Horrendous customer service at Vanguard

[Koolau]

Who is going to enforce it? The Post Office.....LOL!

It's rampant around here and no one does anything about it. If I have ANYTHING important to mail, I take it directly to the Post office and go inside. Every one of my bills are paid via the internet.

We are at least fortunate to have mail come to a locked box at the condo. We also have a PO Box for certain mail. But a few years ago, we caught a guy looking into our mail box at our summer place. We bought a lockable mailbox, though it wouldn't stop a strong screw driver if anyone were determined.

We too mail anything sensitive from the USPS building. Things are so different from when I grew up at that house. Bummer.

Returning you now...

 

[RobLJ]

Rolling over from Vanguard to Fidelity

This is a bit off topic, but Friday we moved my wife's Vanguard assets in kind to her larger Fidelity account. The rep scanned her last Vanguard statement, asked a few questions, and said the assets would be moved by this Friday. We also moved a small roll-over of hers (also with Fidelity) into her larger Fidelity account.
We had a good conversation, he alerted us about a GWB option for part of the bond assets, which I'll investigate but no hard sell. We're lucky to have a Fidelity office here in Reno even though it's across town, about a 20 minute drive. Down the road we might use them to set up a bond ladder in DW's account since due to the rules in my 403b Fidelity brokerage, I can't hold individual bonds (or ETFs). I'm using her account for those assets.

My experience with Fidelity has been very good, but your experience may vary of course.

 

[Smilinggirl]

I'm meeting with someone from Schwab later this week to discuss moving my accounts over from Vanguard. After a little more reading, I like that they'll be more active in helping me earn money, whereas I just let it sit in target funds at Vanguard since I don't have a good grasp on investing. There will be fees for this service, but it's probably worth it for me. I wish they were giving bonuses for transferring my accounts, but they aren't right now as far as I could tell. I like that there's an actual office in my town, so I can walk in and speak with someone face to face.

 

[Canoeboy]

After knocking my head against the wall with hour+ long wait times, I now attempt to call VG between 8-10 am. Have found much shorter waits, often between a few to 10 minutes.

Have had mixed experiences at VG over the past year, ranging from exceptional to horrific. Usually the service is better when you get someone more specialized than the base CSR. Had exceptional service when I was establishing multiple accounts and on many other calls. Most horrific experience when making transactions between Employer held accounts and Individual investor accounts. Those two sides (silos) of VG are incapable of working/communicating between themselves. Almost left VG last year when they royally messed up a 350k transaction from 401k to IRA by retroactively undoing it (apparently by VG mistake) 45 days after it was correctly made, without notice, and after investments were made in the IRA.

Thankfully most future transactions are simple and can be done online.

 

[PaunchyPirate]

I'm meeting with someone from Schwab later this week to discuss moving my accounts over from Vanguard. After a little more reading, I like that they'll be more active in helping me earn money, whereas I just let it sit in target funds at Vanguard since I don't have a good grasp on investing. There will be fees for this service, but it's probably worth it for me. I wish they were giving bonuses for transferring my accounts, but they aren't right now as far as I could tell. I like that there's an actual office in my town, so I can walk in and speak with someone face to face.

Schwab will offer a bonus if you’re moving a substantial amount. Unless they’ve stopped in the last month or so. They agreed to give me a bonus in late January. I told them I was going to choose between Fidelity or Schwab. You’ll probably need to be moving more than $1 Million.

 

[Smilinggirl]

Schwab will offer a bonus if you’re moving a substantial amount. Unless they’ve stopped in the last month or so. They agreed to give me a bonus in late January. I told them I was going to choose between Fidelity or Schwab. You’ll probably need to be moving more than $1 Million.

Unfortunately, I don't have that much to move. I still like the idea of having someone actively helping me and having a real, in person office I can go to when I have questions though, so I guess it's worth it even without the bonus.

 

[Gearhead Jim]

We've had good results with Vanguard for many years, but Schwab...

