Done with Bogleheads ... it's a cult

[rodi]

For all those complaining about how BH requires strict adherence to John Bogle's writings.... Well - it's in the name. (john)BOGLEheads.

It's not Rodi-heads. It's not njhowie-heads... (Picking on njhowie only because he started the thread and I didn't feel like going back to get all the user names who expressed opinions on the bh forum.)

I have no problem with bogleheads... lots of info there and I used their wiki-pages a lot when figuring out my retirement plan, 3 fund portfolio (at Schwab and Fidelity, vs Vanguard) etc...

BUT - and this is a big one... As W2R mentioned, it's less friendly over there. Here we can kid each other etc. We're just generally friendlier and lower key. I like it here better.

As for the strictness over at BH vs here.. We're more relaxed, but we still have rules. Perhaps folks should re-read the community rules periodically. I say that as a mod who is basically lazy, and wants fewer posts we need to moderate... After all, I'm retired.

 

[Graybeard]

For all those complaining about how BH requires strict adherence to John Bogle's writings.... Well - it's in the name. (john)BOGLEheads.

It's not Rodi-heads. It's not njhowie-heads... (Picking on njhowie only because he started the thread and I didn't feel like going back to get all the user names who expressed opinions on the bh forum.)

I have no problem with bogleheads... lots of info there and I used their wiki-pages a lot when figuring out my retirement plan, 3 fund portfolio (at Schwab and Fidelity, vs Vanguard) etc...

BUT - and this is a big one... As W2R mentioned, it's less friendly over there. Here we can kid each other etc. We're just generally friendlier and lower key. I like it here better.

As for the strictness over at BH vs here.. We're more relaxed, but we still have rules. Perhaps folks should re-read the community rules periodically. I say that as a mod who is basically lazy, and wants fewer posts we need to moderate... After all, I'm retired.

Well said!.

I was at BH long before I found this place. There's some good and bad at the BH site, like every site you won't agree with everyone on everything.

Basically, the philosophy of index funds and not market timing is good advice for me, I'm not qualified to pick individual equities and always held index funds other than in my 401k when back then they were not offered. Today I have come to realize that bond funds are not where I want to be and have learned about buying treasuries here.

I visit BH from time to time but when I read some of the fixed income threads it's like PhD level quantum physics! I've had posts edited or removed at BH, IMO they are way too strict and I'm not referring to politics and religion. The BH site has some interesting threads but the moderation is too strict IMO.

Frankly, I like the atmosphere here better, it is more relaxed and friendly so you'll have to kick me out the door cuz I'm not leaving.

 

[Bruno]

I held mostly Vanguard funds before i ever knew about BH or ER. BH has some really good people. If you got a question about insurance or annuitys STINKY is the man. To be honest BH main thing is 3 or 4 fund for life and they dont get off track very much. ER has some of the same little clicks and set in their ways. Lately i have been hanging out in the FIDO community more.

 

[Koolau]

I think it's okay to believe Jack was very special and still find BH to be cultish. I've looked a few times and just left. Nothing for me there.

 

[Markola]

Meh, different strokes for different folks. I read the Nisiprius “Time to evaluate your jitters” thread and thought it was good. And I read Taylor Larrimore’s “The Three Fund Portfolio.” I subscribe to the Bogleheads On Investing Podcast that Rick Ferri hosts. That’s about all I need from them.

 

[6miths]

Like many others, I don't go to the site very often anymore but did find it useful back in the day. I also went to a few of their 'Reunions' and met some interesting people and had some great discussions. I didn't find the moderation too onerous and the underlying messages were pretty useful. But times change and sites evolve as do we as individuals. I certainly am thankful that the site provided things I needed many years ago.

 

[daylatedollarshort]

I've enjoyed the poster Bobcat2's posts on Bogleheads. He is not a three fund portfolio guy at all yet for some reason he seems to be tolerated and allowed to make useful posts on asset matching strategies. I will go there sometimes to see if he has posted anything recently, but he doesn't seem to post much there these days.

 

[Midpack]

For all those complaining about how BH requires strict adherence to John Bogle's writings.... Well - it's in the name. (john)BOGLEheads.

It's not Rodi-heads. It's not njhowie-heads... (Picking on njhowie only because he started the thread and I didn't feel like going back to get all the user names who expressed opinions on the bh forum.)

