FI forums for Simple People

[foxfirev5]

As long as you don't post "I've got 5 million can I retire" you're good to go in my book. I've cut back on my posting but this is probably your best site.

 

[tmm99]

We did a poll on our net worth before, right? A lot of people here belong to the top 5% or most of us at least somewhere in the top 20%. Many have had high-tech or high-paying positions. Of course, there are some exceptions, but overall, this place is filled with people who are very well off, compared to the general population and most of them have had white-colour jobs.

Lots of people want to argue here that they're not rich, and they're right, they're not rich like Bill Gates, they cannot even afford a tiny mansion to live in, but statistically speaking, the majority of the people here are much better off than average or below average. I don't think you can find anybody here who has to live on SS alone for example. (Yes, some of our parents do, or our friends do, but not us...)

I personally do not know of any website that caters to people who have low-paying jobs with limited funds who are trying to retire, but I'm sure there are people like that who are forced to retire early, and I would be interested to know how they're managing.

 

[ivinsfan]

Well at over 8k × 10 I am rich...but who sends me the check.

 

[Andre1969]

I think one problem is, no matter how well off you are, it's simply human nature to compare yourself to people who are better off financially than you are. Plus, whatever your lot in life is, no matter how nice it might look to others, it's easy to get used to what you have, and think it's no great shakes.

And, I think a lot of people can look wealthy, and by our standards they might be. But they also have big bills to go along with that big wealth, so they're still going to have some concerns.

One of my acquaintances, a few months ago, commented, out of the blue, that I'm rich. Now, he's never seen me throw money around or do anything extravagant, but he had it in his mind that I'm rich. I asked why he thought that. He said that because I have a nice house with a swimming pool and a "man cave". I countered with, no, I have a big mortgage, and a lot of bills associated with that swimming pool. And, the "man cave" he's referring to is a somewhat run-down little 10x14 building in back, at the edge of the woods, that once upon a time, the previous owner's father used as an office/workshop.

But, even after mentioning my bills, he simply repeated "No. You are rich."

I was just chatting online with this guy the other day and he mentioned his car got broken into. His car is a beat-up 2006 or so Honda Civic. I asked if the car got damaged, and if they stole anything of value. He said the car wasn't damaged, but they got his gold Versace sunglasses.

I was SOOO tempted to say "You think I'm rich, but you're buying sunglasses by a brand that I would probably mispronounce!" But, I behaved.

**Edit: I just googled "Gold Versace Sunglasses" and came up with a bunch of hits. Looks like you can get them for as low as $120 or so depending on the style, so I guess not as extravagant as I thought. Still, that name just sounds "rich" to me. But then, so does "Lincoln Versailles" until you figure out what it's based on

 

[brydanger]

As the OP, I apologize if my question came across as offensive. Please be assured that was not my intent. I do appreciate the positive feedback and the additional information that you have provided me.

I think a couple of folks mentioned (based on my post from another thread) that I was in the Middle to Upper Class range. Without going into a lot of details I can assure you that is not the case.

Just to be clear. I hope my question did not imply that I was against Rich people. Quite the contrary. I know some Rich people and most of them are very nice. However, they are in a league of their own. They have a lifestyle that a simple person can only dream about. It is difficult for me as a Simple man to relate to a Rich man regarding FI. Hence the reason for my question.

You'll find that the masses here (while many of them well intended) do have a fairly set method/ideology to the "right way" to achieve FI and RE.
Not a lot of room given to different paths or ideas, etc... but please be very clear that FI is very much possible at/from a lower income/lean approach as well!

We started investing early but actually made the most ground by downsizing into smaller and smaller homes until eventually living/traveling in a van full time). That reduction in expenses allowed us to retire before I turned 35, but choosing the "lean" path for a period of time absolutely does NOT mean you have to expect to live that way forever!

Keep us posted if we can answer any questions or help in any way!!

 

[Andre1969]

As long as you don't post "I've got 5 million can I retire" you're good to go in my book. I've cut back on my posting but this is probably your best site.