In December Schwab sent me an unrequested and unnecessary second RMD check from my 401k.
I called and explained that I didn't want that and they should reverse the disbursement ASAP, before the end of the year. They agreed.
In January, we talked again and they "were having trouble getting back the tax withholding from their bank."
A couple of weeks later they call me and say they still can't get the withholding back, is it ok if it just turns into some extra withholding for 2022? Reluctantly I agree.
Then I take steps to transfer my account (~$110k) to Vanguard. They want notarized permission from my wife to do this, which I send.
Then they send me an email saying that they can't or won't do the transfer without taking out a 2023 RMD before transferring. Eventually they mail me a check.
They will not transfer my money directly to Vanguard, insist on sending me a FBO to me check. I dropped that in the mail to Vanguard yesterday.

During all of this, Schwab sent me one of those "how was your experience?" forms.
For the question about my investment objectives, I stated that "My goal is to get my money as far away from Schwab as possible, as quickly as possible."

 

[Gearhead Jim]

Who is going to enforce it? The Post Office.....LOL!
...

In December, the USPS started running a TV commercial about how they deliver anywhere, "From Holiday Hills, Illinois to (some other Christmas name)."
They showed the nice village sign outdoors saying "Holiday Hills, Illinois".

The problem is, I used to work in Holiday Hills. The sign they showed does not exist and never existed anywhere in or near that town. The street they showed it on does not exist.

We live in the far suburban boonies from Chicago (not in Holiday Hills), fortunately our local P.O. is nice and our local carrier is excellent.

 

[athena53]

I'm meeting with someone from Schwab later this week to discuss moving my accounts over from Vanguard. After a little more reading, I like that they'll be more active in helping me earn money, whereas I just let it sit in target funds at Vanguard since I don't have a good grasp on investing. There will be fees for this service, but it's probably worth it for me.

Tread carefully. Read up on "Asset allocation" and check out some of the related threads here. Many people are beating the market just by staying invested in a few index funds (SPY, ONEQ, etc.) and periodically rebalancing. Remember that when they're charging a % of assets under management they have to do that much better than the market in order for your results to match the market.

It's what I'd do if I had it to do all over again and I'm certainly shifting in that direction.

 

[orbops]

Currently with Vanguard, but will be transferring all my money to Fidelity or Schwab (once the TD Ameritrade merger is completed). I am tired of 60min+ hold times, and email responses taking over a week. I had an Inherited Roth account, and the 2 times I needed to wire money, it was a horrible experience that took close to 2 hrs each call. What's worse is that same day wire transfer needed to be submitted before 9:30AM PT, so living on the West Coast meant I had to call them around 7AM PT to try set up the wire transfer. Additionally, they had to get a supervisor to approve of the wire transfer, even though it is my money.

Any time I've called them, I typically have to wait over an hour - even though I'm a Vanguard Voyager client (which is worthless now that they eliminated dedicated Voyager client support).

 

[Koolau]

Currently with Vanguard, but will be transferring all my money to Fidelity or Schwab (once the TD Ameritrade merger is completed). I am tired of 60min+ hold times, and email responses taking over a week. I had an Inherited Roth account, and the 2 times I needed to wire money, it was a horrible experience that took close to 2 hrs each call. What's worse is that same day wire transfer needed to be submitted before 9:30AM PT, so living on the West Coast meant I had to call them around 7AM PT to try set up the wire transfer. Additionally, they had to get a supervisor to approve of the wire transfer, even though it is my money.

Any time I've called them, I typically have to wait over an hour - even though I'm a Vanguard Voyager client (which is worthless now that they eliminated dedicated Voyager client support).

Interesting. I had a critical issue occur and it needed resolution quickly. Basically, the Roth that we started for daughter still comes to our address. The USPS has suddenly stopped recognizing her name and is returning her stuff to Vanguard. So our accounts were all on hold - not just daughters. Not sure if I fault Vanguard for that, but at least they notified me.

