COVID-19 Health and Preparedness - Strictly Moderated

[Ready]

It makes sense that you have to absorb a certain amount of viral load to become infected but 15 minutes within 6 feet of someone seems like a relatively high bar.

When a lot of people say they don't know how they got infected or from whom, you'd think they would be aware when and with whom they spent 15 minutes together in close proximity.

Movies, theater, restaurants, classrooms, public transportation, team sports, health clubs, office meetings, conference rooms, doctor’s offices...

I was supposed to go to the DMV this month to get my Real ID. I could have easily spent 15 minutes in a waiting room with infected people.

I was also supposed to get annual eye exam this month. If my optometrist was sick he would have been breathing all over me while looking at my eyes up close.

I often get a massage every couple of months. There is someone breathing close to me for an hour and touching me all over with their hands.

 

[NW-Bound]

When a lot of people say they don't know how they got infected or from whom, you'd think they would be aware when and with whom they spent 15 minutes together in close proximity.

Or could it be that they picked up unknowingly by contact, as described by that Dr. Dave Price in the video to his family and friends and shared twice on different threads on this forum?

Say, an infected but asymptomatic person emitted a droplet of saliva onto a shopping cart handle, which was then picked up by the next shopper and brought to his face?

 

[Rianne]

Say, an infected but asymptomatic person emitted a droplet of saliva onto a shopping cart handle, which was then picked up by the next shopper and brought to his face?

Every grocery store I've been to, way before this virus, has disinfectant wipes at every entrance as well as a large bottle of hand sanitizer. That combination should be protective.


I wonder about wind or a breeze. We have 45-50 mph winds here today. Does the virus carry on the wind? Or is it disrupted and dismantled? Just as I feared walking a lady's cough at UPS, even though she distanced herself from people when she coughed near the front door. When I left I walked right through her cough air (but I held my breath). If the virus is in a water like droplet, does it fall to the ground. Some articles say it hangs in the air for a certain amount of time. If this is the case, would a breeze carry it to other areas?

 

[JoeWras]

I wonder about wind or a breeze. We have 45-50 mph winds here today. Does the virus carry on the wind? Or is it disrupted and dismantled?

It is all mathematical. Once cannot say "never" very easily. But could you get it randomly on the wind? Well, yes, but so can a meteorite strike you.

The 6 ft. radius thing is based on some math that puts the chance of transmission in the very low category. Zero? No. But very low.

The same can be said about the 14 day quarantine. A very small percentage of cases have incubated longer than 14. But it is extremely low. They picked 14 to capture most of them.

BTW, the few times I've passed people on our greenway path, I've held my breath too. I understand where you are coming from. If I smell perfume, I figure there is a chance. However, perfume aerosols are probably smaller than the droplets that carry the virus. But what if the virus gets carried on an aerosol that is drifting in the wind? Ah, you can go crazy. Remember, long distance wind transmission puts us in meteorite strike zone. Just do your best to keep distance.

 

[Nemo2]

The virus checks your driver's license, notes the address, gets there before you, hangs around the front door.....and just as you put your key in the lock......

 

[Sunset]

.....

I wonder about wind or a breeze. We have 45-50 mph winds here today. Does the virus carry on the wind? Or is it disrupted and dismantled? Just as I feared walking a lady's cough at UPS, even though she distanced herself from people when she coughed near the front door. When I left I walked right through her cough air (but I held my breath). If the virus is in a water like droplet, does it fall to the ground. Some articles say it hangs in the air for a certain amount of time. If this is the case, would a breeze carry it to other areas?

Ever see a photo of someone's sneeze or cough, it looks like a shower of spit coming out.
In a room or closed area, I'd say there is a need for concern, outside, the wind that carries it would also disperse it randomly.

For entertainment:

 

[Chuckanut]

Please forgive me if this site has already been mentioned. Going back through 12+ pages of material is not feasible for me at the moment.

https://healthweather.us/

This site is operated by a company that sells internet connected thermometers. It tracks the data that the buyers of their products send to them (Yes, I know there are privacy issues.) You will notice that the Seattle area (First with CV19 in the USA) had some higher than normal temperatures reported in the first and second weeks of March, but is now falling to below what is normal for them.

