Could you retire without social security?

[wcv56]

Might of been a good option if they would of used it to support State muni funds in the past at set rates of 3.5% or 4% and have received return payments every 6 months for loans not to exceed 7 year periods of loan. They money available would of
doubbled in 15 years or so. This would of also given states lower borrowing fees to support only the AAA quality parts of the muni fund sector.

One thing that I have noticed as I travel in several countries over the last 35+ years is that there is alot of under 55 disabled people drawing ss that don't seem to have a whole lot wrong with them and some how they have gamed the system. Many have picked up foreign dependants who they try like hell to get under the ss system for the increases in their own benefit raises or to pass on a legacy to their much younger dependants who have not contributed much to the system.

This has the doubble whammy effect as the money is bled from our system and supports a foreign business to compete against us and as most of you know they do not have a 15.6% cost for their own businesses that ours do that we now compete against. No wonder why businesses move their production to other countries.

If you add in the state, fed and ss taxes our businesses operate under they can do the same in a third world country with a third of the taxes to be paid out. If we added a ss tax (half our rate) to all imports maybe it would be more fair or different.
JMHO

 

[wcv56]

What if we went back 20 years and told all of the businesses that have moved employment positions overseas, they must pay the ss on each position for the next 3 to 5 years. In the past I think they received huge tax write offs for doing such, this may help the bleed of what our country has seen in the last 20 years.

I am sure I am missing a bit of the big picture but this sure does seem like a practicle fix to some of our ss problems.

 

[Westernskies]

If we added a ss tax (half our rate) to all imports maybe it would be more fair or different.JMHO

Three words: World Trade Organization

 

[harley]

My point was why not count on SS if it lets you retire a number of years earlier than you could if you don't count on it? I guess if you really love your j*b, 40+hr work week, and commute, then you are well served by not counting on SS in your estimate of a retirement portfolio, but then I would also suggest that you not count your public pension (for those that have one) in order to be equally safe and conservative.

Maybe everyone in the 60% section of the poll is not depending on a public pension in their retirement plans, but I sure do see a lot of posts about FIRE where people say "I have x saved and will get a small pension" instead of "I have x saved and may get a small pension but have left it out of my calculations just like I am leaving out SS"

Truthfully, I wouldn't have counted on a pension from my megacorp either. I'm just not comfortable counting on money that's in someone else's control. I wouldn't put it past them to default on it in the future. Gov't employees may feel differently.

In my case and many others that I have read about in other threads, staying at the job was to get retirement medical benefits, not a pension. I stayed 3 years past when I reached my number so that I would not have to deal with pre-exisiting conditions on the open market. Although that may go away now with Obamacare. My megacorp was one of the first to be reported as considering kicking us to the curb once the details are worked out. [Edit] And that right there is a perfect example of why I don't feel comfortable counting on someone else, especially someone who is a gov't or a corporation. Promises mean pretty much nothing. [end of edit]

But still, I just am not comfortable counting on something (SS) that was 12 years out (minimum) when I retired. So I made sure I could stay retired without it. I just don't have enough control over it to count on it. That's my choice, my logic, and I'm happy with it. You go ahead and do things the way you want. I'm not trying to talk you into anything, just answering a question. And I can guarantee, no matter how logical your calculations seem to you, I'm not going to change my mind. Sort of like the paying off the mortgage thing. Different people have different opinions, and seldom get their mind changed.

 

[wcv56]

Maybe some how WTO needs to understand we run a debt with about every nation we trade with, we are at unsubstainable levels of debt. If we imported some of the same items many these countries export to us, there is a 100% import tax to do so.

Let's start an OPEC style of trading with grains and what not, this should open eyes.
When we are bancrupt (which we are for the most part) can we then use reciprical laws and regulation. We can't even ask if a person has an ID or visa so maybe the WTO needs to go the way as the U.N. and have some pressure put on it. Europe sure has been complaining much the last few years.

 

[M Paquette]

Truthfully, I wouldn't have counted on a pension from my megacorp either. I'm just not comfortable counting on money that's in someone else's control. I wouldn't put it past them to default on it in the future.

I have a close relative who worked for a major airline. They used one of their more recent bankruptcies to toss their pension plan over to the folks at the Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation. The good news is that he has a pension. The bad news is that it's one heck of a lot smaller, and once he starts Social Security, that will be applied as an offset, shrinking his pension further.

The CEO and executive team were rewarded for their efforts, and the valuable cost savings, of course. CEO gets a 950K annual pension, and the top 5 executives get a combined 2.5M annually in pension, along with lifetime healthcare and travel.