I called Vanguard this AM (so roughly 2:00PM their time.) I got a robot that I only needed two stabs at getting a "representative" menu. Once I ID'd the "issue" to the robot's satisfaction, I was put on hold for (wait for it) 3 minutes. I reached a guy who's 1st language was different than mine. He was a bit difficult to understand, but he led me through the process I needed to follow on the web site. He confirmed that all the changes had been made and that I was good to go.

Now, I won't know until I receive more mailings (and DD receives mailings at her address) if it really w*rked. But the experience was nothing like I've been hearing about in these pages. And, full disclosure, I've never had the horrendous wait times folks have been talking about though YMMV.

 

[FREE866]

One other thing about Vanguard that really irks me--they have no storefronts.



One thing I really really appreciate about Schwab is if I need to drop off checks or forms I can walk 7 blocks and walk into their office. I like that.


And when I was having absolutely maddingly frustrating customer service experiences with VG last month I couldn't see anyone face to face, and it just added to the stress, for me anyway.

 

[foxfirev5]

As someone who prefers the status quo I hate this stuff. I keep Vanguard accounts just to not have all my eggs in one basket. Simple Roth accounts with VG funds and no trading. However, I keep getting messages to convert to the brokerage platform. This was done over three years ago. (Over seven figures which I guess is nothing these days)

However DW and I have one account that has a zero balance that those morons are incapable of closing. Zero balance yet enough to generate emails that we are a burden and costing them money since we have not yet converted to a brokerage account.

Every time I call I'm told that this should clear up "next month". I simply reply that "if you're any good you should find a better job". Vanguard is not where it's at.

 

[Koolau]

One other thing about Vanguard that really irks me--they have no storefronts.



One thing I really really appreciate about Schwab is if I need to drop off checks or forms I can walk 7 blocks and walk into their office. I like that.


And when I was having absolutely maddingly frustrating customer service experiences with VG last month I couldn't see anyone face to face, and it just added to the stress, for me anyway.

Yeah, I would really like a face-to-face experience, but I do like V's very low prices. I'm sure that's one way they hold the line is by a "no-frills" approach.

Here are a couple of reviews of Schwab vs Vanguard. The first seems to give the nod to V because of lower prices on mutual funds. The second gives more of a nod to Schwab based on brokerage service and brokerage fees. I guess ya pays yer money and takes yer choice depending on your emphasis (stock trading or long term mutual fund investing.) YMMV.

https://fortunly.com/articles/vanguard-vs-schwab/

https://tokenist.com/investing/vanguard-vs-charles-schwab/

 

[rodi]

I've posted here several times over the years about the nightmare that happened when my father passed. He had an IRA, brokerage, and 529 accounts for my boys. My sister was the executor and filled out the proper paperwork for the IRA/brokerage stuff and mailed in a certified death certificate. Two weeks later they said they didn't have it. So she mailed another... They didn't get it. Third try she did the signature required mail and magically they got the death certificate. It then took them over 2 months to transfer the money as inherited accounts to Schwab (where my father also had had accounts and who processed things very quickly).

So now it's my turn to deal with the small 529 accounts I inherited (ownership) that benefit my sons. On the phone, Vanguard sees that my father has passed, and that they have received all the paperwork, including death certificates... but they can't do anything with the 529's because that's an entirely separate entity - even though they can view each other's systems and verify Vanguard has a death certificate on file. I mail in a death certificate. They lose it. I do the signature required mailing of the death certificate... they sign... but then can't find it. Third try was the charm. (FWIW these certificates have to be certified and cost money and hassle to get.)

I still kept the 529's there, despite the hassles.

Vanguard is great until you die... not so great for the beneficiaries who inherit.

 

[foxfirev5]

Vanguard is great until you die... not so great for the beneficiaries who inherit.

Yeah. I forgot about that one. Major Vanguard PITA when GM passed. A major hassle for relatives. Since I only got the blacksheep 25k I did not get involved.