Yeah, I always get a kick out of those types of posts (or, usually I think they're "Marketwatch" clickbait articles). But, I guess someone on a high cost of living area that has young kids, and a somewhat extravagant lifestyle, could be concerned.

$5M is enough to give you $150K (3% SWR) to $200K (4% SWR) which is more lofty than my salary will ever get to. But, my Mom and stepdad were probably making about $200K per year combined just before they retired in 2011, and they weren't exactly living the "Lifestyles of the Rich and Famous".

But then, while they were making $200K combined, they weren't spending nearly that much. I can remember Mom complaining about their ~$1,000/mo mortgage! In retirement, with their pensions, I think they come in at just under $100K/yr combined now, and they're still putting money away, and haven't had to touch their retirement.

So, I guess a lifestyle where you actually SPEND $150-200K per year, is probably a lot more flashy than I think it is.

 

[ocean view]

I know some Rich people and most of them are very nice. However, they are in a league of their own. They have a lifestyle that a simple person can only dream about. It is difficult for me as a Simple man to relate to a Rich man regarding FI.

You’ve described yourself as simple and compared yourself to the rich, but I think your statement quoted here is really the issue. You perceive (please correct me if I’m wrong) that all of those who have large bank accounts also living large all of the time; BTD or Blow That Dough, as a popular forum thread is called.

I would hazard a guess that the “living large” lifestyle is not the everyday norm for most of us. There’s a reason that we joke about reusing dryer sheets. We’re all really frugal, simple people living with a rich man’s bank account.

I would consider myself simple as well. l buy all of my clothes at Target, Kohl’s and Costco. I live in an 1800 sq ft tract home. I clip coupons every week. We don’t eat out often. We don’t take big vacations. We drive a Nissan and a Toyota. And nothing makes me happier than getting something on sale. But I also happen to have the means to be FI, achieved in part because of all of the above.

Can you provide your definition of simple? I bet it’s similar to many of our members. And even if it is different, there’s no reason to think you wouldn’t be a welcome member of the forum whose questions wouldn’t be respectfully answered or that you couldn’t otherwise contribute and add value to the group.

Dive in. The water’s fine!

 

[travelover]

.......... l buy all of my clothes at Target, Kohl’s and Costco. .......

You buy your clothes new? You are rich.

 

[REWahoo]

You buy your clothes new?

Only my underwear...

 

[Out of Steam]

Of course, it doesn't take much savings to have more than the median amount of financial assets for an American.

According to this calculator, $40,000 in assets other than home equity will get you there.

https://dqydj.com/net-worth-percentile-calculator-united-states/

 

[Out of Steam]

As long as you don't post "I've got 5 million can I retire" you're good to go in my book.

Somewhere around 2008, I estimated how much in assets (mainly pretax retirement) it would take to walk away from jobs in the DC area in the middle of raising a child, and not do anything to change our lifestyle or reduce our spending rate. We were then in our late 40s.

It wasn't much short of $5 million.

 

[ShokWaveRider]

You buy your clothes new? You are rich.

"Well we had it tough. We used to have to get up out of the shoebox at twelve o'clock at night, and LICK the road clean with our tongues. We had half a handful of freezing cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at the mill for fourpence every six years, and when we got home, our Dad would slice us in two with a bread knife."

 

[finnski1]

"Well we had it tough. We used to have to get up out of the shoebox at twelve o'clock at night, and LICK the road clean with our tongues. We had half a handful of freezing cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at the mill for fourpence every six years, and when we got home, our Dad would slice us in two with a bread knife."

You had a bread knife? Wow you were rich

 

[yhoomajor]

Only my underwear...

hey - what's wrong with gently used, but thoroughly cleaned under-wears sold at Goodwill store?

 

[RetiredHappy]

The math is simple, figure out total retirement expenses and then check to make sure that you have enough income to support expenses. If income is less than expenses, work longer or reduce expenses.

We spend $200K a year and we don't live fancy lives, and we still have to balance our books, i.e. income must meet expenses.

