then who knows what BECAUSE the american people are NOT ON A WAR FOOTING!

It is time to be there.

I agree and if Bin Laden is still alive we are doing what he expected. The US public does not have the attention span or will to fight a long war. He is just waiting us out.

 

[CCdaCE]

I agree and if Bin Laden is still alive we are doing what he expected. The US public does not have the attention span or will to fight a long war. He is just waiting us out.

Would everyone agree it's a matter of political will?

There are people that live, eat, and breathe this sh!t. Counter-terrorism goons, CIA, Navy SEALs, Special Forces, etc. ... all ready to play "whack-a-mole".

Just takes a couple of bucks and some tenacity, and some damn good intel. You don't think that in the last 5 years we couldn't have accomplished smoking out every terrorist if our gov't. had put it's mind to it?

Maybe I've been watching too much TV.

How did this thread turn political?

For instance, in Iraq. Which is a totally separate issue than "the war on terrorism", in my mind. There's nothing stopping us from "cleanin' up the mess", other than politics. "Rules of Engagement", "Collateral Damage" and the like.

-CC

 

[youbet]

Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. government ever made.

Well.......... Iraq has been ugly, very ugly, no doubt about that. But in terms of lives lost and negative impact on the economy, I don't think it has yet reached the level of the Viet Nam debacle.

 

[samclem]

Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. government ever made.

Pulleese! You can disagree with the war, but I think this statement might be a tad overwrought. We did kill thousands of native Americans, we did inter Americans of Japanese ancestry during WW-II, our government did condone racial preferences 9and still does) etc.

 

[CompoundInterestFan]

The US public does not have the attention span or will to fight a long war.

I think people would have the will if they thought the war was worth fighting. I think that most people didn't see the situation in Iraq as a direct threat (myself included). A good number of people saw shady or at least questionable motives for going in there, and the fact that it's been dragged out with no clear end in sight doesn't help support.

 

[tryan]

I think people would have the will if they thought the war was worth fighting.

Anybody who thinks these animals will be pacified if we leave Iraq needs to read the attached.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17617986/

 

[samclem]

Anybody who thinks these animals will be pacified if we leave Iraq needs to read the attached.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17617986/

They'll be just as pacified as they were before we went into Iraq. They hardly bothered us at all before then, right? (except for the bombing of our embassies in Africa, the 1998 attempt to blow up the World Trade Center, a little thing in Sep of 2001). Also, bringing up Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is not a good idea--he's a terrorist that is in US custody, and a big mantra among many is that we've had no success in that fight. His present incarceration is the product of successful cooperation with other countries in the fight against Islamic extremism. No, it was not a totally transparent process, the news is reporting that there are still things surrounding his apprehension and captivity that have not been publically released. A little discretion and secrecy just might be required in some cases as we go on.

 

[HFWR]

Anybody who thinks these animals will be pacified if we leave Iraq needs to read the attached.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17617986/

Precisely why Iraq is a major distraction from the real mission...

 

[Retire Soon]

I maintain that Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. has ever made, militarily. We attacked a country with absolutely no provocation. This is not what the U.S. is about. We have higher ideals and are simply better than that. We received unprecedented sympathy internationally after 911 and than squandered all of it by attacking a country without cause or justification. We already had our hands tied with the Taliban in Afghanistan, and had absolutely no business starting a war with a country we incorrectly perceived as belonging to "The Axis of Evil." Where are all of these "weapons of mass destruction?" Our resources should have been directed at fighing terrorism and not placing ourselves in the middle of a religious civil war. The only thing we've gotten out of the Iraq war is lower worldwide prestige. Our homeland is substantially less safe and secure because of this ineptitude.

 

[teejayevans]

I maintain that Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. has ever made

US politicians made that mistake, I and many other US citizens had
nothing to do with it.
Ever heard of Vietnam? Korea?
We didn't have authority to attach Grenada either, but that's ok cause
it turned out alright.

Bush down in history as the worst 2 term president, ever.
We'll see if the Dems have finally learned from their mistakes, hint:
don't pick a candidate that is left of Ted Kennedy

Tom

 

[wabmester]

Look on the bright side. The Bush War put an end to his country-building ambitions. He was originally gunnin' for the whole gosh durn Axis of Evil.

He also handed power back to the Democrats. You have to give him credit where credit is due.

 

[dumpster56]

They'll be just as pacified as they were before we went into Iraq. They hardly bothered us at all before then, right? (except for the bombing of our embassies in Africa, the 1998 attempt to blow up the World Trade Center, a little thing in Sep of 2001). Also, bringing up Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is not a good idea--he's a terrorist that is in US custody, and a big mantra among many is that we've had no success in that fight. His present incarceration is the product of successful cooperation with other countries in the fight against Islamic extremism. No, it was not a totally transparent process, the news is reporting that there are still things surrounding his apprehension and captivity that have not been publically released. A little discretion and secrecy just might be required in some cases as we go on.

Sam

It was not the Iraqis who blew up the embassies. 9/11 Uh Saudis and Sheik muhammed? Uh FIND Bin Laden and Al zwahiri. They were the brains of 9/11 Not Muhammed. But the Bush guys will now trot out this story line that he spilled his guts about 9/11.

Yea right , After the pentagon cheif talks about gays and the Attorny General is in up to his eyes in sewer water.

 

[genghis]

Look on the bright side. The Bush War put an end to his country-building ambitions. He was originally gunnin' for the whole gosh durn Axis of Evil.

He also handed power back to the Democrats. You have to give him credit where credit is due.

Don't sell him short - he has two years to go and his propaganda about Iran is sounding eerily familiar......