NY area is also starting to fall and is now in the normal zone.

Most counties seem to be in or below the normal area. The USA map shows a decreasing trend of atypical measurements.

What does this mean? Maybe nothing, maybe that social distancing is working. I have no idea if this information is representative of the population. These fancy thermometers are expensive, 30-70 dollars. So it may only be the trend of the affluent folks.

From the website:

Suggested Uses

For public health officials, and anyone dealing with the COVID-19 pandemic response in a professional sense, we suggest using this data in the following two ways:

1. Identify areas where illness levels are unusually high, and investigate: we suspect that areas with illness levels that are higher than expected are likely to be early indicators of community spread of COVID-19. This is best seen in the “Atypical” mode of the map visualization above.
2. Gauge whether measures taken are working to slow the spread: as social distancing, school closures, and similar measures start to take effect, we expect influenza-like illness levels to drop — if illness levels are dropping, the measures are working. This is best seen in the “Trends” mode of the map visualization above.

Created in collaboration with Benjamin Dalziel, Oregon State University.

 

[ERD50]

Please forgive me if this site has already been mentioned. Going back through 12+ pages of material is not feasible for me at the moment.

https://healthweather.us/

This site is operated by a company that sells internet connected thermometers. It tracks the data that the buyers of their products send to them (Yes, I know there are privacy issues.) You will notice that the Seattle area (First with CV19 in the USA) had some higher than normal temperatures reported in the first and second weeks of March, but is now falling to below what is normal for them.

NY area is also starting to fall and is now in the normal zone.

Most counties seem to be in or below the normal area. The USA map shows a decreasing trend of atypical measurements.

What does this mean? Maybe nothing, maybe that social distancing is working. I have no idea if this information is representative of the population. These fancy thermometers are expensive, 30-70 dollars. So it may only be the trend of the affluent folks.

From the website:

Interesting. Maybe the decreasing trend is due to thermometers that are still reporting, but are stuck in room temperature bodies (trying to be gentle here)? I'm sure (well, I hope!) they filter out readings outside of an expected range.

More seriously, it seems that every single area I hovered over had a decreasing trend? Seems odd.

-ERD50

 

[JoeWras]

Let's hope the thermometers are a super early indicator. Most people don't ask for the test until they get pretty sick, or go to the ER.

 

[Gumby]

When I look at the graphs (you have to scroll down from the map), they expect a decreasing trend at this time of year and show the expected range with a blue band. The actual observed temperatures are the red/orange line. If it is higher than the blue band, they call it atypical illness level. Around here, the levels rose above the band in early March and have since decreased sharply. If I look for a county somewhere out in the Midwest where I don't expect to see COVID, the decrease in actual observed tracks the expected range.

 

[audreyh1]

But to be within 6 feet for 15 minutes?

How often does one do that in public except if one is dining or at some crowded event where you're sitting for awhile?

Conferences, concerts, festivals, rodeos, parades, classes, funerals, weddings, religious services, parties, the list goes on and on! If people are traveling from and then return to distant areas to attend it’s even worse because they spread the disease to their home area.

There have been several outbreaks associated with large gatherings of people, whether generally known to each other as in religious services, or unknown as in large festival gatherings.

 

[JoeWras]

The 15 minutes thing makes me chuckle. All it takes is 30 seconds with some loud talker blasting away at me, and I'd be virus soaked.

 

[Aerides]

The 15 minutes thing makes me chuckle. All it takes is 30 seconds with some loud talker blasting away at me, and I'd be virus soaked.

Yeah the timing thing has me curious. I imagine it's some sort of observed realistic bell curve wherein casual contact under 15 minutes usually doesn't include any ... spraying .... but given long enough someone will cough or sneeze or snort or spit and there ya go.

I basically treat anyone in public now like they are Pigpen.

 

[jollystomper]

Seems like it is spreading far more easily than being 15 minutes within 6 feet of an infected person.

