Poll:Post-vaccination antibody test?

[Sanstar]

Second dose of Moderna was Feb 11. Donated blood last Tuesday. Blood bank lab test for COVID antibodies is reported: HIGH-pos.

 

[martyp]

I would want to do it but only as part of a vaccine manufacturer’s follow up research. They would do the appropriate tests. It is important information. I would trust and appreciate the results.

 

[Alan]

I would want to do it but only as part of a vaccine manufacturer’s follow up research. They would do the appropriate tests. It is important information. I would trust and appreciate the results.

+1

There was a news item on the radio yesterday that this may well be something that will be done in the UK in the coming months to help inform how long the protection from vaccines last. In May or June last year my sister's husband took an antibody test at the invitation of the Office of National Statistics (ONS) as they were doing research into how many folks may have caught Covid in the first 3 months of 2020 when very little testing was being done. (He had been to see the GP in February with symptoms that could have been Covid - the antibody test was negative, and in fact he did get Covid later that year in December)

The ONS does randomized PCR Covid testing of 30,000 people every month to get an idea of the prevalence of it in the community, so I would expect they would be given this task of testing and statistical analysis on antibodies in vaccinated people.

 

[Alan]

The ONS just announced results from their antibody testing.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-56576094

Covid: Half of UK has antibodies from vaccination or infection

The study is conducted by taking blood from a representative sample of people around the UK to estimate what proportion of the whole population has antibodies.
By 14 March, an estimated 55% of people in England had antibodies, 51% in Wales, 49% in Northern Ireland and 43% in Scotland.
Vast majority retain Covid antibodies six months on
But among the over-65s, who are most likely to have been vaccinated, roughly 90% had antibodies.

 

[braumeister]

The ONS just announced results from their antibody testing.

Covid: Half of UK has antibodies from vaccination or infection

So I think that means you're probably farther along towards herd immunity than anywhere else in Europe, doesn't it?

 

[MichaelB]

The ONS just announced results from their antibody testing.

Covid: Half of UK has antibodies from vaccination or infection

That’s really good news.

 

[Alan]

So I think that means you're probably farther along towards herd immunity than anywhere else in Europe, doesn't it?

Most certainly. Over half the adult population has had at least 1 shot, most of those being over age 50.

It’s particularly good to see such a high percentage of the over 65s that have antibodies.

 

[sengsational]

Memory B and T Cells

I'm no doctor, nor have I played one on TV, but aren't antibodies just one aspect of how protected one is from acquiring disease?

From what I understand, if you showed zero antibodies on the "perfect" antibody test, you still could quickly generate a robust immune response and so have an asymptomatic or very mild case of the disease. It seems that the result of an antibody test isn't very actionable because if you show no antibodies, it could be because they've faded, or because you never had them. I suppose there is some value if you do show antibodies, proving you've had a vaccine (but you'd already know that), or if you've had the disease (most people would already know that too). For me, if other people like me showed an antibody response to the vaccine in the trials, that's good enough for me.

I will be the first to admit I'm in the weeds here, because everything I know, I've learned on youtube

 

[Alan]

I'm no doctor, nor have I played one on TV, but aren't antibodies just one aspect of how protected one is from acquiring disease?

From what I understand, if you showed zero antibodies on the "perfect" antibody test, you still could quickly generate a robust immune response and so have an asymptomatic or very mild case of the disease. It seems that the result of an antibody test isn't very actionable because if you show no antibodies, it could be because they've faded, or because you never had them. I suppose there is some value if you do show antibodies, proving you've had a vaccine (but you'd already know that), or if you've had the disease (most people would already know that too). For me, if other people like me showed an antibody response to the vaccine in the trials, that's good enough for me.

I will be the first to admit I'm in the weeds here, because everything I know, I've learned on youtube

As I say above, one of the main aims of the surveys is to see how long the antibodies stay in the system after vaccination. The oldest folks in the UK received their first shots in early December so having plenty of antibodies 4 months later is good news.

 

[sengsational]

As I say above, one of the main aims of the surveys is to see how long the antibodies stay in the system after vaccination. The oldest folks in the UK received their first shots in early December so having plenty of antibodies 4 months later is good news.

I'm depending on people taking part in those valuable studies, and it's certainly good news that the antibodies tend to hang around for a while. The studies allow me to presume my level of antibodies is similar, thus letting me answer "nope" to the poll.

 

[ncbill]

"...health experts say antibody tests — the tests designed to detect proteins created by the immune system that protect against the virus — are not necessary and can be unreliable.

'Don’t try to second-guess the vaccine. Just get vaccinated,' said Sarah Fortune, chair of the department of immunology and infectious diseases at Harvard’s T.H. Chan School of Public Health."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/2021/02/12/covid-vaccine-antibody-test/

 

[Alan]

I'm depending on people taking part in those valuable studies, and it's certainly good news that the antibodies tend to hang around for a while. The studies allow me to presume my level of antibodies is similar, thus letting me answer "nope" to the poll.

I also voted “no” on the poll.

My “+1” above was agreeing with martyp’s post saying that I would take a test only if part of a controlled survey by experts because I believe these studies are important.

 

[JoeWras]

Well, well, well, surprise of surprise. I tested positive for antibodies after my last donation. This comes on the heels of a note from the center saying the test won't detect antibodies from the vaccine. However, they were thinking of changing the test and perhaps they did.

First Moderna shot on 3/13. Neg test on 3/15. Pos test on 3/29.

 

[Aerides]

I'm no doctor, nor have I played one on TV, but aren't antibodies just one aspect of how protected one is from acquiring disease?

Exactly. Antibodies are the obvious/common/testable thing, but they aren't the only thing - and there are plenty of anecdotes of people who actually had covid but don't show positive. T-cells, other things. The body has a whole arsenal of immune response.

So my non-technical understanding is:
Antibodies = Yes
No Antibodies = Not no!

 

[Alan]

So my non-technical understanding is:
Antibodies = Yes
No Antibodies = Not no!

Great summary

Last week I watched a good BBC Panorama documentary called “Who got it right.” that looked at various countries and regions within countries who had done a good job in controlling the spread of the disease to see what tactics they used.

For Sweden they interviewed some experts there who said after their tactic of not closing down and going for herd immunity they did a big survey in November/December last year that only showed 12-14% of the population as having antibodies present. Unfortunately this was a harbinger of what was to come because Covid ripped through them at many times the rate of their first wave and at 1.3k deaths per 100k they ended up much worse off than their Nordic neighbours Norway and Denmark.

 

[JoeWras]

Well, well, well, surprise of surprise. I tested positive for antibodies after my last donation.

Turns out that Monday, the day I donated, was the first day they changed to a test that detects either a natural or vaccine induced antibody response. I happen to be one of the first to be processed by the new test.

Test works. Vaccine works. I'm happy.

 

[bmcgonig]

This doctor is a great follow on Twitter. She addresses T cells and memory B cells a lot. The latter in this set of tweets. She feels that they both will help us far into the future.

“ 32 people born before 1915 who had been exposed to 1918 flu. Nearly 90 years later (this paper published in 2008), they found circulating B cells that could generate potent neutralizing antibodies to the 1918 strain of flu (by the way, the influenza virus mutates WAY faster than coronavirus)”

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1377367577878388737.html