 

[tryan]

Retire Soon,

We can agree to disagree. But we went into Iraq with 22 other nations. Hardly a solo effort.

Our homeland is substantially less safe and secure because of this ineptitude.

That one suprised me ... I mean no attacks on US soil in 6 years. And the quality of "work" from these animals is greatly diminished. Other than suicide bombings - which is business as usual; what has happened:

March 2004 Madrid bombings - well coordinated; score one for them.
July 2005 London bombs - botched attempt as many bombs did not detonate.

If this is the best they have ... I'ld say we're winning. The dead/captured are being replaced with the inexperianced. Only a matter of time.

 

[wabmester]

I saw a great bumper sticker the other day. "We're creating enemies faster than we can kill them."

 

[brewer12345]

The dead/captured are being replaced with the inexperianced. Only a matter of time.

That's not a very nice thing to say about the US military.

 

[ziggy29]

I saw a great bumper sticker the other day. "We're creating enemies faster than we can kill them."

Probably found on the vehicle of a gas guzzler which is providing huge amounts of oil profits to those enemies to use against us.

Just like all those old smog-belching VW vans with "Save the Planet" stickers on them.

 

[genghis]

Retire Soon,

We can agree to disagree. But we went into Iraq with 22 other nations. Hardly a solo effort.

That one suprised me ... I mean no attacks on US soil in 6 years. And the quality of "work" from these animals is greatly diminished. Other than suicide bombings - which is business as usual; what has happened:

March 2004 Madrid bombings - well coordinated; score one for them.
July 2005 London bombs - botched attempt as many bombs did not detonate.

If this is the best they have ... I'ld say we're winning. The dead/captured are being replaced with the inexperianced. Only a matter of time.

22 other nations? How many of those 22 other nations actually fought and lost people? How many are still there with us? How may innocent Iraqis have been killed? What did Iraq have to do with terrorist attacks and 9/11? Why is Bin Laden still alive? Why have our borders not been secured? When will these NeoCons FINALLY admit this war was a HUGE mistake?

Are you Tony Snow?

 

[eridanus]

That one suprised me ... I mean no attacks on US soil in 6 years.

I'd respond in length, but I have to keep beating my head against the wall to keep the elephants away.

 

[lets-retire]

I maintain that Iraq is the worst mistake the U.S. has ever made, militarily. We attacked a country with absolutely no provocation. This is not what the U.S. is about. We have higher ideals and are simply better than that. We received unprecedented sympathy internationally after 911 and than squandered all of it by attacking a country without cause or justification. We already had our hands tied with the Taliban in Afghanistan, and had absolutely no business starting a war with a country we incorrectly perceived as belonging to "The Axis of Evil." Where are all of these "weapons of mass destruction?" Our resources should have been directed at fighing terrorism and not placing ourselves in the middle of a religious civil war. The only thing we've gotten out of the Iraq war is lower worldwide prestige. Our homeland is substantially less safe and secure because of this ineptitude.

Never mind the fact that Saddam never lived up to promises he made when he came begging the coalition to stop beating up on him. His SAM sites were constantly being bombed and destroyed by British and American fighters during the so called peace time. They were being blown up only because they were locking onto the aircraft, not because they were there. I personally observed planes go out fully loaded and return empty. These missions were not covered on the news because they happened so often and our pilots were not injured. But remember Saddam was a peace loving dictator who's only fault was he was in the wrong place at the wrong time. I mean he didn't tell his SAM sites to lock onto the fighters they just did it because they could. :

For much as a mess Iraq currently is, it gives the terrorists a place to kill outside our nation. Oh yeah, I read an article the other day that said Baghdad is relatively quite now, due to the surge and all of our troops are not in country yet. The democrats were correct again (NOT) the surge won't accomplish anything except get more American's killed. Granted it is still early, but it does look promising.

 

[bright eyed]

Retire Soon,

We can agree to disagree. But we went into Iraq with 22 other nations. Hardly a solo effort.

Oh my goodness - that is funny - was that off the Whitehouse press release?

the coalition of the "willing" check this out http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multinational_force_in_Iraq
Only a handful of these countries sent more than one thousand, the rest from the 20's on up! come on... :

Even Moldova has shrunk their forces from 24 at the time of the invasion to the 11 they have there now! :

 

[tryan]

Yup, 14 nations with more than 100 troops.

 

[Richard Reid]

... I am hijacking this thread ... ummmm, anybody got matches?!?

 

[samclem]

Sam

It was not the Iraqis who blew up the embassies. 9/11 Uh Saudis and Sheik muhammed? Uh FIND Bin Laden and Al zwahiri. They were the brains of 9/11 Not Muhammed. But the Bush guys will now trot out this story line that he spilled his guts about 9/11.

Yea right , After the pentagon cheif talks about gays and the Attorny General is in up to his eyes in sewer water.

I did not say it was the Iraqis that blew up the embassies. I said the capture of Khalid Sheik Mohammed was a victory for us in the fight against Islamic extremism. You have continually sung the "we should be killing/capturing these animals" song, Khalid Sheifk Mohammed is definitely one of the worst. Do you think Usama and Zawahiri flew those planes into the towers? No, they had lots of underlings, planners, logistics guys. We're killing or capturing many of them, both in Iraq and elsewhere. You should appreciate that and maybe concede that progress is being made-or is it simply about these two guys? (BTW, look back at earlier press accounts and you'll see that the "top three" were frequently mentioned: Khalid Sheik Mohammed was #3).

The military/law enforcement aspect is just one tool in this fight. The bigger problem--defeating the extremist ideology that rejects pluralism, individual rights, and rationalism in favor of a medieval Koranic theocracy--will take many years and will involve broader tools of engagement.