I have no problem with bogleheads... lots of info there and I used their wiki-pages a lot when figuring out my retirement plan, 3 fund portfolio (at Schwab and Fidelity, vs Vanguard) etc...

BUT - and this is a big one... As W2R mentioned, it's less friendly over there. Here we can kid each other etc. We're just generally friendlier and lower key. I like it here better.

As for the strictness over at BH vs here.. We're more relaxed, but we still have rules. Perhaps folks should re-read the community rules periodically. I say that as a mod who is basically lazy, and wants fewer posts we need to moderate... After all, I'm retired.

+1. There’s going to be some level of groupthink on any forum (e.g. LBYM, anti annuity here). While I spend more time here, BH has been a very valuable resource as well. There have been times I’ve gotten answers at BH that weren’t available here. There are some very smart people on both forums, in time you learn who to listen to (on certain topics), and not.

As to politics, ER.org is pretty strict as well. But having been on another forum where they let politics run wild, I MUCH prefer keeping politics out on forums focused on other topics. That devolved into chaos with the same people spouting the same ideas over and over and over, with ever worse personal insults. These days civil discussions on politics seem rare…better left off most forums.

 

[njhowie]

...I MUCH prefer keeping politics out on forums focused on other topics.

I completely agree.

HOWEVER - when you have a finance website, banning discussion which references the US Treasury and Federal Reserve is similar, in my view, to amputating the legs of a track and field star.

 

[Midpack]

I completely agree.

HOWEVER - when you have a finance website, banning discussion which references the US Treasury and Federal Reserve is similar, in my view, to amputating the legs of a track and field star.

The Treasury and Fed aren’t categorically off limits here that I know of, as long the post doesn’t take a political bent.

No one is perfect and readers have widely varying views. Given that I think the Mods here do a very good job of differentiating in an even handed way.

 

[harllee]

I completely agree.

HOWEVER - when you have a finance website, banning discussion which references the US Treasury and Federal Reserve is similar, in my view, to amputating the legs of a track and field star.

I see plenty of discussions on BH about the Treasury and Federal Reserve. A lot of discussion recently about the interest rate increase and whether it will affect CD rates, etc. BH does not allow discussion about pending legislation, which I think is a good thing, but once legislation is passed and signed into law it can be discussed on BH so long as the discussion is not political.

 

[RetMD21]

Meh, different strokes for different folks. I read the Nisiprius “Time to evaluate your jitters” thread and thought it was good. And I read Taylor Larrimore’s “The Three Fund Portfolio.” I subscribe to the Bogleheads On Investing Podcast that Rick Ferri hosts. That’s about all I need from them.

I listen to the podcast too. Rick says He was banned for a while but he laughs about it. I think the moderating style might be at least partially overreaction due to the lack of moderation on the old Morningstar forum before BH went independent.

 

[FindingForward]

I like BH overall. Their moderation is super strict! They shut down threads faster than any forum I've seen. One cannot bring up potential SSI viability or as others here said, discuss any regs until they're law. No topics not asking for "actionable" advice. Health/medical or relationship advice? Locked, baby!

But individual bonds vs bond funds? Lordy: that debate has been going on ad nauseum - it's actually a joke among members, similar to the endless "international vs US only" threads. I've seen quite a few posters on the individual bond side. Most discussions seem to stay civil.

I'm NOT saying OP or anyone here has done this, but when brand new posters join long-time forums, just to rile up members and educate them on their "misguided" ways, it's obnoxious. They post something inflammatory: bond funds are for suckers or that anyone with bond funds needs to learn basic investing.

As an example: someone upthread referred to members as "bozoheads". If that's the tone they took on BH - even if they didn't name call - odds are mods would delete them. No berating or insults allowed.

Will say all forums - cruises, hobbies, finance - have that clique mentality. Anyone challenging popular posters (rightly or wrongly) get grief from sycophantic supporters, even when making perfectly reasonable arguments.

 

[Markola]

I listen to the podcast too. Rick says He was banned for a while but he laughs about it. I think the moderating style might be at least partially overreaction due to the lack of moderation on the old Morningstar forum before BH went independent.

Ha. Interesting. He’s in the Vanguard pantheon, so I figured he knew all the BH moderators, the password and the secret handshake.

 

[target2019]

What does your IPS say?

"You don't have an IPS? Well that tells me a lot."