I understand the droplet cloud that forms from coughs and sneezes, maybe heavy exhales.

But to be within 6 feet for 15 minutes?

How often does one do that in public except if one is dining or at some crowded event where you're sitting for awhile?

In Wuhan, they said transmission between family members was one of the most common modes of infection. That makes sense, especially in cultures where multiple generations live together, which would be true of China and Italy.

It makes sense that you have to absorb a certain amount of viral load to become infected but 15 minutes within 6 feet of someone seems like a relatively high bar.

When a lot of people say they don't know how they got infected or from whom, you'd think they would be aware when and with whom they spent 15 minutes together in close proximity.

Movies, theater, restaurants, classrooms, public transportation, team sports, health clubs, office meetings, conference rooms, doctor’s offices...

I was supposed to go to the DMV this month to get my Real ID. I could have easily spent 15 minutes in a waiting room with infected people.

I was also supposed to get annual eye exam this month. If my optometrist was sick he would have been breathing all over me while looking at my eyes up close.

I often get a massage every couple of months. There is someone breathing close to me for an hour and touching me all over with their hands.

This has me thinking about how long restrictions will be in place, based on the calendar timing when high-risk gatherings become more prevalent. Coming up in the the next few months:
- Passover and Easter in April
- School graduations in May and June (though cancellations are occurring)
- Post school celebrations (where many student head to beach locations)
- Memorial Day weekend, the "unofficial" start of summer, and the start of summer vacation (I'm betting "staycations" will be the mode this year).
- The "traditional" June wedding season
- Fourth of July parades/celebrations


Even if the infection rate levels off say in May, the June and July events will be impacted. August is usually considered a "sleepy" month in the U.S. (though that is when NFL preseason games start, betting they will be postponed/cancelled).

 

[Dtail]

This has me thinking about how long restrictions will be in place, based on the calendar timing when high-risk gatherings become more prevalent. Coming up in the the next few months:
- Passover and Easter in April
- School graduations in May and June (though cancellations are occurring)
- Post school celebrations (where many student head to beach locations)
- Memorial Day weekend, the "unofficial" start of summer, and the start of summer vacation (I'm betting "staycations" will be the mode this year).
- The "traditional" June wedding season
- Fourth of July parades/celebrations


Even if the infection rate levels off say in May, the June and July events will be impacted. August is usually considered a "sleepy" month in the U.S. (though that is when NFL preseason games start, betting they will be postponed/cancelled).

Our close friend's son is getting married on May 30th. The wedding is still on. It will probably be canceled. I hope it is.

 

[ivinsfan]

Our close friend's son is getting married on May 30th. The wedding is still on. It will probably be canceled. I hope it is.

Family in the UK has a destination wedding in Spain the last week of May..I think it's toast..was invited but not planning to attend due to Spring planting schedule.

An 18 month engagement and wedding planning ..up in smoke!

 

[Aerides]

This has me thinking about how long restrictions will be in place, based on the calendar timing when high-risk gatherings become more prevalent. Coming up in the the next few months:
- Passover and Easter in April
- School graduations in May and June (though cancellations are occurring)
- Post school celebrations (where many student head to beach locations)
- Memorial Day weekend, the "unofficial" start of summer, and the start of summer vacation (I'm betting "staycations" will be the mode this year).
- The "traditional" June wedding season
- Fourth of July parades/celebrations


Even if the infection rate levels off say in May, the June and July events will be impacted. August is usually considered a "sleepy" month in the U.S. (though that is when NFL preseason games start, betting they will be postponed/cancelled).

Yeah I don't think any of that stuff is happening. Even in the best case scenarios, it would not make sense to go rushing back to normal large gatherings.

Things I'd need (for me) to have in place to go back to total normal would include an effective vaccine, real time testing, anti-body testing, - and home-kit testing would be ideal.

 

[JoeWras]

Most churches have made plans for a remote Easter. It is very difficult as it is the most important date in the Christian calendar. Yes there are outlier churches who will ignore the directives. I'm sure the news will stoke it up. Spare me the stories.

