Overtourism

For cruises, I think just by booking a long one of a week or more, you already eliminate a lot of the younger crowd. And we have not done a transatlantic trip, but figure people who still work can't take such a trip. We do not care for luxurious treatments, just some quietness and serenity.

About inexpensive airfare spurring more travel, of course that is a huge factor. I recall doing only road trips in the late 70s. In 1983, when we had a bit more money, when my company sent me to Montreal for a short assignment, I bought tickets for my wife to come up with me. I remember paying about $800 for a RT coach trip, and that's close to $2000 in today's dollar. It was bought on a short notice, but still.
 
A lot of older passengers take a transatlantic and then return on the Cunard line .If another cruise company started doing a regular trip back and forth to Europe they would be booked solid .


I am sorry, but I disagree with you. The transatlantic cruises are "positioning cruises" to move ships from one area of the world to the other. They are extremely low priced just to cover the cost of the ship's sailing. They only do it twice a year in accordance with the seasons
As far as Cunard is concerned, after my experience on a transatlantic cruise on the QE2, you could not get me on another one of Cunard's chips.
 
UnCruise took over most of CruiseWest's ships and refurbished them.



Actually, they're not. Pleasant and basic, all have windows. There's a giant suite on the top deck but I haven't checked it out- way out of my price range. Here's what you get for all the extra $$$:

1. US-flagged vessels. Crew are paid according to American maritime laws. Most have advanced degrees in fields such as Marine Biology. One was able to answer my question about a formation that looked like a caldera: no, it was an island formed after the Cocos plate subducted under another tectonic plate. (She named it but I can't remember it.)

2. ONE dining room but very good food, locally sourced, mostly prepared from scratch. Vegetarian options always good. Alcohol included.

3. Fellow passengers- generally successful but low-key. No fancy dress night. Leave your egos and your bling at home.

4. Everything but the tips included and tips really are voluntary. Kayak or paddleboard any time you want if the boat is at anchor. Excursions are included except for one snorkeling expedition in Alaska where I paid $120 to cover the cost of a wet suit heavy enough to withstand the 42-degree waters.

5. One park in Costa Rica (Manuel Antonio) limits the number of people in the park and everyone else has to wait in line; there were so few of us we were able to just take skiffs to the shore and go in. We don't overwhelm sites and we can get into smaller places the big ships can't reach.

6. The captain has a lot of leeway- if there's a pod of whales hanging around the ship for 3 hours, well, we stop. If a particular passage that isn't usually navigable is open, we take it.

7. So much activity- hiking, kayaking, swimming- I never gain weight despite the excellent food and drink.

It isn't for everyone who's expecting a room with a "verandah" and butler service for that price but it's exactly my style.



Sounds great to me! None of the stuff we don’t really enjoy - formal nights, Vegas style entertainment, etc. - and lots of learning and experiencing the journey. Thanks for this information.
 
I'm currently reading a book by Bill Bryson, "Neither Here Nor There", published in 1992. The premise is that he replicates the travels he did as a backpacker when he got out of college, which would have been the early 70s, though no date is mentioned.

A few pages into the Florence chapter, he has some prescient observations.

"It is of course hypocritical to rail against tourists when you are one yourself, but nonetheless mass tourism is ruining the very thing it comes to celebrate. And it can only get worse as the Japanese and other rich Asians become bolder travelers. When you add in the tens of millions of Eastern Europeans who are free at last to go where they want, we could be looking back on the last thirty years as the golden age of travel. God help us all."

As I have traveled, internationally since 1980, I've observed the over tourism environment mentioned. It influences my travel decisions, whether it's when and where to go or how to get there. God help us all...
 
I took a very brief look at the Uncruise site and stopped after seeing the cost. It looks very pricey. For example, a 10 day cruise would be something like $14000 for a couple. Or $1400/day and (I think) not including airfare to/from.

I estimate we spend maybe $500/day in Europe doing travel on our own (no extended tours) and that includes airfare from the West Coast. A Rick Steves tour in Europe might be around $650/day (not including airfare).

Did I miss something in this pricing comparison? I know that price is not everything but about 3x more seems a lot.
 
Souschef, yes repositioning cruises are great bargains. 1500 for 13 days on RC.
 
I took a very brief look at the Uncruise site and stopped after seeing the cost. It looks very pricey. For example, a 10 day cruise would be something like $14000 for a couple. Or $1400/day and (I think) not including airfare to/from.

Did I miss something in this pricing comparison? I know that price is not everything but about 3x more seems a lot.

It's expensive, all right. I get $750 off per person after having done 4 cruises with them, and another $500 if I put a $750 deposit down on a cruise (any in 2 years, don't need to commit to one) while on an earlier cruise. There are virtually no extras- just the tip. Alcohol is included. Food is better (compared to what I've read about Main Dining Room food) and crew are paid according to US labor law- most vessels are US- flagged. That's important to me. There are also no real "shopping expedition" ports so they get no kickbacks from Diamonds, International, Tanzanite International and the like.