I think many of the same knee-jerk responses affect other forums. Like the sea of text of quotations in response to a simple question.

But the advice is generally good, like you should have an IPS. But I recognize that there are many roads to Dublin. Maype I just need to get to Dublin by hearing which road is best? Lol.

 

[target2019]

I completely agree.

HOWEVER - when you have a finance website, banning discussion which references the US Treasury and Federal Reserve is similar, in my view, to amputating the legs of a track and field star.

I think your point is practical, but the stock answer is, "Use the 3-fund and don't listen to noise." For me and many others investing life is about asking questions and wanting to know how things work. If a forum doesn't support that inquisitiveness, then it's not worth much. After all I can read the $10 Bogle book and use the excellent advice to build my own solution.

 

[VanWinkle]

I no longer go the the BH site either.

I posted something "off kilter" about the Vanguard BND fund and got sent to stand in the corner with no dinner that night. Once was enough.

Very rich folks there but many lack "thinking outside of the Bogle box".

That last line of your quote may explain it all!!!

 

[HawkOwl]

For all those complaining about how BH requires strict adherence to John Bogle's writings.... Well - it's in the name. (john)BOGLEheads.

It's not Rodi-heads. It's not njhowie-heads... (Picking on njhowie only because he started the thread and I didn't feel like going back to get all the user names who expressed opinions on the bh forum.)

This is a good point. A forum focusing on a specific strategy will focus on that strategy. A more generalist forum like ER might be expected to tolerate a wider range of posts.

Is this good or bad? The investment principles of Jack Bogle have stood the test of time (so far). In a world where investment decisions are often based on flawed logic or plain old intuition, challenging certain “alternative” strategies might be an act of tough love.

 

[VanWinkle]

I see plenty of discussions on BH about the Treasury and Federal Reserve. A lot of discussion recently about the interest rate increase and whether it will affect CD rates, etc. BH does not allow discussion about pending legislation, which I think is a good thing, but once legislation is passed and signed into law it can be discussed on BH so long as the discussion is not political.

^^^^^This!!

 

[pacergal]

I started out here after finding FIREcalc, and found bogleheads through the recommended reading from folks here.
I am not registered or participate on bogleheads, but I do read threads occasionally.
The WIKI pages helped me learn quite a bit.
And for that I am grateful.

Like it here much better! And still learn something every day.

 

[scrabbler1]

I visit there often but read very few threads and post even more rarely (which isn't much different from this forum BTW). The moderators over there are a little quicker to remove or edit posts. Like here, I have picked up a few useful tips, mostly not having to do with investing.

I never thought of BH as a cult, though.

 

[target2019]

I started out here after finding FIREcalc, and found bogleheads through the recommended reading from folks here.
I am not registered or participate on bogleheads, but I do read threads occasionally.
The WIKI pages helped me learn quite a bit.
And for that I am grateful.

Like it here much better! And still learn something every day.

Those Wiki pages are golden, IMO. Each one is a mini-course.

 

[pb4uski]

How is BH handling the slow decay of customer service at Vanguard? I doesn't make the index funds that they sell any different but it make dealing with Vanguard alot different. Perhaps they have accounts at other brokers and just invest in Vanguard funds with those brokers.

 

[tulak]

I visit BH occasionally, usually when I'm thinking about something investment specific. I visited more often over a decade ago when I started to build my portfolio. I'm mostly an indexer, but I'm not afraid to be active when needed.

I happened to look at BH the other day and found this thread about Stable Value Funds: https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=381129

I found the link to be helpful, since I'm currently in a Stable Value Fund (most of my FI allocation) and it made me look. My fund is currently yielding 1.6%, which isn't great. So now I'm researching what I should do.

This caused me to visit BH this morning, where I found this thread that quotes the ER forum: https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6799369#p6799369

I found the thread educational, especially the discussion about SEC yield vs distribution yield.

That's what I like about BH. Some of the posters there are knowledgeable and provide a good amount of detail in their responses.

 

[Midpack]

How is BH handling the slow decay of customer service at Vanguard? I doesn't make the index funds that they sell any different but it make dealing with Vanguard alot different. Perhaps they have accounts at other brokers and just invest in Vanguard funds with those brokers.

It appears they have the same concerns, but they seem a little more patient than some here?

https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/vi...guard+service+Vanguard+poor+service&start=400