Long term care meeting

[youbet]

as i said folks say we are self insuring ,but to really self insure unless you have a lot of money involves keeping that money safe and a way from potential drops that may make the amount you need unavailable.

Everyone is in their own unique situation as relates to their financial situation and their investment skills and philosophy.

In your case, things have worked out so that self-insuring for LTC apparently would not work out, or would not be optimum. In my case it has.

 

[youbet]

two worked out well, because of Eldercare legal assistance well in advance of the needs,

+1

I certainly agree. Knowledge of the ins and outs of LTC costs and of Medicaid rules can be a huge factor in planning for the final years of one's life, especially for a couple.

My only first hand experience comes from getting MIL situated in a NH and our case was fairly simple. MIL, a long time widow, had no need to leave a legacy and her only asset was the equity left in her condo after netting out a reverse mortgage. This amount turned out to be just right to get her into a nice, primarily private facility where she self-insured for about 18 months and then switched to Medicaid. There was enough money to get her into a quality place but not so much that her heirs were left wringing their hands over lost inheritance. LTCI would likely not have been much help and she couldn't afford it anyway.

OTOH, I'm familiar with several couples with mid-level assets who wish they had LTCI. These are folks with some resources but not enough that a long NH home stay might not impoverish the survivor without some planning and manuvering. In one case, the couple has much more tied up in their house in Wisconsin than they'd otherwise have, but it's their way of making sure LTC costs can't impoverish the survivor.

It's an interesting path to walk and I agree with you that some professional help in determining how to handle things might be called for, especially for a couple or someone with a dependent they need to protect.

 

[user5027]

I told my two children I was paying college tuition instead of buying LTC insurance and asked them to be sure to turn the wheelchair so the sun was not in my eyes and to wipe the drool off my chin. I hope they remember.

 

[meierlde]

+1


OTOH, I'm familiar with several couples with mid-level assets who wish they had LTCI. These are folks with some resources but not enough that a long NH home stay might not impoverish the survivor without some planning and manuvering. In one case, the couple has much more tied up in their house in Wisconsin than they'd otherwise have, but it's their way of making sure LTC costs can't impoverish the survivor.

Speaking a bit tongue in cheek why not get a divorce and shack up. Common law marriage has been repealed. How would medicaid treat two unrelated folks (since after a divorce that is what they would be) living together?

 

[razztazz]

Speaking a bit tongue in cheek why not get a divorce and shack up. Common law marriage has been repealed. How would medicaid treat two unrelated folks (since after a divorce that is what they would be) living together?

Somebody told me this is why The Captain and Tennile got divorced recently. He's got an expensive medical condition

 

[pb4uski]

I told my two children I was paying college tuition instead of buying LTC insurance and asked them to be sure to turn the wheelchair so the sun was not in my eyes and to wipe the drool off my chin. I hope they remember.

And the beauty of it is that if they don't remember you may not know the difference. que sera sera

 

[Independent]

Thanks for explaining this. I was wondering how the spend down, and shared assets requirements for medicaid were "waived" by the LTCI person.

I don't think the medicaid deals work in PA, KY, or CA - the states I've looked at for family reasons.

It looks to me like CA has a partnership program.

http://www.dhcs.ca.gov/services/ltc/Documents/CPLTC Print Locks/Asset_2010.pdf

 

[Independent]

In one case, the couple has much more tied up in their house in Wisconsin than they'd otherwise have, but it's their way of making sure LTC costs can't impoverish the survivor.

It's an interesting path to walk and I agree with you that some professional help in determining how to handle things might be called for, especially for a couple or someone with a dependent they need to protect.

I'll agree that his is complicated.

Note, however, that WI has a LTCi partnership program:
Wisconsin Senior Issues - Long-Term Care Insurance Partnership Program

 

[athena53]

How would medicaid treat two unrelated folks (since after a divorce that is what they would be) living together?

I think the 5-year look back applies. If you divorced less than 5 years ago they may treat the couple as still married.

 

[meierlde]

I think the 5-year look back applies. If you divorced less than 5 years ago they may treat the couple as still married.

A bit more I found out, Medicaid disregards pre-nups. The advice also says both parties need their own attorneys if they want to go the divorce route.
The main thing that would be lost in a divorce situation is less important with the 5.x million estate tax exemption, the ability to transfer any amount to a spouse at death.

 

[mathjak107]

finally got our policies approved yesterday. almost a 3 month process.

i never knew each and every blood test result is stored on central data bases .

being pre diabetic they saw my last few blood tests had a1c tests over 6.5 ,even though with diet and exercise and no meds i am normal for now and came in normal on their tests i got charged a risk premium.

but at least at this point worrying about trusts and asset shifting is done.

we finally have a comprehensive base in place to our investment pyramid that mitigates the worst damages we can sustain.

 

[Carlos2]

It works for me

Thanks for explaining this. I was wondering how the spend down, and shared assets requirements for medicaid were "waived" by the LTCI person.

I don't think the medicaid deals work in PA, KY, or CA - the states I've looked at for family reasons.

The partnership program that mathjak refers to is in several states. I live in California and have the same asset protection. My wife and I both have policies. We have four years each with comprehensive plan at $200/day with 5% annual compounded inflation protection with a 90 day waitng period. Total cost per month was $303 total for both policies, but we chose a 10 pay to have it fully paid by my retirement at about $5000 per year per policy. This way I won't have to worry about future increases. My plan gives me nursing, assisted and home health care. It also allows for my home to be modified if necessary. With my partnership policy I also get a care coordinator that's included. We have $292,000 worth of benefits that increases every year by 5%. I was 51 when I bought the policy a few years back. I think it's worth it.

 

[SJ1_]

+1
and make sure that that is what the policy actually says. What a salesman
said or didn't say will not matter 30 yrs from now, what is in the policy will.

I was under the impression that there is no such think as a policy that
does not have the premiums go up? and that is one of the main reasons
LTC is a waste

Here is another reason.... who says they will ever pay?

Jim Kramer on his dad.

He bought that long-term care insurance so he could be independent.

When he had a stroke three years ago and needed round-the-clock help, we had to fight those sons of bitches who wrote the policies to get the money they owed him to pay the nurse. I hate those guys because they tried to beat their obligations. We wouldn't let them get away with it, but don't tell Pop, because getting them to keep their word cost us almost as much as what the reimbursement was worth. I won't mention the company's name, but it was a disgrace, and if you have that insurance or your loved ones do, be prepared for them to try to screw you. I hope they won't. But many will try. I know that now.

Jim Cramer on His Dad: ‘Our Last Day Together Was Our Best One’ - TheStreet

 

[razztazz]

That's why LTC and medical insurance in general are the worst for trying to weasel out. The people they are dealing with are almost always incapacitated and cannot keep up with all the intrigue.

 

[mathjak107]

rules for older ltc policies were written like variable annuity products . it was impossible to know what you were going to get paid on or not. there were gray areas everywhere.

our policy is very short ,sweet and fully layed out in english with little exception and or gray areas. you pretty much are going to see the deal right in print today that you get.

when we first looked into ltc insurance a decade ago we dropped the idea because i couldn't figure out exactly what we would get paid on,everything had a but attached.

today that is no longer the case in our policy.