Coronavirus - Health and preparedness aspects - II

[Just_Steve]

What does water smell like to you?

Water smells like nothing to me. Zero smell. The solution in the spray bottle could have some hydrogen peroxide in it, but I wouldn't know. It's definitely not alcohol-based.

I was going to go with nothing but didn't know if you had skunky water.

 

[NW-Bound]

It will be interesting to watch the outbreak at the nursing home in Kirkland, Washington, to learn how the virus spread.

Of the 31 firefighters and 3 policemen who assisted the transport of sick patients to the hospital and who have been in quarantine, one has tested positive.

The nursing home had 120 residents, 20 have died. The virus can erupt very fast.

“Our experience so far shows that the virus is volatile, unpredictable, we’ve had patients within an hour time who showed no symptoms, going to acute symptoms, being transferred to the hospital and have had patients die relatively quickly,” press liaison Timothy Killian said Saturday.

Same as seen elsewhere, older people are vulnerable, but even people above 40 get infected more readily.

The Department of Health released a breakdown of coronavirus cases by age for the first time on Sunday. The vast majority of positive cases were in people 40 years of age and older, with the largest number of cases concentrated in people 80 years old and above.

Department data on Monday said that 70% of those who tested positive were age 50 or older.

Of the 180 workers at the nursing home, 70 showed symptoms as of 2 days ago.

 

[Alan]

I noticed the first signs of panic buying today in our local supermarkets. The shelf area with sanitizer gels and wipes was empty. Lots of everything else as far as I could see, including TP.

Being hikers we have little bottles of sanitizer that we top up from a large bottle we have.

I go into town every day for breakfast, lunch or just for coffee, and I have not seen a single person using sanitizer gel, so what are they doing with it all? At home we use soap and water and only use the gel when we are somewhere that doesn't have washing facilities.

 

[jollystomper]

Just curious, but are you running a library? Where do you keep 3,500 books??

Large bookcases . The vast majority are DW's, she can be kind of OCD about owning books, she has about 10 bookcases in our home, many deep enough to hold 2 rows of books.


It could be worse, at her peak she probably had over 5,000 books herself. She decided that maybe she had too many books and started trimming down. But it is painful for her to get rid of books.

 

[sengsational]

Evidently, hydrogen peroxide is only good for 30-45 days (full potency) after the bottle is opened, and it eventually turns into water, so we need to keep that in mind... And keep it in a dark place (inside a purse in a dark-coloured spray bottle and discard in a month?)

I wish I had bought small bottles of hydrogen peroxide, as my big ones will start going bad as soon as I open them...

Sorry, what I meant is it smells like water and has the consistency of water. No alcohol smell or anything that I could detect. It doesn't mean it doesn't clean. I just don't trust it, is all. I guess I could have brought my own disinfectant with me, but I just decided to quit and work out at home.

Talking about H ₂O ₂, that's probably what they're spraying.

Talking about H ₂O ₂ 'turning into water', I'm sure it happens over a very long period, but I believe that if it's kept in a sealed container, it lasts a very long time (years).

Why do I think hydrogen peroxide lasts a good while? Because I'm pretty clumsy when I work around the house. I'm always getting a scrape. But it only takes a 1/2 teaspoon of hydrogen peroxide to cleanse one of my many wounds, so a quart (or whatever it is), lasts years. I'm getting to the point here, finally, even after I use an old bottle on a wound, it still "fizzes". If I dripped water on the wound, it would certainly not fizz. But even a years-old bottle of hydrogen peroxide fizzes. I have to conclude that it's still got at least some of it's original oxygen molecules.

I don't know the reason H ₂O ₂ breaks down, but there was an indication in this thread the clock started when you opened the bottle. That would indicate that air was the problem. How about squeezing the bottle to remove the air, then screwing the cap tightly? That would work for the first one-third of the bottle, or so, until the bottle couldn't be comfortably compressed. You could find a smaller bottle, but transferring would expose it to air (probably not a good idea). You could "rack" the liquid (as we do in beer brewing), which limits exposure to the air. But it's probably just easier to buy more peroxide, presuming you can get it.

 

[doneat54]

Realizing lately how much less near-human contact I have since I retired. Grocery store and Lowes are probably biggest risks. That and DW is still working so she risks bringing something home. Still go to the gym but only play racquetball so not a lot of touchy stuff going on. Had to empty a kitchen cabinet yesterday to move it and found another bottle of sanitizer in there.... sweet.