But the majority of churches have made this very difficult decision.

Then you have my sister. She's going to have a large family gathering no matter what. At least that was her story two days ago. I gotta talk to her again. I really hope she's taking back that idea. She was of the opinion that family is above all this. Frustrating.

 

[NW-Bound]

Family in the UK has a destination wedding in Spain the last week of May..I think it's toast..was invited but not planning to attend due to Spring planting schedule.

An 18 month engagement and wedding planning ..up in smoke!

That is truly heartbreaking, compared to a ruined vacation or a cruise.

One may wonder if Spain will reopen for travel by the last week of May. That's 2 months away, and the way things look in Spain now, it is not likely.

 

[harley]

DW and I went for a walk an hour ago, and my idiot next door neighbor was out on the street leaning into someone's car and talking to the two people in it. Maybe 18" away from them. WTF!

I found a nice 10' long tree branch on the walk and brought it home. May have to duct tape a knife to the end. Telling him to stay away doesn't work. He just doesn't get it.

 

[Fermion]

Took a walk this evening around the town park (on the outskirts). All the swingsets had police tape on them to prevent them being used, all the garbage cans had been removed, picnic cables taped up.

Continuing around the park and saw a bunch of high school kids playing basketball on the school court grounds. At least 10 kids.

This country is so toast.

 

[Freedom56]

We went for a grocery store run and trip to Home Depot to buy gym flooring for a home gym that we are setting up. Home depot was pretty empty which was good. The grocery store was not that chaotic. They have plexi-glass barriers between the cashier and the customer and now have markings on the floor in front of the cashier to space out people (a sign of things to come). The toilet paper and eggs were gone but there was bottled water (baby steps). The most disturbing thing I saw was that teenagers were still gathering in large groups at many locations. Many are just not taking this seriously.

 

[Winemaker]

A fellow in AZ died and his wife is in hospital after taking it. They went to the hospital 30 minutes after taking it.
https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/23/health/arizona-coronavirus-chloroquine-death/index.html

This has been proven false. They self medicated using chloroquine PHOSPHATE, a fish tank cleaner.

https://www.pharmacypracticenews.co...g-Fish-Tank-Cleaner-to-Prevent-COVID-19/57707


The use of hydroxychloroquine and a Z-Pack are showing signs of relief according to the WSJ.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/an-update-on-the-coronavirus-treatment-11585509827?mod=hp_opin_pos_1

 

[Sunset]

This has been proven false. They self medicated using chloroquine PHOSPHATE, a fish tank cleaner.

https://www.pharmacypracticenews.co...g-Fish-Tank-Cleaner-to-Prevent-COVID-19/57707


The use of hydroxychloroquine and a Z-Pack are showing signs of relief according to the WSJ.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/an-update-on-the-coronavirus-treatment-11585509827?mod=hp_opin_pos_1

Thanks for clearing that up.
It was not entirely clear in the article I read.
How stupid to take fish tank cleaner, why anyone would even think it's pure enough even had it been the correct thing, (which it was not).

Similarly, I read, (but don't have a reference) , in Iran many people have died because of a rumor circulating that a foreign couple drank whiskey and cured themselves of covid-19.
So some Iranians (a non-drinking country due to Islam) have been drinking alcohol, but of course it's not always the safe one. They don't have a legal source like a liquor store to buy from, so they buy from "some guy".

 

[Nemo2]

Similarly, I read, (but don't have a reference) , in Iran many people have died because of a rumor circulating that a foreign couple drank whiskey and cured themselves of covid-19.
So some Iranians (a non-drinking country due to Islam) have been drinking alcohol, but of course it's not always the safe one. They don't have a legal source like a liquor store to buy from, so they buy from "some guy".

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...methanol-drink-cure-deaths-fake-a9429956.html

Hundreds of Iranians have reportedly died and more than 1000 fallen ill after consuming methanol amid false rumours that it can help cure the disease caused by the coronavirus.

They weren't cured, but they got great mileage before they died.