A different style, but it suits me.
 
I took a very brief look at the Uncruise site and stopped after seeing the cost. It looks very pricey. For example, a 10 day cruise would be something like $14000 for a couple. Or $1400/day and (I think) not including airfare to/from.

I estimate we spend maybe $500/day in Europe doing travel on our own (no extended tours) and that includes airfare from the West Coast. A Rick Steves tour in Europe might be around $650/day (not including airfare).

Did I miss something in this pricing comparison? I know that price is not everything but about 3x more seems a lot.

$500 a day for how many people?
 
I took a very brief look at the Uncruise site and stopped after seeing the cost. It looks very pricey. For example, a 10 day cruise would be something like $14000 for a couple. Or $1400/day and (I think) not including airfare to/from.

I estimate we spend maybe $500/day in Europe doing travel on our own (no extended tours) and that includes airfare from the West Coast. A Rick Steves tour in Europe might be around $650/day (not including airfare).

Did I miss something in this pricing comparison? I know that price is not everything but about 3x more seems a lot.

That’s the main way we blow our dough, LOL! Haven’t been on an Uncruise trip yet, but we plan to do one soon. Meanwhile, National Geographic has hit our pocket book just as hard.
 
There are also no real "shopping expedition" ports so they get no kickbacks from Diamonds, International, Tanzanite International and the like.

I remember a Sicily tour I took with Rich Steves many years ago. At that time they included all breakfasts and 1/2 the lunches and dinners (now it's 1/2 dinners only). Alcohol and 'extra' drinks were not included. But.... our tour guide informed us that some of the gift shops in the museums we visited had passed a kickback to him. Since RS does not allow this, his solution was to buy us all wine, after dinner beverages at a few dinners, and the occasional gelato.
 
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Well that is for 50 people on a bus. ;)

Correction ... for 2 old folks who are not into saving every last dollar but like a good deal.

So nice sit down meal just about every meal?
 
So nice sit down meal just about every meal?

Yes. Why do you ask? Is this surprisingly low or too high?

The last Europe trip we took was in 2017 to the Netherlands and Germany/Austria. It was 28 days and my totals show $415/day. Let's say I left something out and it was $450/day (includes airfare).

We do our own trip planning and on that trip did not take any real tours. Just a bike tour for a day. We stayed at nice hotels and one VRBO in Vienna. Restaurant meals as DW wants a real vacation from the kitchen.
 
Wow! This thread is stressing me out! Not just the prices on "nice" cruises, but the endless hoards at sites.

We nixed our big mediterranean trip planned for next month. I stressed out over the logistics. Although I traveled a bit for w*rk, I had handlers to keep me out of serious trouble. This is a different animal and I didn't just want to get on a bus or pay tons to a tour operator. I wanted to DYI, but maybe I just don't have the planning chops or maybe I don't want to go badly enough. Perhaps was spared one of the hotter summers in Europe.

So, we replaced the Med with SW USA. Well, we're not going on that either. We always drive and neither of us are feeling it. We might actually be UNDER budget this year!

We get out on the Big Lake a couple of times a week. On weekdays, we barely see anyone, especially out on the water. If you ignore the $10 mil homes poking above the trees on shore, it seems like a near wilderness setting. Ahhhh... I'm relaxing now.

We only have couple of more months of decent weather though. Come Jan/Feb were definitely hitting the road seeking the sun and warmth.
 
Yes. Why do you ask? Is this surprisingly low or too high?

The last Europe trip we took was in 2017 to the Netherlands and Germany/Austria. It was 28 days and my totals show $415/day. Let's say I left something out and it was $450/day (includes airfare).

We do our own trip planning and on that trip did not take any real tours. Just a bike tour for a day. We stayed at nice hotels and one VRBO in Vienna. Restaurant meals as DW wants a real vacation from the kitchen.


Probably not too high or low if you're having nice meals with wine for lunch and dinner.
 
Our trips to Poland have been much cheaper than Italy. In 2007 we spent 8k going to the Tuscany region of Italy for 2 weeks. We ate a nice dinner with wine. Breakfast was free at the hotel. Hotel was average. We only took a few tours, did rent a car and brought home a few Xmas gifts for friends but nothing expensive. Airfare back then was more expensive.
 
I should note again that our criteria for travel is first and foremost to have a good time and satisfy our curiosity. The costs are somewhat secondary.
 
Lsb, we don’t go on a trip and then be cheap and not do what we want to. No point to traveling if you do it that way.
 
Wow! This thread is stressing me out! Not just the prices on "nice" cruises, but the endless hoards at sites.

We nixed our big mediterranean trip planned for next month. I stressed out over the logistics. Although I traveled a bit for w*rk, I had handlers to keep me out of serious trouble. This is a different animal and I didn't just want to get on a bus or pay tons to a tour operator. I wanted to DYI, but maybe I just don't have the planning chops or maybe I don't want to go badly enough. Perhaps was spared one of the hotter summers in Europe.