 

[aja8888]

When my wife passed away last December, her Schwab IRA was passed to me via beneficiary. I filled out the transfer form in 5 minutes, drove to the local Schwab office in 10 minutes, dropped off the form and a death certificate and in two days, the IRA was blended in with mine. Done deal.

Schwab even covered my parking garage fee.

Nothing like a brick and mortar office to serve you.

 

[tulak]

Vanguard is great until you die... not so great for the beneficiaries who inherit.

Rodi, I’m sorry you had to deal with that. I can’t imagine how painful it was.

My experience with Vanguard after my mom passed was easy. She had an IRA, which had to be distributed between three beneficiaries. I don’t remember the details - it was 12 years ago - but the person I dealt with was competent and dealt with creation of three inherited IRAs for each of us.

Maybe I got lucky? It’s also possible that Vanguard was better staffed back then to deal with these issues than today.

 

[PatrickA5]

As quoted above somewhere, my VG inheritance after FILs death was a nightmare as well. We finally got it finished up and all the money moved out.

The only place that has been worse is trying to get a $5,000 insurance policy out of AIG. FIL in law paid on the policy for 45 years. I expect it will take at least that long for us to collect the money. I'm convinced their fax machine is attached to a trash can.

 

[FREE866]

As quoted above somewhere, my VG inheritance after FILs death was a nightmare as well. We finally got it finished up and all the money moved out.

The only place that has been worse is trying to get a $5,000 insurance policy out of AIG. FIL in law paid on the policy for 45 years. I expect it will take at least that long for us to collect the money. I'm convinced their fax machine is attached to a trash can.

" I'm convinced their fax machine is attached to a trash can"


That was good....


yeah for my BIL he had policies with NY Life and Transamerica.....bad experiences with both , but eventually money got sent out....took like 6 weeks....

 

[Koolau]

...death certificate... they sign... but then can't find it. Third try was the charm. (FWIW these certificates have to be certified and cost money and hassle to get.)

I still kept the 529's there, despite the hassles.

Vanguard is great until you die... not so great for the beneficiaries who inherit.

Slightly off topic, but now that you mention death certificates:

When anyone passes the funeral home typically will take care of obtaining death certs, I think (did for my loved ones.) They recommended at least a dozen as they only cost (at that time) $5 each. With a dozen or more, you're good for most eventualities. Getting them on your own is more time consuming and exposes you to more bureaucracy hassles. Just a thought.

 

[Walt34]

When anyone passes the funeral home typically will take care of obtaining death certs, I think (did for my loved ones.) They recommended at least a dozen as they only cost (at that time) $5 each. With a dozen or more, you're good for most eventualities. Getting them on your own is more time consuming and exposes you to more bureaucracy hassles. Just a thought.

When my mother passed I was the administrator (executor) of the estate, and that's exactly what I did, order an even dozen of the death certificates. When the dust settled I had two left. So in some places maybe fifteen wouldn't be too many.

 

[braumeister]

When my mother passed I was the administrator (executor) of the estate, and that's exactly what I did, order an even dozen of the death certificates. When the dust settled I had two left. So in some places maybe fifteen wouldn't be too many.

When my dad died I got ten, but had to go to the county clerk later and buy six more. They were fairly expensive IIRC, so definitely best to get a couple more than you think you'll need.

 

[rodi]

When my dad died I got ten, but had to go to the county clerk later and buy six more. They were fairly expensive IIRC, so definitely best to get a couple more than you think you'll need.

This.

On the topic of funeral home providing... my family is weird... dad donated his body to the local medical school. So we had to get certs. from the county. Even though my sister got 10 - she had to get more when Vanguard kept losing them. And she'd run out when I had to deal with Vanguard for the 529s. I think, between us we probably have 2 extra... 16 years later.

 

[iloveyoga]

I seem to be in the minority, but I had no issues with my Dad's IRA at Vanguard when he died. My Mom was the named beneficiary. I have used them for my IRA for quite a few years too. I have a simple asset allocation and it works for me.