Not going nuts, just trying to be more conscious of things, touching, washing, social distance. I would have zero problem quarantining if needed, plenty of hobbies that keep me happy and that are no where near another person.

Will be interesting to look back on this whole year in hindsight eventually. "2020, oh yeah, and remember CoVID-19"

 

[JoeWras]

This thing is easy to spread.

We got 5 cases confirmed overnight in NC. They all came from a conference of managers held in Boston. Unsure how many attended infected, but it was at least 1, probably from Italy.

So, 2 weeks later, there are at least 32 cases out of 175 attendees. That's pretty significant.

 

[harllee]

This thing is easy to spread.

We got 5 cases confirmed overnight in NC. They all came from a conference of managers held in Boston. Unsure how many attended infected, but it was at least 1, probably from Italy.

So, 2 weeks later, there are at least 32 cases out of 175 attendees. That's pretty significant.

Joe I am in NC near that outbreak. DH and I are near 70 and DH has a compromised immune system from the medications he has to take for psoriatic arthritis. So we are taking some steps that are hard for us since we are extroverts--no more Church for a while, let our fitness center membership lapse, making a last trip for a while to the library to get a lot of books (how do you sanitize books?), no more parties or large gathering, canceling a trip in a couple of weeks to Florida, etc. This will test our patience.

 

[audreyh1]

This thing is easy to spread.

We got 5 cases confirmed overnight in NC. They all came from a conference of managers held in Boston. Unsure how many attended infected, but it was at least 1, probably from Italy.

So, 2 weeks later, there are at least 32 cases out of 175 attendees. That's pretty significant.

Those conferences are just terrible! Lots of cases seem to be coming from conferences and then spreading because people are returning home immediately, feel fine for several days and go about their normal activity including the office.

 

[JoeWras]

Those conferences are just terrible! Lots of cases seem to be coming from conferences and then spreading because people are returning home immediately, feel fine for several days and go about their normal activity including the office.

Yes.

And they are designed to create close contact for espirit de corps. Tons of handshaking. Small break out conferences. Shared meals. Trips to the bar afterwards. Etc.

Most are being cancelled and need to be.

 

[garyt]

Quit planet fitness last month as I do not trust their disinfectant spray. It seems like water to me.

I agree. And now the PF near me went to that brown paper towel that is non absorbent. You can't clean much of anything with it. I'm debating working out at home or bringing my own wipes. But I believe even the wipes need to sit like 3 minutes to really work. That adds a lot of time to a workout .

 

[TromboneAl]

Article in today's WSJ pointed out that the actual number of infected here in the U.S. is at least one and likely two orders of magnitude higher than the currently reported number.

I think this is probably true, and it mirrors what the governor of California said. People have been saying this for a while.

However.

1. I haven't seen the kind of sudden jump in cases that would happen when all of these people develop symptoms—OTOH, maybe the increases we're seeing are due exactly to this.
2. I've yet to see a news report that says "Although there are no confirmed cases in XX county, local physicians have reported a lot of patients and calls describing flu-like symptoms.

 

[audreyh1]

I think this is probably true, and it mirrors what the governor of California said. People have been saying this for a while.

However.

1. I haven't seen the kind of sudden jump in cases that would happen when all of these people develop symptoms—OTOH, maybe the increases we're seeing are due exactly to this.
2. I've yet to see a news report that says "Although there are no confirmed cases in XX county, local physicians have reported a lot of patients and calls describing flu-like symptoms.

There are big jumps in cases in several cities happening overnight recently. I think it’s that the testing hasn’t begun to catch up. We’ll have a better picture in a month assuming testing has caught up, but that’s too late for those of us who have to deal with plans now.

 

[TromboneAl]

Still no info on acquired immunity (I know I asked this before)?

Shouldn't it be possible to determine whether the body acquires immunity or resistance to the virus once a person has had it?

Can't you test the blood of a recovered COVID-19 patient for antibodies?

This is important information. If you acquire immunity, there could be some sense in desiring to get the virus now and be done with it.

 

[garyt]

So much for a 2 week supply of stuff, not that anyone here really believed it would be necessary for only that long, right?

CDC tells people over 60 or who have chronic illnesses like diabetes to stock up on goods and buckle down for a lengthy stay at home



There's some good advice for all ages in the article, if only people will follow it, when possible. I did cancel my dental appointment today. Aside from that, I'll try to keep more groceries and other things on hand and do most of my shopping during less busy times.