 

[REWahoo]

hey - what's wrong with gently used, but thoroughly cleaned under-wears sold at Goodwill store?

Goodwill and other pre-owned clothing stores in this part of the world only sell outerwear.

 

[foxfirev5]

Somewhere around 2008, I estimated how much in assets (mainly pretax retirement) it would take to walk away from jobs in the DC area in the middle of raising a child, and not do anything to change our lifestyle or reduce our spending rate. We were then in our late 40s.

It wasn't much short of $5 million.

WOW! So sorry for your plight.

 

[HI Bill]

Most of us here started out modestly. I was fortunate enough to graduate college with no debt and about $2K in the bank. Six weeks later, and I got my first job, making about the same as new STEM graduates make today. Working hard, long, and taking on increasing responsibility, I lived way below my means until I FIRED this year. I lived in an 800 SF apartment until I was moving to my retirement home. Not everyone started out rich here, and most got there after working hard and saving and LBYM. Many did it with blue collar jobs, but more with STEM, IT, or tech jobs; others did it by farming, owning their own business, or investing in real estate. My role models were worth multiple millions, and 23 years after I met them, I made it. I'd highly recommend the Millionaire Next Door, if you want some solid inspiration.

 

[travelover]

.......... Not everyone started out rich here, and most got there after working hard and saving and LBYM. ...........

I woke up after a three day drunk and found a winning lottery ticket in the gutter.

 

[rothlev]

Maybe we should supplement our retirement by charging for advice:

• "Advice": $0.02
• Factual advice: $5
• Useful advice: $10

this reminds me of this old poster from my teaching career

 

[USGrant1962]

Of course, it doesn't take much savings to have more than the median amount of financial assets for an American.

According to this calculator, $40,000 in assets other than home equity will get you there.

https://dqydj.com/net-worth-percentile-calculator-united-states/

That's a little misleading in that it doesn't account for age. Averaging in the net worth of all the 18 year-olds isn't too relevant to ER. From the same source, this is a better look at the data - scroll down for a nice summary table:

https://dqydj.com/net-worth-by-age-calculator-united-states/

Having said that, your point is valid in that it takes a couple hundred $K, but not 7 digits, to have median NW as an older person.

 

[kgtest]

I know this forum has plenty of simple people. I would search for the "long time lurker" or first time poster threads. This might be an assumption but based off my own experience...but I was simple at one time, and still am. I was also super poor when I joined this forum. I think I was earning about $36,000 a year and had just started my first IT job. This forum pushed me to create more opportunities which has only helped my FI goals. I remember being totally intimidated by some of the folks NW and "current assets" and seeing all these just crossed the 1MM mark etc etc. Folks talking about always getting the maximum Social Security credits etc. I am finally in that boat for the first year ever this year...my father NEVER had a year where he received the maximum social security credits but managed to amass quite a net worth. Everyone's situation is different really but I think if you participate and stick with this forum without fear, you will greatly benefit.

Knowledge is power and there is more knowledge packed into this ER forum than I could read in a lifetime of books. The one thing you don't always get from a book is the healthy debates that come from this forum, and the excellent moderation. Even if someone gets snarky or a negative tone, its always addressed. I have had a few times where folks have crossed the line and moderators were always quick to address it. I probably crossed the line myself and had my hand slapped...everyone is guilty of having a bad day.

I wish you the best of luck and encourage you to ask as many questions as you feel comfortable. Not everyone is going to FAT FIRE...and money is not everything. Health is important. Having what only you would consider a good QOL is important. And avoiding big costly mistakes is huge.

 

[street]

Only my underwear...

.....but they have to be on sale!

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

this reminds me of this old poster from my teaching career

That's very much like the I was thinking of, but the one I remembered had the highest rate for "Useful answers", since they can and often are completely distinct from (technically) correct answers.

 

[Gumby]

Only my underwear...

.....but they have to be on sale!

I'll let you in on my secret - Old Navy boxers; they usually have half-price sales a couple times a year.