So, we replaced the Med with SW USA. Well, we're not going on that either. We always drive and neither of us are feeling it. We might actually be UNDER budget this year!

We get out on the Big Lake a couple of times a week. On weekdays, we barely see anyone, especially out on the water. If you ignore the $10 mil homes poking above the trees on shore, it seems like a near wilderness setting. Ahhhh... I'm relaxing now.

We only have couple of more months of decent weather though. Come Jan/Feb were definitely hitting the road seeking the sun and warmth.

I have never taken a tour. I always planned my own itinerary, booked my own lodgings, bought my own train and bus tickets for transportation, and recently drove my own rented car for many thousand kilometers. Had a wonderful time, even when I drove in circle around the confusing and crowded city centers because Google Map got confused (and there were more times when I was the one getting all confused).

And when I took to RV'ing, I had never been in one, or knew someone who owned one to hold my hand. And I figured it all out, such as installing the tow bar myself to pull a car behind.

The Web is my friend, and countless hours of surfin' tell me what I need to know. It's fun too.
 
We are in our late 60's. We have not done many cruises since retiring. They don't often go where we want to go, and when they do there is not enough time for us and far too many people in the area. Nor do we want to stay in a standard hotel room cabin for days on end, come back from a crowded shore tour for our roast beef dinner at a cost of missing out on the local charms, culture, food, etc.

After many years of very structured/organized business travel most of our travel is spontaneous. We sometimes book end with flights but in between is usually only booked 3-5 days in advance. We avoid the tourist traps and for some more popular spots we only visit on shoulder season. We do two longer trips a year, 2-3 months each. Next month we fly east to visit relatives for a week then fly to Athens. Seven weeks later we fly home from London. London is a great hub. We did not have our itinerary sketched out but this works well. Besides, the airfare was incredible. Plus, we only travel with a 20" carry on roller each. Everyone we know heads south to Arizona, Florida, TX, HI etc. but this is not for us.

No tours yet though we will occasionally take tours with locals. I may do my first group tour to India in the near future. Mys spouse is not keen to go so I may sign up for a 2 week tour plus a week of independent travel either before or after.

Travel is not as expensive as one might imagine. We tend to stay in smaller family owned hotels or B&B's. The trick is not to expect to always stay in 4/5/6 star US style hotels and eat where and what the locals do. Every year in Thailand we see people spending bags of money to stay in large hotels and eat western meals without every eating the fabulous local food. So instead of paying $15 for a wonderful meal for two they spend as much as $40 for a few very mediocre hamburgers etc at some 'hip' place that caters to foreigners. Why even bother going? Exact same, different cost, in Europe.

How do we select. We have our favourites in the winter...Thailand, Vietnam and Europe the fall...Greece, Italy, Croatia, Turkey, Spain, Portugal, where ever really. Selecting really comes down to a convoluted intersection of our respective bucket lists, currency, weather, flight costs or routes, etc. And always very much subject to great last minute travel offers that we do not want to pass up.

We changed our lifestyle. Downsized to a home that is lock and leave. No pets, no plants. HOA does all the gardening and snow removal. Kind neighbour checks the house. Everything possible has been moved to the web instead of hard copy mail.

It is not for everyone and perhaps it is a crazy way to travel at our age. But this is what we are doing for now....already discussing the winter trip even though the Sept/Oct trip needs some work.
 
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After many years of organized tours, DW had an inspiration. We have the itineraries from these travel companies, why not do it at our own pace.
We did this in Switzerland, where we bought a Bernese Oberland rail pass. We used it so much the ink got worn off. One day when we knew the Jungfrau was socked in, we marveled at the number of people taking the train up to the top. Why? because it was on their schedule. We just waited until the next day when it cleared up.
When we toured New Mexico, also using an itinerary from a travel company, we again did it at our own pace. The funniest part, was when we had just finished lunch at a restaurant in Chimayo, a busload from the tour showed. How long do you think those 40 people had to wait for lunch?
 
After many years of organized tours, DW had an inspiration. We have the itineraries from these travel companies, why not do it at our own pace.
We did this in Switzerland, where we bought a Bernese Oberland rail pass. We used it so much the ink got worn off. One day when we knew the Jungfrau was socked in, we marveled at the number of people taking the train up to the top. Why? because it was on their schedule. We just waited until the next day when it cleared up.
When we toured New Mexico, also using an itinerary from a travel company, we again did it at our own pace. The funniest part, was when we had just finished lunch at a restaurant in Chimayo, a busload from the tour showed. How long do you think those 40 people had to wait for lunch?
I suspect it was prearranged, and they went to a special seating area that handles tour groups. It’s a large restaurant.

However, my idea of a nightmare is sitting down to lunch with 40 people at a restaurant. Hate large group restaurant dining.
 
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