Just saw a post on FB from some guy in a group I joined saying "I'm 47 and in good health, I'm not doing anything about coronavirus" or something to that effect. Unfortunately that attitude may be pervasive in the low risk category people who figure "It's not my problem". I did reply that that attitude could lead to the spread of the virus and even the death of some older or health compromised individual, but I doubt it will have an effect on him. It's why I also think there'll be more than a few people who even if they know they have the virus, if it's minor to them, will still go out and about and not isolate.

 

[Corporateburnout]

So, 2 weeks later, there are at least 32 cases out of 175 attendees. That's pretty significant.

Actually 32 cases are MA residents not including other cases from other US states and Europe. So there are many more cases resulting from this conference. Also not all of the 32 cases are Biogen employees, some are Marriott employees where the conference was held.

It would have been prudent for the company to cancel the conference rather than going ahead with gatherings that threatens other people at a time of epidemic.

 

[JoeWras]

Actually 32 cases are MA residents not including other cases from other US states and Europe. So there are many more cases resulting from this conference. Also not all of the 32 cases are Biogen employees, some are Marriott employees where the conference was held.

It would have been prudent for the company to cancel the conference rather than going ahead with gatherings that threatens other people at a time of epidemic.

Ah, the numbers thrown in the article are confusing. I also see the number "300" attended. I guess 175 was the Biogen portion.

The take away no matter what was that it distributed a heck of a lot of cases.

 

[harllee]

DH and I are hunkering down at home. I want to make one last trip to the public library and get a bunch of books (I know I can read online but I like real books). How can I sanitize books before I bring them in the house? Should I wipe them down with disinfectant wipes? Leave them on the porch for a while? I will wear gloves when I am at the library and of course wash hands and use the Nettie pot when I get home.

 

[braumeister]

How can I sanitize books before I bring them in the house?

Heat them to at least 451°F and they should be safe.

 

[Sunny]

.... I'm always getting a scrape. But it only takes a 1/2 teaspoon of hydrogen peroxide to cleanse one of my many wounds, so a quart (or whatever it is), lasts years.

Just in case you didn’t know....hydrogen peroxide on cuts and scrapes isn’t suggested anymore, it can actually harm the tissue and delay healing.

You’d be much better off rinsing with water and putting some neosporin on (which is magical stuff if you ask me).

https://www.davisregional.com/news-room/why-you-should-stop-using-hydrogen-peroxide-on-wou-13469 Is just one of many, many articles if you google it.

 

[Sunny]

DH and I are hunkering down at home. I want to make one last trip to the public library and get a bunch of books (I know I can read online but I like real books). How can I sanitize books before I bring them in the house? Should I wipe them down with disinfectant wipes? Leave them on the porch for a while? I will wear gloves when I am at the library and of course wash hands and use the Nettie pot when I get home.

Softer material doesn’t pass on the virus as readily, but yes, just wipe down with some antibacterial wipes or paper towel with the liquid. If you can keep the surface wet-ish for even 30 seconds great, a few minutes better. Should be good to go.

Or stick it in the sun for a day and have no likely worries too?

 

[Rianne]

Nice thing about hydrogen peroxide

I put HP in my ears, use it as a mouthwash, clean vegetables, wipe countertops you can't do that with alcohol. It's easy and safe to use, as long as you dilute properly. It will disinfect your clothes while washing. Should NOT use it to clean wounds or cuts.



https://www.healthline.com/health/hydrogen-peroxide-uses#health

 

[Moemg]

This is important information. If you acquire immunity, there could be some sense in desiring to get the virus now and be done with it.

That would be pure craziness since no one knows how the virus will affect them . The bad cases result in ARDS which is a death sentence .

 

[audreyh1]

Actually 32 cases are MA residents not including other cases from other US states and Europe. So there are many more cases resulting from this conference. Also not all of the 32 cases are Biogen employees, some are Marriott employees where the conference was held.

It would have been prudent for the company to cancel the conference rather than going ahead with gatherings that threatens other people at a time of epidemic.

37 so far including the out of state folks. I’m not sure if that’s just for the US.

 

[Gumby]

Still no info on acquired immunity (I know I asked this before)?

Shouldn't it be possible to determine whether the body acquires immunity or resistance to the virus once a person has had it?

Can't you test the blood of a recovered COVID-19 patient for antibodies?

This is important information. If you acquire immunity, there could be some sense in desiring to get the virus now and be done with it.

You could start your research on acquired immunity here:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3810961/